Shell abrasion

[Jay Bagley]

I noticed a few small abrasions on my tortoises plaston. I found where they were coming from in the enclosure. He was rubbing on it and I fix that problem. It wasn't actually bleeding, but it looked like it had a dried blood spot on it very small. I was wondering the brown stuff that is forming around it, is that how the shell heels? I was wondering if it was some kind of a scab, and wanted to make sure it wasn't any kind of fungus or anything like that. I cleaned it with Betadine, once. And have been applying silver sulfadiazine once-daily. Just wanted to know if I should keep applying it or use something different as well. I only use the Betadine once, should I use it anymore? That centerline where the abrasions are, is softer than the rest of his plaston, is that normal? Evrything else is super hard, its not soft..but more rubbery or flexible there. And on a side note while I have the picture up of his underneath, does he look like a he? I didn't know if he was too young to tell yet or not. Thanks for any input as it is very much appreciated.

 

[Markw84]

Jay

The plastron does not look bad. The seams of a growing sulcata will be more “ rubbery” feeling as the new keratin is much more soft and pliable. An injury to the area can bleed a little and scab but normally will heal easily

I would not use betadine unless you see as active fungal or bacterial problem like shell rot. Sulcatas seem to be almost immune to that. Betadine can actually damage healthy cells and slow healing so even when indicated as with shell rot, I will only use once then keep an anti-fungal cream on it. But again, this is not shell rot. What I see will heal quickly

Although your tortoise is too small to feel confident sexing, I will say it is looking to be developing pretty female at this point. But that certainly change sometimes! I am not totally confident I have a female until she is 16” and looking totally female.

 

[Jay Bagley]

Jay

The plastron does not look bad. The seams of a growing sulcata will be more “ rubbery” feeling as the new keratin is much more soft and pliable. An injury to the area can bleed a little and scab but normally will heal easily

I would not use betadine unless you see as active fungal or bacterial problem like shell rot. Sulcatas seem to be almost immune to that. Betadine can actually damage healthy cells and slow healing so even when indicated as with shell rot, I will only use once then keep an anti-fungal cream on it. But again, this is not shell rot. What I see will heal quickly

Although your tortoise is too small to feel confident sexing, I will say it is looking to be developing pretty female at this point. But that certainly change sometimes! I am not totally confident I have a female until she is 16” and looking totally female.

Thanks for the reply Mark, that is a relief. I think I spend just as much time worrying about this tortoise as I do enjoy having him LOL.

 

[Jay Bagley]

Jay

The plastron does not look bad. The seams of a growing sulcata will be more “ rubbery” feeling as the new keratin is much more soft and pliable. An injury to the area can bleed a little and scab but normally will heal easily

I would not use betadine unless you see as active fungal or bacterial problem like shell rot. Sulcatas seem to be almost immune to that. Betadine can actually damage healthy cells and slow healing so even when indicated as with shell rot, I will only use once then keep an anti-fungal cream on it. But again, this is not shell rot. What I see will heal quickly

Although your tortoise is too small to feel confident sexing, I will say it is looking to be developing pretty female at this point. But that certainly change sometimes! I am not totally confident I have a female until she is 16” and looking totally female.

I wanted to do an update on my tortoises plastron I didn't know if I was supposed to create a new post or not. So I added it to this old one. In the last month since I have posted it has not gotten any better, and it is slowly getting worse. I eliminated what I thought was causing it, but it has not helped. Just wanted to know if I can get any opinions and what it looks like to you guys. When you look at the spot very close, it almost looks kind of fleshy.

 

[Tom]

With the exception of the "dent" in the middle, the rest of the plastron looks normal to me.

What substrate are you using? How wet is it?
Open top or closed chamber?
What was causing the previous injury? It almost looks like the old injury scabbed over and recently fell out, leaving that indentation.
We might have some ideas if we saw a pic of the enclosure too.

 

[Jay Bagley]

With the exception of the "dent" in the middle, the rest of the plastron looks normal to me.

What substrate are you using? How wet is it?
Open top or closed chamber?
What was causing the previous injury? It almost looks like the old injury scabbed over and recently fell out, leaving that indentation.
We might have some ideas if we saw a pic of the enclosure too.

