Leopard Tortoise baby Enclosure Feedback appreciated

[Tritri228]

Hello, all! First off, thank you for everyone helping educate all of us tortoise lovers with proper care to raise healthy torts! I have lived on this forum for several months.

I have two adult sulcata's and recently bought a baby leopard tortoise. I bought one round 10 years ago before captive breeding was as available but it passed away after 3-4 days of an URI so I have a bit of anxiety this go about and want things to be perfect.

• I let my enclosure acclimate for around 1.5 months while I tested lighting, heat, humidity.
• I brought home "Rigatoni" two weeks ago and he seems to be doing great.
• I have a 40 gallon breeder tank with front doors and had a wood top made so its fully enclosed.
• I also bought an outdoor tortoise box which I plan to put him in this summer for a few hours per day. Here is a link to it which arrives this week. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07VRY6X58/?tag=exoticpetnetw-20

Substrate: Jungle floor and topped with soaked coconut husk
Lighting: Mercury Vapor 70 Watt UV/heat combo light - https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08PXY3XJQ/?tag=exoticpetnetw-20
Temps: 90-97 on hot side and 82ish on cool side. I bought the repti power strip so the heat emitter turn on at night if the enclosure ever drops below 80.
Daily soaks in warm water

Questions:

1. I live in Gainesville, FL and the weather is hot and humid a lot of the year. Can my tortoise live in a secured tortoise box outside during the day if humidity is above 80% and temps are above 90 degrees or supplemented with a bulb to reach desired temp?
2. My humidity is dropping to around 60% by around 2:00, any feedback to get it to 80% other than misting it? Each morning I lift the coconut husk and till up the soil and husk and spray it down but try to keep the surface layer dry so he's not walking around on soggy substrate. I will also do this throughout the day to try and keep humidity up.
3. Does my indoor enclosure look good? Any feedback would be amazing.

Thank you in advance for your input!

 

[Tom]

Hello and welcome. You've done a better job than 90% of people, but there is always room for improvement!

First: no MVBs. It is unreliable as far as UV output, and they cause pyramiding, even in a humid enclosure.

Here is a breakdown of the four heating and lighting essentials:

1. Basking bulb. I use 65 watt incandescent floods from the hardware store. Some people will need bigger, or smaller wattage bulbs. Let your thermometer be your guide. I run them on a timer for about 12 hours and adjust the height to get the correct basking temp under them. I also like to use a flat rock of some sort directly under the bulb. You need to check the temp with a thermometer directly under the bulb and get it to around 95-100F (36-37C).
2. Ambient heat maintenance. I use ceramic heating elements or radiant heat panels set on thermostats to maintain ambient above 80 degrees day and night for tropical species. In most cases you'd only need day heat for a temperate species like Testudo or DT, as long as your house stays above 60F (15-16C) at night. Some people in colder climates or with larger enclosures will need multiple CHEs or RHPs to spread out enough heat.
3. Ambient light. I use LEDs for this purpose. Something in the 5000-6500K color range will look the best. Most bulbs at the store are in the 2500K range and they look yellowish. Strip or screw-in LED bulb types are both fine.
4. UV. If you can get your tortoise outside for an hour 2 or 3 times a week, you won't need indoor UV. In colder climates, get one of the newer HO type fluorescent tubes. Which type will depend on mounting height. 5.0 bulbs make almost no UV. I like the 12% HO bulbs from Arcadia. You need a meter to check this: https://www.solarmeter.com/model65.html A good UV bulb only needs to run for 2-3 hours mid day. You need the basking bulb and the ambient lighting to be on at least 12 hours a day.

Second: Having the heat and light outside of the enclosure is a mistake. It wastes electricity, and it heats the room instead of your enclosure. It also creates a chimney effect drawing the heat and humidity up and out of your enclosure, which is why you can't keep humidity up.

Here is all the correct care info:

The Best Way To Raise A Sulcata, Leopard, Or Star Tortoise

I chose the title of this care sheet very carefully. Are there other ways to raise babies? Yes. Yes there are, but those ways are not as good. What follows is the BEST way, according to 30 years of research and experimentation with hundreds of babies of many species. Babies hatch during the...

tortoiseforum.org

More info here:

Info For New People. Please Read This First.

Hello and welcome to tortoiseforum.org! We are all glad you are here! There is no other forum like this anywhere. We have tens of thousands of members from all over the world ranging from kids with their first tortoise to people who have been breeding and keeping high end tortoises since the...

tortoiseforum.org

Your questions:
1. Outside all day is bad for babies. An hour now and then is okay, but not necessary. No bulbs should be needed outside. Temps in the high 70s and sunny are warm enough. Be VERY careful that there is enough shade so your baby doesn't over heat and cook, but also be careful that is is not too cool in the shade in your damp rainy climate, because that will make a leopard sick, as you have seen. Indoors is safer and better until the tortoise gets bigger.

2. Put the heating and lighting all inside the enclosure to solve this problem. There is no need to lift up the substrate or churn anything. Leopards do not get shell rot. That is a problem for red foot keepers. You can save a lot of trouble and just dump water in there and not worry about it.

