morals

[Yvonne G]

Seems to me that we (humans) are getting more relaxed in our moral code. I'm not saying that we should stay in the dark ages or have the morals of the Elizabethan period, but I think as a whole, we're really getting too relaxed in what is ok and what is not.

TV shows never used to be able to use "cuss" words. Now it is quite common to hear them on any channel, even the regular network shows. So instead of maintaining our high moral standards, we are lowering the bar. It is no longer frowned upon to have a baby out of wed-lock. It is not longer considered wrong to live together outside of marriage. And people can say any old cuss word they feel like saying at any time in any place.

I'm not a prude, but I think that when we get our kids accustomed to hearing "sh.." F..", etc. on TV, its just a hop, skip and a jump for them to start using that kind of language too.

I don't like it at all. I think we should keep our moral code in place, up high and stop lowering the bar.

 

[Redfoot NERD]

AMEN! Literally...

Terry K

 

[Isa]

Very true Yvonne, you are so right. I often wonder ''in what kind of society are we going'' (can you say that in english? I am not sure but we can say that in french)
Exept that my fiance and I bought a house before getting married but we are getting married in 3 months, so it makes it ok right? .

 

[alfiethetortoise]

I agree with some of what your saying Yvonne. But unfortunately real life doesn't follow an absolute set of moral codes. I had a baby out ouf wedlock and it wasen't out of my own personal choice. But the reality, perhaps i would have been married and miserable and i certainly would have wound up divorced at some point. I also know of a lesbian couple who adopted a little boy with many problems who would otherwise been in and out of care his whole life, or would have waited years to get his typical 'mum/dad' in a nice house with four windows and an apple tree in the yard. Attitudes and societies change and evolve. Not all of it is bad.

I totally agree though that many people are too laid back and this reflects on morals. Laid back here is becoming an excuse for bone idle behaviour towards others. In my oppinion, it isn't good enough.

 

[dmmj]

who's moral code are we talking about, I never considered cussing a moral issue myself, more of a society or good manners issue.Remember most "cuss" words are actually acronyms to describe something else, such as the S word it is actually from civil war times when they use to transport manure for fuel they used to stamp "Ship In High Transit" so they eventually just shortened it. Same thing with the F word. I follow my own moral compass myself

 

[harris]

Personally, I'm more concerned about a young one's disregard for life. The video games today are so realistic it looks like you're shooting down an actual person. Growing up on that, I imagine it becomes hard for some to seperate that from reality. It's already there really. It used to be a real shocker when the headline of the news is about a 13 year old killing a person or two. Now you don't hear about it until the middle of the program and you really don't even bat an eyelash at it. Talk about relaxed.

 

[DoctorCosmonaut]

I'm not sure if people really cuss anymore now than they did before. I think sailors have always talked like sailors. Maybe there is more exposure? But I think if you went to London in the 19th Century you would be shocked by some of the moral behavior you would be exposed to. Opium dens, drunken people, feces (and people pooping) in the streets, prostitutes down the alley ways, etc. Its all sort of relative in my opinion. I get what you are saying, but I think we might be fooling our selves in upholding the past.

 

[terryo]

Ah Yvonne....the good old days. It's never going to get better....but as Brooke said some good has come from it. My son lived with a girl and they had a baby....the girl died, and he brought him to me when he was two days old. I adopted him and raised him as my own, and he is the joy of my life. He is my son.
I watch comedians on cable, and I can't find anything funny about some of them....everything out of their mouth is so filthy, and every other word is f... And as Jordan said all these things went on since the beginning of time. Now we have TV..radio..Internet...etc. and everything is just more out in the open so it becomes acceptable....Unfortunately.

 

[Stephanie Logan]

OK, OK, what a great chance to plug the Bill Bryson book The Mother Tongue: English and How It Got That Way. The chapter on cuss words will having laughing so hard you might wet yourself, to use a popular euphemism!

I am a political liberal but a social conservative. For the last 22 years, I have been the ONLY mom in the neighborhood/school/world who does not let her kids ______________ (fill in the blank with one of the following: watch R-rated movies, watch garbage TV shows where teens have sex every time they brush their teeth, watch other garbage TV shows where people entertain their viewers by antics as coarse and sadistic as they can get away with, stay out past MY curfew, have a cell phone before high school, attend parties where I don't know or don't trust the parents to supervise, have a passenger in their car, or listen to the radio, within the first six months of licensing, talk on a cell phone in the car without pulling over first, hang out at malls, have money without earning it...you get the idea.) We also have had our kids do regular chores (daily and weekly) since they were six. They ALWAYS say "please" and "thank you" and answer the phone "Logan residence, Brock speaking".

