My greek tortoise is very small?

[Jessikas]

I bought one month ago a greek tortoise baby (soon one year old) and in the besinning I did'nt realize how small he was... But lately I've been reading a lot about tortoises and mine is very small! His weight is only 18 gram right now, unfortunately I did'nt check his weight before now. I did also check his lenght (only the shall) and this is about 4 cm.

I'm worried about his size... But what can I do? He has a big home built of wood. He has places to hide in and to dig in. High humidity is there overall (even if it can be a bit dry near the heatlamp). I put water in his home atleast two times every day. One place he has with a combinated sun/uvb and heatlamp that is on for 14 hours every day, there is 35 degrees. In other parts is a normal lamp on 14 hours and there is it about 20 degrees, same degrees in the nights. He has always fresch water in two small bowls (but he is not often going to drink or take a bath on his own).

Howewer my tortoise seems often very tired. In the mornings he don't come out from his hiding place before I take him out and wake him up. On daytime he is mostly around the sunareas the whole days and I have to wake him up and put the food to him under the lamp. Before I'm feeding him I used to give him a bath under the sunlamp about 10-25 minutes so he is getting more active. He always have food in his home but he does'nt seems to go to eat on his own. I try to feed him atleast 2 times every day, then he is eating good in my opinion, but easily lose the intrest of the food so I have to put him back to eat more. He is eating mostly fresch food like diffrent salads, diffrent grasses from outside, some vegetables (cucumber is a favourite) and sometimes fruit. He seems to hate dried food and it's also harder for him to eat that. Sometimes I try to make a mixed salad with fresch and dried grasses or pellets (But he usually take only the fresch food from it then). I put all days some tortoise vitamins and calsium on the food he is eating. He seems to be very smart about what food he wanna eat and I give him what he want because he is so small and don't eating a lot.

Should I take him to a vet beacuse of his small size?! How much should he grow in one month?! He is pooping almost every day since the food was changed from mostly dried to mostly fresch and the poop seems normal (no worms that I can see)...

 

[Jessikas]

I forgot to write that I got him from a petshop here in Finland. I saw in his papers that he was born in Slovenia, later he came to Germany and from there sold to the petshop in Finland in August 2018.

They told me some days ago in the petshop that my tortoise came with one of his siblings that was bigger then him. In the petshop they needed to feed them seperately because the bigger one would take the food and put the smaller one away... So I don't know if he got enough food earlier in life. His bigger sibling was already sold when I got mine so I could'nt compare size of them. He was eating pellets before I got him and is eating better now with more fresch food, how ever he seems to lose the intrest for his food early if he can't get some from it (sometimes he bites into the air close to the food instead of in the food). Also he don't search for food so I have to put it to him and he is mostly laying down in the sunareas sleeping. If i sometimes take him outside his home and away from the lamp, he seems much more active (running around ). Is this normal?

 

[Jessikas]

Sorry for my long text... It's my first tortoise. Here is two pictures of him.

 

[drew54]

I'm no expert but I think your little guy is only a few months old. When you say "soon to be one year old" how old did the pet shop say he was? I'm asking because if he is only 18 g and 4cm long one he is obviously underweight and two he looks to only be a few months old.

You should really soak for 20-30 min. Your basking temps needs to be 35-37 (95-100f) which I see is good, but your overall ambient and night temps should not drop below 27 (80f). If your tort is too cold he won't eat because they need to be at least 30 degrees (85f) core temp to be able to digest their food.

I would keep food in the enclosure all day and let him eat when and as often as he wants. I think you mentioned you keep food in there all day anyway. I would also get some mazuri and soak a pellet and put in with his food. That will help with weight gain also. Cucumber is mostly water and doesn't provide enough nutrition. It's good for hydration, but not if you want to get your tort up in weight.

If he is pooping everyday then he is eating. Growth rates vary with each tortoise so it's hard to say, but he should be w weighing a whole lot more than 18g.