3. I have LOTS of feed back for you! Read those threads, and all your questions are welcome!

 

[Tritri228]

Hello and welcome. You've done a better job than 90% of people, but there is always room for improvement!

First: no MVBs. It is unreliable as far as UV output, and they cause pyramiding, even in a humid enclosure.

Here is a breakdown of the four heating and lighting essentials:

1. Basking bulb. I use 65 watt incandescent floods from the hardware store. Some people will need bigger, or smaller wattage bulbs. Let your thermometer be your guide. I run them on a timer for about 12 hours and adjust the height to get the correct basking temp under them. I also like to use a flat rock of some sort directly under the bulb. You need to check the temp with a thermometer directly under the bulb and get it to around 95-100F (36-37C).
2. Ambient heat maintenance. I use ceramic heating elements or radiant heat panels set on thermostats to maintain ambient above 80 degrees day and night for tropical species. In most cases you'd only need day heat for a temperate species like Testudo or DT, as long as your house stays above 60F (15-16C) at night. Some people in colder climates or with larger enclosures will need multiple CHEs or RHPs to spread out enough heat.
3. Ambient light. I use LEDs for this purpose. Something in the 5000-6500K color range will look the best. Most bulbs at the store are in the 2500K range and they look yellowish. Strip or screw-in LED bulb types are both fine.
4. UV. If you can get your tortoise outside for an hour 2 or 3 times a week, you won't need indoor UV. In colder climates, get one of the newer HO type fluorescent tubes. Which type will depend on mounting height. 5.0 bulbs make almost no UV. I like the 12% HO bulbs from Arcadia. You need a meter to check this: https://www.solarmeter.com/model65.html A good UV bulb only needs to run for 2-3 hours mid day. You need the basking bulb and the ambient lighting to be on at least 12 hours a day.

Second: Having the heat and light outside of the enclosure is a mistake. It wastes electricity, and it heats the room instead of your enclosure. It also creates a chimney effect drawing the heat and humidity up and out of your enclosure, which is why you can't keep humidity up.

Here is all the correct care info:

The Best Way To Raise A Sulcata, Leopard, Or Star Tortoise

I chose the title of this care sheet very carefully. Are there other ways to raise babies? Yes. Yes there are, but those ways are not as good. What follows is the BEST way, according to 30 years of research and experimentation with hundreds of babies of many species. Babies hatch during the...

tortoiseforum.org

More info here:

Info For New People. Please Read This First.

Hello and welcome to tortoiseforum.org! We are all glad you are here! There is no other forum like this anywhere. We have tens of thousands of members from all over the world ranging from kids with their first tortoise to people who have been breeding and keeping high end tortoises since the...

tortoiseforum.org

Your questions:
1. Outside all day is bad for babies. An hour now and then is okay, but not necessary. No bulbs should be needed outside. Temps in the high 70s and sunny are warm enough. Be VERY careful that there is enough shade so your baby doesn't over heat and cook, but also be careful that is is not too cool in the shade in your damp rainy climate, because that will make a leopard sick, as you have seen. Indoors is safer and better until the tortoise gets bigger.

2. Put the heating and lighting all inside the enclosure to solve this problem. There is no need to lift up the substrate or churn anything. Leopards do not get shell rot. That is a problem for red foot keepers. You can save a lot of trouble and just dump water in there and not worry about it.

3. I have LOTS of feed back for you! Read those threads, and all your questions are welcome!

Tom, thank you so much for the detailed reply! I was hoping you'd be the one who saw my message and gave me your feedback. I will be working this weekend to get everything in order for Rigatoni.



Do I have to worry about mold / mildew?

 

[Tom]

Tom, thank you so much for the detailed reply! I was hoping you'd be the one who saw my message and gave me your feedback. I will be working this weekend to get everything in order for Rigatoni.



Do I have to worry about mold / mildew?

We specifically use orchid bark, coco coir, or cypress mulch because they do not mold or mildew. A closed chamber is not airtight. There is always some ventilation. The trick is to have some ventilation, but not too much ventilation. Containing the heat lamp, UV, lights, and ambient heating elements inside the enclosure will make a huge difference.

I have not done it this way, but in theory, it seems like it would work. Have you seen a fish tank with a canopy on it? Essentially a cover to hide the lights and filters and stuff to make it look more presentable in a living room. I see no reason why a person couldn't build a canopy tall enough to rest on top of the enclosure, but contain all the heating and lighting. You could make it to fit on top, but still be able to service the enclosure from the front. I keep hoping someone will do this and show the rest of us what they learn from it. This might be cheaper or easier than replacing your whole enclosure with a closed chamber.

Feel free to voice your concerns, like the mildew question, and ask lots of questions. Many people who are in a similar situation read these threads. Countless people are probably wondering the same things you are wondering.

 

[wellington]

Another way to enclose the top like Tom was talking about with the fish tank/canopy idea is to search the web for a pop up portable green house to put on top. Lights etc can be hung from the frame.
I have used several of these green houses but not as just a top. Unfortunately we didn't know at that time how bad the mercury vapor bulbs were and I also found this forum too late way back when.