Bought wrong tortoise. Options?

[SaltLakeSulcata]

Please be kind - I have never owned a pet.

Don't want to get lost in details -- I really think the sulcata was the wrong pet for us at this point in time.

My 11-yo wanted a pet and we bought a 4 month old sulcata from our local pet store in the first week of January of this year.

Is there an option for someone else taking the tortoise before it dies under our (lack of proper) care? Is it customary to pay the person who is willing to assume responsibility for our unfortunately nonsupportive choices?

As far as the tortoise's health -- it has gotten less and less active as the weeks go by. We have been soaking it and it was pooping for a couple weeks. Then it started to lose interest in eating and pooping has been less frequent, unless it is pooping in its enclosure and I don't notice.

I've searched through the threads here on tortoise forum -- just so many variables, and with my lack of experience on top of how scared I am of killing the little guy, I just think ... if someone else was able to rehabilitate it in an already-established environment. I feel really strongly that this is just not something we are going to be able to pull off in time to save this tortoise's life!

TIA for any options for relocating our friend!

 

[Noelluene]

Can we get some photos of his enclosure? What have you been feeding him? What temperature is he being kept at?

Unfortunately, it isn't uncommon for people to buy pets before realising the commitment they are making, you are trying to give him the best possible chance, so beat yourself up over it. Although I don't know what I would do in your situation since I'm unfamiliar with the animal services in the US, looking for help on this forum is probably a right step.

 

[wellington]

As last resort take it back to the store and explain what happened before he dies. Hopefully they can save him.
He has to have a basking temp of 95-100
All over temp of 80 day and night. Without these he will not survive.

 

[wellington]

Always do research before getting any animal!

 

[Jacqui]

Perhaps a rescue or tortoise person in your area would take it on, if you are not wanting to keep trying.

 

[Lyn W]

If you follow this up to date caresheet your tort will stand a good chance of thriving...........

The Best Way To Raise A Sulcata, Leopard, Or Star Tortoise

I chose the title of this care sheet very carefully. Are there other ways to raise babies? Yes. Yes there are, but those ways are not as good. What follows is the BEST way, according to 30 years of research and experimentation with hundreds of babies of many species. Babies hatch during the...

tortoiseforum.org

If it's a case of not wanting what will eventually be a very large tortoise then maybe the store will swap it for one of the smaller species, but you need to look at the caresheets here in the Species Specific section first to see which best suits your circumstances.

 

[Maggie3fan]

I'm not gonna beat you up over this...but you need to read the care sheet and try to change what you can for him right now so he lives. So while we try and help you find a new home for him, let's get together and try to save his life. I'm always inclined to take the unwanted ones...can you tell us a bit about how you are keeping him? Maybe a photo?

 

[Tidgy's Dad]

I agree with all of the above.
Temperature is usually the most important factor in these situations.

 

[Tom]

Please be kind - I have never owned a pet.

Don't want to get lost in details -- I really think the sulcata was the wrong pet for us at this point in time.

My 11-yo wanted a pet and we bought a 4 month old sulcata from our local pet store in the first week of January of this year.

Is there an option for someone else taking the tortoise before it dies under our (lack of proper) care? Is it customary to pay the person who is willing to assume responsibility for our unfortunately nonsupportive choices?

As far as the tortoise's health -- it has gotten less and less active as the weeks go by. We have been soaking it and it was pooping for a couple weeks. Then it started to lose interest in eating and pooping has been less frequent, unless it is pooping in its enclosure and I don't notice.

I've searched through the threads here on tortoise forum -- just so many variables, and with my lack of experience on top of how scared I am of killing the little guy, I just think ... if someone else was able to rehabilitate it in an already-established environment. I feel really strongly that this is just not something we are going to be able to pull off in time to save this tortoise's life!

TIA for any options for relocating our friend!

We aren't here to beat people up. We are here to help. You are trying to do the right thing. That is admirable.

Until you find a home, can we help get the environment correct? We'll try help help find cheap and easy ways to make some improvements that will make a difference. Let start with pics of the enclosure, what you think the temperatures might be, and what you are using for heating and lighting.