What drives me batty is when people compliment my kids but then say, "How do you ever get them to do/be/say that?" And I try to answer with a politely euphemistic variation of "We train them through endless, consistent, sometimes mind-boggling repetition till these things come automatically, and we praise them to reinforce good behaviors that we want them to make habits out of." It's not magic, but it is very hard to do when so many parents are more interested in appeasing their toddler/child/adolescent/teenager than in investing the huge amount of time and effort it takes to do it well. Then when the kid is 17 and a total maniac, ruling the household and extorting from his/her parents and siblings, the parents wonder why they just can't seem to manage their little angel, when they always have been so kind and given the child everything he/she wants!

Sorry if I sound smug, I don't mean to. I still have two kids at home, and my youngest has certainly given me a run for my money since his sweet tiny feet hit the delivery table! He is a good kid by most standards, though, as well he should be with such excellent role models in his older siblings.

I do agree with Terryo though, that the "good old days", at least as a historian sees the big picture, never existed. You give me any "good old" decade and three good things about it, and I'll remind you of 4-6 "bad" realities that existed simultaneously.

 

[Jacqui]

I am finding this thread interesting, as it shows how different each of our standards are and where some of us place the lines crossing them.

I know a few cuss words (or what I think of as lower level ones) are ok with me, but once you get saying too many then I can't help but say, "Watch your language" to whomever is talking. I am always complaining to my husband, how I dislike the fact that folks (TV, movies, CB, ect..,) don't seem to think they can talk, if they don't sprinkle in the swear words. Like I tell him, sprinkle them in and I start tuning out.

I would much rather see folks living together, mixed races or single sex couples, and/or having children out of wedlock, then folks living in bad marriages just because of "moral codes". How does that help the children or the people involved at all? Or folks back "hiding in the closet" and feeling they had to lie to everybody.

I guess I go with the comment about people no longer holding the life of other's as valuable or the ease with which folks can lie and cheat, (especially it seems those who try to "show off" their high moral values and so call christian followings), those are the areas which really get to me.

Sorry, but I don't think the good ole days were really all that much better.

 

[Kadaan]

I'm not sure if it's more prevalent, or just more publicized. I definitely agree that there's more sex/cussing on TV than there was 10 years ago, but I don't know if that correlates to more sex/cussing in real life. The 70's were known for sex/drugs, so did the 'moral code' go up in the 80's?

The other thing is that many morals are based on cultural/societal norms. For example, what makes a cuss word a cuss word? Why is "dang it" generally considered acceptable when "damn it" isn't, when they're basically the same thing? Why is having a child out of wedlock considered immoral, but adopting a child outside of wedlock generally isn't as long as the child is being cared for? In other countries, different things are considered immoral. We don't think twice about seeing a woman in a skirt, but in the middle east you'd be scorned for showing your shoulders/neck/ankles. Does that mean the higher bar is better and we should encourage 100% skin coverage? Who gets to decide what "too low" and "too high" are?

 

[terracolson]

Oh wow... I fell i should chime in being I am 28, raise in a christian home and know that all the above issue Yvonne has mentioned are 100% true.

Do i wish i was stricter on my life style, maybe, but its not like i can just change!

Cursing i do try to control, but the wedlock issue...

I was diagnosed infertile when i was 16, so when me and my boyfriend made the commitment to each other to be with only each other, bam I got pregnant!! WHAT!! I am 25 years old, married divorced, (yeah, you didnt mention the divorce rate issue), I have never ever used birth control but i only have a option to abort, adopt or have. Of course being diagnoise infertile makes me believe this is my miracle baby, but marriage now? (actually sex before marriage is wrong to, but you didnt mention it) Its been 5 years and we are planning on getting married this year, we wanted to be sure it was right. Getting married just because of a child, thats what made divorce so common. (my mother and aunt did that and divorced)

So i am a poor example of a christian, but i am, and i live with my boyfriend and our child, working on making this better.
I teach my son, by verbal expression that drugs are bad, smoking is bad, sex before marraige is bad and making babies before your married is bad. My example may not be the best, but i can explain that to him later.

Not sure where to say my morals are by your scale, but i feel that i am a great loveing person, who cares deeply for our elderly community and will sacrafice my life for my family or God

I know what i am living in is incorrect, but i cant just ruffle my nose and it change.