Calcium at the most should be given twice a week small pinch each time and multivitamins once a week small pinch.

Make sure your temps are corrected. This is important so your tiny guy doesn't get sick and will eat. Stick to the care sheets on the forum and the varied diet suggested in the care sheets for your species.

 

[Jessikas]

I'm no expert but I think your little guy is only a few months old. When you say "soon to be one year old" how old did the pet shop say he was? I'm asking because if he is only 18 g and 4cm long one he is obviously underweight and two he looks to only be a few months old.

You should really soak for 20-30 min. Your basking temps needs to be 35-37 (95-100f) which I see is good, but your overall ambient and night temps should not drop below 27 (80f). If your tort is too cold he won't eat because they need to be at least 30 degrees (85f) core temp to be able to digest their food.

I would keep food in the enclosure all day and let him eat when and as often as he wants. I think you mentioned you keep food in there all day anyway. I would also get some mazuri and soak a pellet and put in with his food. That will help with weight gain also. Cucumber is mostly water and doesn't provide enough nutrition. It's good for hydration, but not if you want to get your tort up in weight.

If he is pooping everyday then he is eating. Growth rates vary with each tortoise so it's hard to say, but he should be w weighing a whole lot more than 18g.

Calcium at the most should be given twice a week small pinch each time and multivitamins once a week small pinch.

Make sure your temps are corrected. This is important so your tiny guy doesn't get sick and will eat. Stick to the care sheets on the forum and the varied diet suggested in the care sheets for your species.

Thank you very much for your answer! I will fix heat also for the night. In his papers is written that he is born in 2017 (no date) and came to Germany in march 2018. To Finland in August 2018. So he seems to be underweight
Is it normal that he is sleeping a lot and I have to wake him up in mornings and for food?

 

[drew54]

Hatchlings sleep a lot, but since your ambient temps are low he will be less active than than normal and won't eat like he should. After I soak my hatchling for 30 minuets in the morning she gets all warmed up and then she goes right for the food. During her soaks is when I freshen up her food dish. She may not always eat a lot right after her soaks but she will throughout the day.

Definitely get the temps adjusted and hopefully the little guy will start to perk up. It's also, good to keep a good day and night schedule also.

 

[drew54]

Hatchlings sleep a lot, but since your ambient temps are low he will be less active than than normal and won't eat like he should. After I soak my hatchling for 30 minuets in the morning she gets all warmed up and then she goes right for the food. During her soaks is when I freshen up her food dish. She may not always eat a lot right after her soaks but she will throughout the day.

Definitely get the temps adjusted and hopefully the little guy will start to perk up. It's also, good to keep a good day and night schedule also. If on a good sleep schedule and the temps are good then you shouldn't really have to wake him up. If you do I would soak him and freshen food dish up and then let him eat after soak. Keeping a good routine is key also. Once your tort adjusts to sleep schedule and routine soaks and feedings they will be more happy as they know what to expect and when.

 

[drew54]

Thank you very much for your answer! I will fix heat also for the night. In his papers is written that he is born in 2017 (no date) and came to Germany in march 2018. To Finland in August 2018. So he seems to be underweight
Is it normal that he is sleeping a lot and I have to wake him up in mornings and for food?

I'm not all keen on all the breeding and when each specie lays and hatches nor if the breeder breeds year round. So, Maybe another experienced member could guesstimate better than I and give you some more or better info on your geek than I.

 

[SweetGreekTorts]

That's actually a Hermann's tortoise. The plastron of the Hermann's has two black strips, while the Greeks have random black spotting.

The carapace coloring and pattern is definitely Hermann's too, though I don't know the Hermann's as well as I know Greeks, so I'm unable to confirm which subspecies/locale it is.

@HermanniChris can help with a more accurate Hermann's identity.

 

[drew54]

See, help is on the way and we both just learned something cool.

 

[Jessikas]

That's actually a Hermann's tortoise. The plastron of the Hermann's has two black strips, while the Greeks have random black spotting.