 

[SaltLakeSulcata]

Can we get some photos of his enclosure? What have you been feeding him? What temperature is he being kept at?

Unfortunately, it isn't uncommon for people to buy pets before realising the commitment they are making, you are trying to give him the best possible chance, so beat yourself up over it. Although I don't know what I would do in your situation since I'm unfamiliar with the animal services in the US, looking for help on this forum is probably a right step.

Thank you. I appreciate your support. I will have to figure out how to upload photos. I feel overwhelmed by all of the things, and just am afraid the little tortoise won't survive until I figure it all out.

I have read the fact sheet on raising young sulcata- posted here in turtle forum. Humidity and heat are ok but not fantastic. In the daytime I sometimes achieve 80 degrees and 80 percent humidity. In the night it is between 60-70 degrees and humidity around 70 percent or so.i just worry that the large fluctuations in conditions are stressful for the tortoise. (It's name is Squash, which I don't like. My son's friend named it.)

I have already read and looked at ways to improve the conditions. I just feel I can't make the modifications quickly enough to sustain the tortoise's health.

Because, on top of making adjustments to the enclosure, there is the food issue. A variety of specific foods, none of which I know where to obtain locally, and no confidence in how else to grow them myself or obtain them in some other way. The pet store said romaine and other grocery store greens. But I read here to give it grass and all these specialty lettuces, which I might be able to find at specialty groceries when I have time to go searching.

As I said, it is just overwhelming. I think the animal is getting by for now. It does move around some, it does eat and drink -- just not as much as I have read is normal for it. And the lack of poop -- or me seeing the poop -- is a big concern.

Maybe it is supposed to sleep a lot. It often falls asleep, half in and half out of its water dish. Maybe I am just overreacting. Maybe it can live in these conditions for another month while I slowly improve its conditions.

But if I have an option of moving it elsewhere, that is my preference. I would like to prepare a better enclosure, maybe get a new pet that is more suitable for my climate.

I'll muddle through and be grateful for my tortoise's resilience while I figure it out. But if I can find a new home for it in a decent time frame, I think that would be better for everyone.

 

[Yvonne G]

I'm pretty sure his environment isn't suitable and that's why slowly, over time, he has gotten sluggish. Baby sulcatas need to be kept warm - 80-85F degrees over the whole enclosure, day and night. They also need to live in a humid environment. Try to figure out a way to cover that enclosure, with the lights inside and see if that helps.

A CHE on a thermostat will keep the temperature up at night: (ceramic heat emitter)

 

[SaltLakeSulcata]

We aren't here to beat people up. We are here to help. You are trying to do the right thing. That is admirable.

Until you find a home, can we help get the environment correct? We'll try help help find cheap and easy ways to make some improvements that will make a difference. Let start with pics of the enclosure, what you think the temperatures might be, and what you are using for heating and lighting.

The tortoise mainly lives in the area under the heat lamp. It used to explore the rest of the cage, but I have not seen it leave this warm spot for awhile

The other side of the enclosure is set up for a larger animal-- and doesn't have much warmth. Last i checked it was 60-65 degrees on that side.

We are looking at greenhouse covers to out over the top of the cage.

But i also want something simple to get it outside to get sunlight- but also stay warm - for an hour a day. But that is getting expensive and time intensive to do all at the same time. And the food issue ... that should be priority.

 

[MenagerieGrl]

If you are unable to make the correction's needed, then by ALL means take him back.
HOPEFULLY the pet store can give him what he needs to survive.
Even if you have to forgo the repayment/refund, you need to so what is best for the lil guy....

 

[SaltLakeSulcata]

I'm pretty sure his environment isn't suitable and that's why slowly, over time, he has gotten sluggish. Baby sulcatas need to be kept warm - 80-85F degrees over the whole enclosure, day and night. They also need to live in a humid environment. Try to figure out a way to cover that enclosure, with the lights inside and see if that helps.

