Tortoise Sex changing after two?

[wellington]

I was just wondering if anyone has actually seen a tortoises sex actually change after the age of two? What I mean, if at two years, all the guess and the pics of the plastron, tail, etc looks say female, has anyone actually seen one that then say at 2 1/2 or so, then changed positivity into a male or vise versa?

 

[wellington]

@Yvonne G @Tom @N2TORTS @tortadise @Neal @DeanS @ALDABRAMAN @Jacqui and f course anyone else that has

 

[N2TORTS]

it does not really "change" ......but the guestimate maybe wrong. Happens all the time with young/smaller animals. especially those odd balls who don't fit the "norm" characteristics .
2.5 years is still rather young in the redfoot dept. ......I would also imagine different species have different maturity rates that would lead to a more accurate guess while still young.

 

[Neal]

Like JD said, it's not that the tortoises sex changed, it's that the original guess was wrong. Some individual tortoises can be very difficult to accurately sex without endoscopy. As the tortoise grows the characteristics that we use to determine a tortoises sex become more clear and original guess will often prove to be incorrect.

 

[DeanS]

My two original baby sulcatas, Jimmy and Climber (later Jamie and Monstro) both appeared male at the start. At around 3 years old Jimmy became Jamie...then at 4 reverted back to Jimmy...and, subsequently, was rehomed due to his brother's fascination with mating...all day long!

 

[diamondbp]

I have some two year old sulcatas from my first self hatched clutch ever that keep boggling my mind on what sex they are. Just when I was certain they were males and after rehoming all but one, the remaining one is now looking quite female.

Even though I've dealt with tortoises for years I've never ever had a male tortoise flash me and I soak my tortoises quite often.

 

[wellington]

Wow Dean, that's very interesting. Confused tort for sure. Lol.
Incase I didn't state it right, I didn't mean their sex changed as much I as meant the look of the sex at two. I'm not good at explaining, but I think you got what I mean. Just keep hoping there's an early sign that has been missed. I so hate the waiting game. Although, I now do know what I have for sure, as long as one doesn't do what Deans did.
Thanks

 

[Tom]

I agree with all of the above. You just can't tell on some of them for a while. Remember my stunted adult sulcatas? For almost 8 years, I was sure Bert was a female. Small head, small tail, no plastron concavity, small gulars, he even BEHAVED very female, and the anal scutes were in between. He ain't no girl now. He's bigger than his brother and was whooping some brother a$$ before I separated them. Even to this day his gulars and head are tiny compared to Bert. During his ninth year the tail grew tremendously and the plastron concavity really began to show. He has doubled his size since then and is now obviously a male, but at 8 years old and 30-35 pounds, I guessed wrong. I knew his brother Scooter was a male at about 2-3 years old. It was obvious on him, but some just don't show it. Typically people guess female on young ones and then the secondary sexual characteristics begin to show when they are closer to maturity. I can usually tell on sulcatas and leopards by 3-4 years of age, but there are those occasional ones that you just can't tell. Especially if they were raised dry and stunted.

 

[wellington]

Wow that's a long time, 8 years. So, having a small more petite head isn't a reliable sign either. On another thread, we have noticed that a lot of males, mostly leopards seem to have a bigger more male looking head/face, while the females have a more feminine, smaller female looking head/face. Was kinda hoping this could be an early sign to look for.

 

[tortadise]

Yep I've have numerous species go both ways, male and ended being female, female and ended being male, well after 2 years too. Some Redfoots around 6-7 years old. Marginated around 7-8 years old. Manouria are very tough to sex until 10-15 years old. My radiated I had to get scoped at 11 years old and was a male, when I was certain was a female. But those are very tough to sex unless 15-20 years old anyways.

 

[wellington]

Wow Kelly, those are some long waiting times. Holy crap. That would drive me nuts.

 

[Tom]

So, having a small more petite head isn't a reliable sign either. On another thread, we have noticed that a lot of males, mostly leopards seem to have a bigger more male looking head/face, while the females have a more feminine, smaller female looking head/face. Was kinda hoping this could be an early sign to look for.

It can be a sign, but it does not make it a certainty. For example 4 year old female Trey has a much bigger more male looking head than her clutchmate brother Tuck. These guys tail sizes make it obvious at 4 years old, plus Tuck is now flashing with some regularity.

To summarize: Sometimes with some species you can tell at 3 years old with some level of certainty, but some individuals of any species it can be difficult to tell for many years, until maturity really.

 

[tortadise]

Wow Kelly, those are some long waiting times. Holy crap. That would drive me nuts.

It's tortoises though. Gotta practice patience.

 

[wellington]

So I guess if they look female or look male at or around two or so, for some species, they very well could and possibly will turn out to be just that, but just don't bet the house on it, until flashed or eggs laid There will always be those that just won't follow the norm.

 

[Tom]

So I guess if they look female or look male at or around two or so, for some species, they very well could and possibly will turn out to be just that, but just don't bet the house on it, until flashed or eggs laid There will always be those that just won't follow the norm.

At two years old, you've got at least a 50/50 chance of guessing correctly with EVERY tortoise of every species!

 

[wellington]

Can I get 80/20

 

[Tom]

Can I get 80/20

Not from me...

 

[wellington]

Not from me...

Haha

 

[Yvonne G]

The only sure-fire way to tell on a young tortoise is when he flashes you.

 

[bouaboua]

We had a Hermanni always consider as a she. till this happen: