Young Lathargic Geochelone elegans

[lweigle]

I recently rescued two male Geochelone elegans back in april that were in pretty rough shape . I received them both with minor upper respiratory. The large one had an under bite most likely caused by MBD with the lower beak overgrown up to its nostrils causing the upper beak to curl up in its mouth as well as a terrible case of pyramiding. There previous diet consisted of only lettuce and fruit and both had very runny green poop which i have change to consist of a higher fiber diet of hays, grasses, leaves, zoo med grassland tortoise diet, some vegetables, and various collard greens both are pooping normal now. When i got them i took them to the vet first thing and was able to trim down the larger ones beak. They were cleared of internal parasites through a fecal exam. I was also able to kick the upper respiratory by boosting the temperatures in the encloser and dont exhibit any signs of bubble blowing or snotty noses. The eyes are clear on both of them.
The smaller one which is around 2 years old from what i was told, at about 4 inches shell length. It has minimal pyramiding and does not have an over grown beak or deformed jaw from MBD. It came to me very lethargic which i thought would pass after i kicked the upper respiratory infection several months back. It has yet to improve in its activity. It is always sleeping and has its eyes closed. The eyes are not puffy or runny and look normal to me. The only times i see him active is when it gets up to drink and when it eats. Im most likely going to scheduled another vet visit soon.
The larger G. elegans is about 7 inches about 4-5 years of age. It is the exact opposite and displays what i would consider an overly hyperactive behavior. Mostly active at dawn and dusk which and other various times throughout the day and night. He is a pig and food hog. im not to concerned about him.
Do you guys have any knowledge of why the little one is always so lethargic and what might be causing it? If you can give me your input it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Luther

 

[SarahChelonoidis]

Are you housing them together?

Can you tell us a bit about the enclosure(s) you are keeping them in right now? Temperatures (highs and lows), lighting (what type of bulbs, if indoors), etc.?

 

[Tom]

First off, Hello and welcome.

Sounds like these two had a rough go of it initially. Congrats on the amazing save and rehab.

My first question is, are you housing them as a pair, or do they live separately?
Next question is, how are they housed? Indoors, outdoors?
Where are you?
Any UV over their enclosure if its indoors? What type of bulb?
What are your four temps? Warm side, cool side, basking area and overnight low? What equipment are you using to maintain those temps? Red bulbs? CHEs?

Last thing: Not all parasites and diseases can be cleared through a single fecal exam, or even lots of fecal exams. There are a lot of "mystery" tortoise diseases going around right now, and stars are one of the main sufferers of these bugs. Some things can't be diagnosed at all except through necropsy. Your star might have something else going on, that you have not found yet.

 

[Yvonne G]

Hi Luther, and welcome to the Forum!

Two things come to mind - parasites and territorial aggression.

You don't always actually SEE the aggression. The more aggressive tortoise "tells" the more passive tortoise to get out of the territory. Since he's confined in an enclosure, he can't get out. So he does the next best thing; he hides, he stays away from the food, he tries to keep out of the others' sight.

Try setting the smaller one up in his own habitat, warm him up to an overall 85F and see if that makes a difference in his activity level.

 

[lweigle]

They are both being currently housed together in a melamine tortoise table indoors that measure 48"x 30" which is smaller than i would like. I keep them primarily indoors unfortunately. I live up in northern New England and don't have the same luxuries as some of the southerns. During the summer i would bring both to work with me as much as i could where we have an outdoor pen for my tortoises. I will be getting on building an outdoor pen that is very secure during spring of 2016. For lighting i have on them is two 100w zoomed red lights placed 10 inches above the floor of the encloser. I have one 160w mega ray mercury vapor bulb located 17 inches above the encloser floor. There is a small heat mat located in the back of the hide which i try to keep more humid. Currently the two red lights come on at night and the power sun comes on during the day. Right now i can not give exact temperatures because my temp gun broke about a month ago. I will get the temps tomorrow if i can find a new one.

 

[lweigle]

This is the encloser I do have a warm and cool side i forgot to add

 

[lweigle]

This is a photo of them right after i set them both up.