Hey thank you for the reply. I know I probably sound like a broken record, but I am using an open tortoise table. I know it sucks at keeping in humidity, and with my furnace going Non-Stop the humidity in my home is very low. The substrate that I am using, is repti bark. It is approximately 5 to 6 inches deep. Originally the stairs that lead up to his hide when he would walk around his enclosure he would try to cut the corner and almost climb over the railing part of his steps and smash the bottom of the shell every time. I put some large rocks in front of that, they are not shown in the picture as it is an older picture. That was the only place I could see where he was bumping his shell. I was wondering if it is plausible, that he is rubbing it raw. He likes to go in one corner and kind of rotate his body back and forth and dig down to the bottom of the substrate I'm wondering if possibly is causing some friction. With all that being said, I know that doesn't help him now but I did go to the hardware store today and bought the stuff to start his closed chamber. The only other thing I found abnormal, and I don't have much experience with tortoises so it may be normal. But that whole centerline is raised and a tad puffy. I have been applying antibiotic ointment to it, and it will usually get brown and crusty throughout the day. Then when I soak him the crust comes off and it just looks raw again

 

[Tom]

Do you weigh him weekly? Is he growing?

This is a new one for me. Looks like a minor wound now, and I would expect it to heal up with the antibiotic ointment. In an open table with the house heater running, it can't be too damp.

@Markw84 made some excellent comments in this thread before. Any ideas on this one Mark? I'm at a loss.

Let's request help from a few other experienced keepers who might have seen something like this over the years:
@Yvonne G
@Will
@zovick

 

[Jay Bagley]

Do you weigh him weekly? Is he growing?

This is a new one for me. Looks like a minor wound now, and I would expect it to heal up with the antibiotic ointment. In an open table with the house heater running, it can't be too damp.

@Markw84 made some excellent comments in this thread before. Any ideas on this one Mark? I'm at a loss.

Let's request help from a few other experienced keepers who might have seen something like this over the years:
@Yvonne G
@Will
@zovick

Hey Tom, if I don't respond back right away you have my apologies. I work third shift and my shift just started at 11. But I will definitely get back to you guys. I don't know if you saw my post the other day about weight, but I have only had him since October 1st, prior to that he was at my ex-wife's house. Very poor diet, minimal soaking, when he came to me he passed very solid urates the size of BB's for the first 2 weeks. When he came to me he was 1 pound, at 2 years old. He has put on nearly 2 lb in the three months I have had him. I weigh him monthly. I believe he gained 7 ounces the first month, 5 oz of second, and a full pound the Third. He was not in the greatest shape when he came to me, but I am slowly nursing him back to health.

 

[Tom]

Hey Tom, if I don't respond back right away you have my apologies. I work third shift and my shift just started at 11. But I will definitely get back to you guys. I don't know if you saw my post the other day about weight, but I have only had him since October 1st, prior to that he was at my ex-wife's house. Very poor diet, minimal soaking, when he came to me he passed very solid urates the size of BB's for the first 2 weeks. When he came to me he was 1 pound, at 2 years old. He has put on nearly 2 lb in the three months I have had him. I weigh him monthly. I believe he gained 7 ounces the first month, 5 oz of second, and a full pound the Third. He was not in the greatest shape when he came to me, but I am slowly nursing him back to health.

No problem Jay. I work weird hours too and sometimes I miss replies for days.

Sounds like he/she is doing great with you! That type of growth is a good indicator that this tortoise is healthy and thriving. I'm mystified here. A little minor wound like that should be healing up quickly with that kind of overall growth.

I look forward to hearing what others have to say. I'd be curious to have a vet culture that wound and see if there is some sort of unusual bacteria growing in there that is resistant to the treatments you've offered thus far.

 

[Jay Bagley]

No problem Jay. I work weird hours too and sometimes I miss replies for days.

Sounds like he/she is doing great with you! That type of growth is a good indicator that this tortoise is healthy and thriving. I'm mystified here. A little minor wound like that should be healing up quickly with that kind of overall growth.