My hubby is a pot smoker, i feel that is wrong, but he has a prescription and its 100% legal.
(thats a whole different topic) but its part of my world, i have to deal with, and all i can do is tell him he stinks and refuse to kiss him...
I dont even know how i feel about the legalization. Is that a bad moral thing, or did God intend that plant for the cancer patients


not sure i said anything important, but i atleast put some input in.

I wish i could just record my self and post it on here!!

 

[dmmj]

I just want to know who's moral code do we follow? judeo christian? muslim? sharia? society? jewish? if I left anyone out I am sorry.

 

[Weloveourtortoise]

I was not going to comment-- will make it short-- Like dmmj-- which moral compass are we to follow??? And to cover sex, babies and living together before marriage--- That is a Christian / Puritan notion. Go back 100 years ago-- morals were very different than 50 years ago -- nevermind 500 years ago, 1000 years ago 3000 years ago. Atleast we teach our children that drugs are bad and actually have laws against physical abuse and rape.
-Bonnie

 

[chadk]

sOK, forget morals and Absolute Truth vs moral relativism and all that. That is too deep and philosophical and won't get anywhere in this post.

I think another way to approach the topic is based on specific issues already touched on. And look at it from a social and cultural perspective. And yes, there is certainly moral decay compared to times past. But like others have said, it wasn't all roses either. Slavery comes to mind... But I would bet things like manners, respecting your elders, common decency, etc have definately gone way down hill. A sailor may have always had a bad mouth, but he would watch him self closely around women and children for example. Not so much now days... And all the nastiness mentioned above in the nasty parts of london were isolated to specific places... like red light districts we might call them now. In small towns and family neighborhoods, that would be un-acceptable. Now it pours into our TVs and magazine racks at the grocery store for ratings and $$$.

I'm in the same boat as Stephanie. I raise my kids with the values my wife and I esteem: humility, putting others first, respecting those around you, and so forth. It is hard work and many parents just aren't up for it and\or just don't know how.

 

[Yvonne G]

... answer the phone "Logan residence, Brock speaking".

I'll bet telephone callers are pretty surprised when they realize it really isn't "Brock" that's speaking!!

 

[ChiKat]

who's moral code are we talking about, I never considered cussing a moral issue myself, more of a society or good manners issue.Remember most "cuss" words are actually acronyms to describe something else, such as the S word it is actually from civil war times when they use to transport manure for fuel they used to stamp "Ship In High Transit" so they eventually just shortened it. Same thing with the F word. I follow my own moral compass myself

I agree with this and I've tried to explain it to my mom many times but she doesn't understand. She was raised EXTREMELY conservatively and religiously. I always tell her I don't understand how "oh sh*t!" is so much worse than "oh shoot!"
But I have weird views about almost everything, you'll find
(don't even get me started on our differing views of alcohol consumption )

watch garbage TV shows where teens have sex every time they brush their teeth

haha you always make me laugh

 

[chadk]

LOL - like they'd show teens actually brushing their teeth!!

 

[webskipper]

I'm worried about todays "children of the electronic age".

Kids or young adults, text rather than actually speak, they carry a game with them to keep the occupied, movies and tv are perceived as reality, pirating movies, girls have their own electronic friends, all this to avoid human interaction.

Mom and Dad, Dad and Dad, Mom and Mom, used the tv as a babysitter.

The inability to interact affects the way people react to each other. Book smart means nothing when the person is unable to relate their feelings or speak out without going postal.

Yeah, cuss words are just a lazy way to express feelings.

FYI- the taste of soap probably hasn't changed much since I came home from school and flung the f-word around like an empty rum bottle, and I was four.

 

[Shelly]

Kids or young adults, text rather than actually speak, they carry a game with them to keep the occupied, movies and tv are perceived as reality, pirating movies, girls have their own electronic friends, all this to avoid human interaction.

Amen. You have just described my 18 year old boy. His inability to communicate face to face in an open dialog is of great concern to me. His whole life is the computer, his cell phone and his IPod. He's a good kid, but talking openly to his parents is probably the most painful thing he has to do.

As far as cussing goes, I feel swear words DO have a place in language, if used sparingly. A good swear word is simply a way to add an exclamation point to whatever you are saying. Overused, swearing becomes very tiresome.

One way I feel our morality as a nation has dramatically improved is in the area of discrimination against racial minorities and homosexuals. Years ago, people may have (arguably) had cleaner language, but they also murdered Emmett Till for smiling at a white woman. Nothing moral about that.

Too often, morality is viewed as an issue that relates only to sex. True morality is a rare wider ranging issue, to be sure.