The carapace coloring and pattern is definitely Hermann's too, though I don't know the Hermann's as well as I know Greeks, so I'm unable to confirm which subspecies/locale it is.

@HermanniChris can help with a more accurate Hermann's identity.

Wow! Thank you for this answer! What is the difference?

 

[JoesMum]

Wow! Thank you for this answer! What is the difference?

When it comes to care, very little. They have the same needs

 

[Jessikas]

When it comes to care, very little. They have the same needs

Thank you! Is there any difference in size..? But I guess mine is to small anyway..?

 

[JoesMum]

Thank you! Is there any difference in size..? But I guess mine is to small anyway..?

There's a huge range of sizes within the subspecies of Greeks, my Joe is at the monster end of the scawe, and I assume the same is true of subspecies of Hermann's. Add to that the fact that they all grow at different rates depending on diet and environment and it further confuses matters.

HermanniChris will be able to tell you more about Hermann's

As long as your tort is bright eyed, gaining weight (not losing it at least - some grow in spurts and stall periodically), eating and is normally active then don't worry too much

 

[Jerry's Mom]

While I know they all grow at different rates, 18g is the size of a hatchling or just a couple months old. I have a feeling the pet shop got papers or info mixed up somehow. I have a Greek that's 6 months and is currently 40g.

 

[Jessikas]

While I know they all grow at different rates, 18g is the size of a hatchling or just a couple months old. I have a feeling the pet shop got papers or info mixed up somehow. I have a Greek that's 6 months and is currently 40g.

Thank you for your answer. I was thinking the same but in his papers is written that he is born in 2017 and came to Germany in march 2018... And in the papers is some pictures of him where it is written number 18 on his shell, this number was still there when I got him so I guess they could not mix the papers..

How much active is normal active? He is sleeping the whole night until I wake him up... Also in daytime he is sleeping most of the time if I don't wake him up, then close to the heatlamp.

He seems to be MUCH more active when I put him in his small travelbox with only a wet towel, some food and water as long as I clean his home for example. How is it possible that he is much more active when he does'nt have the heat/uvb/sun lamp? He is also eating very good as long as he stays in his travelbox He seems much more active and healthy as long as he is there, walking around, eating a lot.. Then back in his home he starts to sleep a lot again.

 

[Jerry's Mom]

What's the temp and humidity level in the travel box? Might be higher than in his enclosure, which would be why he's more active. Look into how to make a humid hide (they can be easy to makje and cheap, but a great benefit to babies). Make sure your temps are up in the enclosure, that will make him more active. Lots of soaks too!

 

[Jessikas]

What's the temp and humidity level in the travel box? Might be higher than in his enclosure, which would be why he's more active. Look into how to make a humid hide (they can be easy to makje and cheap, but a great benefit to babies). Make sure your temps are up in the enclosure, that will make him more active. Lots of soaks too!

It is more humidity I guess in his travelbox (because no lamp is drying the box) and temperature is about the same as in my house (20 degrees). But I will try to make his whole home warmer also in nights and outside the sun, guess 20 degrees is to cold... Hope it helps him to get more active.

 

[Jerry's Mom]

It is more humidity I guess in his travelbox (because no lamp is drying the box) and temperature is about the same as in my house (20 degrees). But I will try to make his whole home warmer also in nights and outside the sun, guess 20 degrees is to cold... Hope it helps him to get more active.

Yes, definitely increase his temps. I'd be worried he gets a respiratory infection from the low temps and high humidity. I'm sure once you up his temps you'll see a huge increase in activity. Keep me posted!

 

[Jessikas]

Yes, definitely increase his temps. I'd be worried he gets a respiratory infection from the low temps and high humidity. I'm sure once you up his temps you'll see a huge increase in activity. Keep me posted!

How high should I try to get them at least? Can I use an element close to his box to get the whole box warmer easier because I have one at home..? Someone told me earlier that 15 degrees is good even for a baby