I look forward to hearing what others have to say. I'd be curious to have a vet culture that wound and see if there is some sort of unusual bacteria growing in there that is resistant to the treatments you've offered thus far.

Thank you Tom, I appreciate the encouragement and feedback. I'm pretty baffled to by this. None of this whatsoever is to point blame at my ex or anything, but I was sad to learn and yet another reason it is in my care now that roughly the two years she had him the enclosure was never cleaned once. So the poor little guy was walking around in all of his feces and dried food particles. Maybe picked up some bacteria that way. If it helps, tomorrow afternoon I can take some more detailed pictures. In the picture I posted it does look like a dent, but when you look at it close as I do when I'm holding him the right side all of it is like a dent, but the left side of it is actually risen and looks like some sort of soft tissue. When I first got him back I was feeding him Cactus three times a week, and offering him a variety of greens with chopped grass 2 times a day. I did that for the first month and a half, for the last month-and-a-half I still offer him Cactus three times a week, greens with wheat grass in the morning, as much as he will eat. And then around supper time I have been giving him the mazuri Tortoise diet mixed with the Zoo Med grassland tortoise Chow,mixed with the herbal hay I got from tortoise Supply. That seemed to really help him pack on the weight. I'm wondering if the constant grinding that he does when he tries to dig in the dry repta bark is not offering it a chance to heal. I have some athlete's foot scream at home, do you guys think I should try that?

 

[Jay Bagley]

Thank you Tom, I appreciate the encouragement and feedback. I'm pretty baffled to by this. None of this whatsoever is to point blame at my ex or anything, but I was sad to learn and yet another reason it is in my care now that roughly the two years she had him the enclosure was never cleaned once. So the poor little guy was walking around in all of his feces and dried food particles. Maybe picked up some bacteria that way. If it helps, tomorrow afternoon I can take some more detailed pictures. In the picture I posted it does look like a dent, but when you look at it close as I do when I'm holding him the right side all of it is like a dent, but the left side of it is actually risen and looks like some sort of soft tissue. When I first got him back I was feeding him Cactus three times a week, and offering him a variety of greens with chopped grass 2 times a day. I did that for the first month and a half, for the last month-and-a-half I still offer him Cactus three times a week, greens with wheat grass in the morning, as much as he will eat. And then around supper time I have been giving him the mazuri Tortoise diet mixed with the Zoo Med grassland tortoise Chow,mixed with the herbal hay I got from tortoise Supply. That seemed to really help him pack on the weight. I'm wondering if the constant grinding that he does when he tries to dig in the dry repta bark is not offering it a chance to heal. I have some athlete's foot scream at home, do you guys think I should try that?

The pictures I take tomorrow, I will do a before the soak when it is crusted over. And then another one of when its clean after his soak.

 

[zovick]

Do you weigh him weekly? Is he growing?

This is a new one for me. Looks like a minor wound now, and I would expect it to heal up with the antibiotic ointment. In an open table with the house heater running, it can't be too damp.

@Markw84 made some excellent comments in this thread before. Any ideas on this one Mark? I'm at a loss.

Let's request help from a few other experienced keepers who might have seen something like this over the years:
@Yvonne G
@Will
@zovick

Hi Jay and others. The area in question at first appeared to look like a normal area of very rapid new growth. These areas are highly vascularized and will bleed fairly readily if scratched or abraded. Now it appears that something has continued to irritate the area at the junction of the seams so that the seam area is not healing or closing as it normally would. My recommendation is to put Neosporin ointment on the area and then put a couple of waterproof band-aids over it in an "X" pattern so that the sticky adhesive is on the harder old growth of the plastron rather than on the new growth in the seams. No sense irritating the seams any more than necessary to try to heal the open area. You will probably need to replace the band-aids and Neosporin every day or so after you soak the tortoise. Try that for a couple of weeks and then see what happens. If the band-aids don't stick well, you could try using adhesive or even duct tape and gauze instead, but any tape should be kept off those seam areas too.

Tortoises take about three or four times longer than humans to heal, just so you are aware of that, which is why I say to do this for a couple of weeks.