A CHE on a thermostat will keep the temperature up at night: View attachment 340334 (ceramic heat emitter)

Yes. Thank you. My concern is prioritizing, and not trying to do and buy everything all at once. I don't have the money or the energy to do everything. I need to take one step at a time and don't know what to do first. I think heat and enclosing the area is first --- i put cheap plastic around the cage a few days ago, which has helped with humidity. I think getting consistent temperature is the next thing to do.

But part of my concern is that we are very hot in summer and cold in winter. I'm going to have to change a bunch of stuff in a few months. Or maybe have an outdoor enclosure for the summer?

As I said -- just a lot of new things and I do 't have confidence that I really can do it all.

 

[SaltLakeSulcata]

If you are unable to make the correction's needed, then by ALL means take him back.
HOPEFULLY the pet store can give him what he needs to survive.
Even if you have to forgo the repayment/refund, you need to so what is best for the lil guy....

I could ask, I suppose. Sounds pretty unlikely though

 

[MenagerieGrl]

I could ask, I suppose. Sounds pretty unlikely though

Well , , work on the big stuff first....Heat & humidity. Then go for the smaller stuff....
Were all here to help, which ever way you decide to go....

 

[Tom]

Thank you. I appreciate your support. I will have to figure out how to upload photos. I feel overwhelmed by all of the things, and just am afraid the little tortoise won't survive until I figure it all out.

I have read the fact sheet on raising young sulcata- posted here in turtle forum. Humidity and heat are ok but not fantastic. In the daytime I sometimes achieve 80 degrees and 80 percent humidity. In the night it is between 60-70 degrees and humidity around 70 percent or so.i just worry that the large fluctuations in conditions are stressful for the tortoise. (It's name is Squash, which I don't like. My son's friend named it.)

I have already read and looked at ways to improve the conditions. I just feel I can't make the modifications quickly enough to sustain the tortoise's health.

Because, on top of making adjustments to the enclosure, there is the food issue. A variety of specific foods, none of which I know where to obtain locally, and no confidence in how else to grow them myself or obtain them in some other way. The pet store said romaine and other grocery store greens. But I read here to give it grass and all these specialty lettuces, which I might be able to find at specialty groceries when I have time to go searching.

As I said, it is just overwhelming. I think the animal is getting by for now. It does move around some, it does eat and drink -- just not as much as I have read is normal for it. And the lack of poop -- or me seeing the poop -- is a big concern.

Maybe it is supposed to sleep a lot. It often falls asleep, half in and half out of its water dish. Maybe I am just overreacting. Maybe it can live in these conditions for another month while I slowly improve its conditions.

But if I have an option of moving it elsewhere, that is my preference. I would like to prepare a better enclosure, maybe get a new pet that is more suitable for my climate.

I'll muddle through and be grateful for my tortoise's resilience while I figure it out. But if I can find a new home for it in a decent time frame, I think that would be better for everyone.

From what you've said, the main issue is that it is too cold. This tortoise needs heat and it needs it right now. You can drive to a pet store and get a 150 watt ceramic heating element and a thermostat to control it right now. Then go to Home Depot and get a ceramic based "clamp lamp" fixture. Wen you get home, remove the clamp and figure out how to hang the CHE from over head in the middle of the enclosure. Set the thermostat to 84 and put the probe over to one side hanging down into the enclosure. Use your thermometer to adjust the thermostat up or down to get temps right around 80-82 all over. Then the basking lamp will make a hotter area during the day where the tortoise can warm up.

All reptiles require external heat source to warm up. In the wild, they would use the sun, and areas that have been warmed by the sun. In our indoor captive environments, we must provide an artificial "sun" for them to warm up under, and we also need to make sure that the ambient temperature meets their needs. Sulcata come from Africa. Its hot there all the time. Ground temperatures in that tropical region fluctuate between 80-85 all year day and night. They don't do well in temps below 80, and babies often don't survive temps in the 60s, which is what you are seeing.