 

[Jay Bagley]

Hi Jay and others. The area in question at first appeared to look like a normal area of very rapid new growth. These areas are highly vascularized and will bleed fairly readily if scratched or abraded. Now it appears that something has continued to irritate the area at the junction of the seams so that the seam area is not healing or closing as it normally would. My recommendation is to put Neosporin ointment on the area and then put a couple of waterproof band-aids over it in an "X" pattern so that the sticky adhesive is on the harder old growth of the plastron rather than on the new growth in the seams. No sense irritating the seams any more than necessary to try to heal the open area. You will probably need to replace the band-aids and Neosporin every day or so after you soak the tortoise. Try that for a couple of weeks and then see what happens. If the band-aids don't stick well, you could try using adhesive or even duct tape and gauze instead, but any tape should be kept off those seam areas too.

Tortoises take about three or four times longer than humans to heal, just so you are aware of that, which is why I say to do this for a couple of weeks.

Hello Zovick, that sounds like a really wonderful idea. Thank you for giving me some insight to what it looks like is going on. I'm going to bed right now, but when I wake up I will head out to the store and get the Band-Aids. I will update my post with pictures, and news of how he progresses. Thank you again.

 

[Jay Bagley]

Hi Jay and others. The area in question at first appeared to look like a normal area of very rapid new growth. These areas are highly vascularized and will bleed fairly readily if scratched or abraded. Now it appears that something has continued to irritate the area at the junction of the seams so that the seam area is not healing or closing as it normally would. My recommendation is to put Neosporin ointment on the area and then put a couple of waterproof band-aids over it in an "X" pattern so that the sticky adhesive is on the harder old growth of the plastron rather than on the new growth in the seams. No sense irritating the seams any more than necessary to try to heal the open area. You will probably need to replace the band-aids and Neosporin every day or so after you soak the tortoise. Try that for a couple of weeks and then see what happens. If the band-aids don't stick well, you could try using adhesive or even duct tape and gauze instead, but any tape should be kept off those seam areas too.

Tortoises take about three or four times longer than humans to heal, just so you are aware of that, which is why I say to do this for a couple of weeks.

I got back from the store from getting the band aids, and the antibiotic ointment. they didn't have a very large selection of waterproof Band-Aids, so I grabbed what they had. I did my best to not get it on the seams. Once I was finished, I noticed I did a little on a couple spots. I tried not to, but I could tell he was getting very stressed out from being flipped over so I was trying to hurry. I just wanted to say thank you to those of you who chimed in with advice, and anyone who took the time to read my post. It's really nice, and reassuring that there is this big of a group of people out there that are willing to take their time and go out of their way to help. So once again a huge thank you!!

 

[Destben]

Looks kinda like what my tort had. No idea what it actually was but it took a couple weeks and daily silver sulfadiazine cream to get rid of. Not saying that’s what it is but that’s how I got rid of what my tort had.

 

[Jay Bagley]

Looks kinda like what my tort had. No idea what it actually was but it took a couple weeks and daily silver sulfadiazine cream to get rid of. Not saying that’s what it is but that’s how I got rid of what my tort had. View attachment 226696

I was wondering if I was the only one who experienced anything like this, knowing yours cleared up in a couple of weeks gives me hope.

 

[Destben]

I was wondering if I was the only one who experienced anything like this, knowing yours cleared up in a couple of weeks gives me hope.

It kept coming back so eventually I had to use the cream twice a day. Eventually it stayed gone.

 

[Jay Bagley]

It kept coming back so eventually I had to use the cream twice a day. Eventually it stayed gone.

That is glad to hear, his started out really light to shortly after I got him. And progressively got worse. What zovick said about rapid growth made a lot of sense to me, he went from little growth too fast growth really quick.

 

[Destben]

That is glad to hear, his started out really light to shortly after I got him. And progressively got worse. What zovick said about rapid growth made a lot of sense to me, he went from little growth too fast growth really quick.

I got Torterra at a month old and she’s been putting on about 30g a month so it could be fast growth

 

[Jay Bagley]

I got Torterra at a month old and she’s been putting on about 30g a month so it could be fast growth

Sounds like Torterra is growing at a good rate. I always look forward to when I weigh him, if he gained weight then at least I know I'm doing something right.