Here is a lighting breakdown with more explanation. The UV and ambient light are not critical for survival, but they are important and should be taken care of eventually. The ambient heat and basking lamp are required immediately.
There are four elements to heating and lighting:

1. Basking bulb. I use 65 watt incandescent floods from the hardware store. Some people will need bigger, or smaller wattage bulbs. Let your thermometer be your guide. I run them on a timer for about 12 hours and adjust the height to get the correct basking temp under them. I also like to use a flat rock of some sort directly under the bulb. You need to check the temp with a thermometer directly under the bulb and get it to around 95-100F (36-37C).
2. Ambient heat maintenance. I use ceramic heating elements or radiant heat panels set on thermostats to maintain ambient above 80 degrees day and night for tropical species. In most cases you'd only need day heat for a temperate species like Testudo or DT, as long as your house stays above 60F (15-16C) at night.
3. Ambient light. I use LEDs for this purpose. Something in the 5000-6500K color range will look the best. Most bulbs at the store are in the 2500K range and they look yellowish. Strip or screw-in LED bulb types are both fine.
4. UV. If you can get your tortoise outside for an hour 2 or 3 times a week, you won't need indoor UV. In colder climates, get one of the newer HO type fluorescent tubes. Which type will depend on mounting height. 5.0 bulbs make almost no UV. I like the 12% HO bulbs from Arcadia. You need a meter to check this: https://www.solarmeter.com/model65.html A good UV bulb only needs to run for 2-3 hours mid day. You need the basking bulb and the ambient lighting to be on at least 12 hours a day.

The same sort of thing applies to diet. Immediately, you can just go buy spring mix at the store, or whatever variety of greens they offer. Over the long term, you need to find or grow better foods for the tortoise. Just take it one item at a time. Learn just one new food each week and try it out. After one year of that, you will know of 52 new foods! In the short term, its easy to soak a ZooMed pellet and mix that in with the spring mix daily. Both of those things are readily available and easy to find.

I understand that this ended up being more than you wanted to deal with, but you've got this little guy now and he needs your help immediately to survive. Moving him to another keeper will be terribly stressful and he might not survive the move in his weakened state. It would be better for him if you could sort out the heat situation, let him recover a bit, and then re-home him if you are still feeling like you don't want to do this for any reason. We will help you. We will answer all your questions and help you find workable solutions.

 

[Tom]

Yes. Thank you. My concern is prioritizing, and not trying to do and buy everything all at once. I don't have the money or the energy to do everything. I need to take one step at a time and don't know what to do first. I think heat and enclosing the area is first --- i put cheap plastic around the cage a few days ago, which has helped with humidity. I think getting consistent temperature is the next thing to do.

But part of my concern is that we are very hot in summer and cold in winter. I'm going to have to change a bunch of stuff in a few months. Or maybe have an outdoor enclosure for the summer?

As I said -- just a lot of new things and I do 't have confidence that I really can do it all.

The main priority is night heat and ambient heats which will be easily taken care of with the CHE and thermostat described in my previous post.

Get rid of that ramped water bowl. Those are great for lizards and snakes, but dangerous and unsuitable for tortoises. Use the terra cotta saucers for food and water.

Cold in the winter is a big problem, but easily solved. Hot in the summer is great for this species. I like ambient temp in the indoor enclosure to climb into the low 90s each day for this species. Just keep it under 100, and the tortoise will be fine.

These are all easy fixes. We can help you fine tune the other stuff over time.

 

[Maro2Bear]

The temps you provided are just way tooooo cold. The coldest any area should be is 80F morning, day & night 24/7. The small circular temp gauge in your enclosure are also not very accurate, so, your temps might even be colder than you think.

➡️ “The other side of the enclosure is set up for a larger animal-- and doesn't have much warmth. Last i checked it was 60-65 degrees on that side.”

Good luck for you & helping this little Sulcata.

 

[wellington]

First thing is to get the temps correct. That is the number one important thing. No spots below 80 day or night and the basking spot has to be 95-100. If not he will not survive as he can't digest his food. One of the day lights needs to have uvb.
Second is get that water dish out asap before he drowns and get a low sided clay saucer the kind that goes under flower pots.
Third get any dark greens from the grocery store, even spring mix and remove most spinach. Other greens are mustard and collard, endive, radicchio, kale, feed as big a variety as possible.
Fourth don't worry about getting him outside for now, just get the inside correct.