Odd Shell Growth

JAveroff

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Hello everyone, I am new here although i've been watching threads here for the past year for advice and suggestions on my sulcata's care especially from @Tom. However one thing I couldn't find is odd growth in an adult sulcata. I got mine when he was about 21 pounds and when I took him to the vet found out he had RI and staph infection. After a couple months of antibiotics he was all better. But shortly after I noticed he was developing pyramiding. So I freaked out and tried my best to give him a well balanced diet. Here we are a year later and he has a bit of a step in his shell and all his new growth has been dark since then. He did come to me in south Florida from Arizona so I dont know if its the change in environment or what. and all the new growth in the pics is from February to now, First picture is what the seller sent me before I got him. Any input?
 

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Big Charlie

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Diet doesn't cause pyramiding. It is caused by growth during dry conditions, low humidity. He should do better in your environment with its natural humidity, but he will benefit from frequent soaks in warm water. Does he live outdoors full time? If he has a night box, you can use a radiator for heating, which will also provide more humidity. If you can give him a pond or mud puddle, that is helpful too.
 

wellington

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Diet doesn't cause pyramiding. It is caused by growth during dry conditions, low humidity. He should do better in your environment with its natural humidity, but he will benefit from frequent soaks in warm water. Does he live outdoors full time? If he has a night box, you can use a radiator for heating, which will also provide more humidity. If you can give him a pond or mud puddle, that is helpful too.
A radiator heater does not add humidity. It's not like a house steam or water radiator. Its a closed unit that looks like a radiator and has a liquid enclosed within it. Does not produce any humidity only heat. To add humidity you will need to put a bucket of water or some source of water near the heat source or had a humidifier.
 

Big Charlie

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A radiator heater does not add humidity. It's not like a house steam or water radiator. Its a closed unit that looks like a radiator and has a liquid enclosed within it. Does not produce any humidity only heat. To add humidity you will need to put a bucket of water or some source of water near the heat source or had a humidifier.
Thanks for the clarification. I thought it was the same as a steam radiator. Now I don't feel bad for not having one.
 

wellington

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Pyramiding is caused by dry conditions not diet. I'm not sure why your torts shell is forming like it is. I don't think there is any cause for alarm though. He looks fairly good for probably being raised dry most his life. In the hotter days of summer, I will spray down the enclosure or set up a mister too help add humidity. You can also do a humid hide.
 

wellington

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Thanks for the clarification. I thought it was the same as a steam radiator. Now I don't feel bad for not having one.
No problem. I had a feeling you did. That's why I mentioned it. I had steam heat in my other house. However, that is deceiving as you don't get humidity from those either. It just uses steam within a closed radiator to heat the radiator and the heat radiates off of it. The only time you get actual steam from it is when you open the valve to bleed the radiator. That's only done once a year usually. It's not quite as dry a heat as a regular furnace but it really doesn't give off much humidity either. Not enough for stopping pyramiding.
 

JAveroff

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Diet doesn't cause pyramiding. It is caused by growth during dry conditions, low humidity. He should do better in your environment with its natural humidity, but he will benefit from frequent soaks in warm water. Does he live outdoors full time? If he has a night box, you can use a radiator for heating, which will also provide more humidity. If you can give him a pond or mud puddle, that is helpful too.
Well his new growth since I got him seems fine I'm really curious as to how such a significant raise in his shell happened. He lives outdoors 24/7 and I keep a bucket with water in the corner and during the dryer hotter months I spray it down lightly with a hose every other day. Also I have a kitty pool with the side cut out that he used to go into alot lately I have to put him I there and he immediately gets out.
 

Markw84

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Well his new growth since I got him seems fine I'm really curious as to how such a significant raise in his shell happened. He lives outdoors 24/7 and I keep a bucket with water in the corner and during the dryer hotter months I spray it down lightly with a hose every other day. Also I have a kitty pool with the side cut out that he used to go into alot lately I have to put him I there and he immediately gets out.
Your tortoise looks to be growing nicely now. The noticable step, or ridge in a shell is caused by a stop or marked slow-down of growth for an extended period of at least a few months. Periods of aestivation do that in the wild. A sickness will also cause this to happen. When the growth slows or stops, the bone is not longer expanding beneath the scutes and the keratin forming at the seams stacks as it also then slows down. But the slow down in keratin production is after the bone growth has stopped = a ridge forms.

The darker color is normal coloring for new growth in a sulcata. Each year that growth will lighten until it matches the old growth as a lighter tan. Normally you can see about 3 shades of brown in a sulcata as each band of the previous years growth is darker than the previous years. I find with mine, it takes about 3 years for the keratin to totally lighten to match the older color it will remain. You can easily see both this years growth and, a bit lighter - last years growth in yours.

Plants your sulcata can push under will help tremendously for smooth growth. Under a dense plant, like a large elephant grass tuft, retains almost 100% humidity even in dry areas. The use of plants to push beneath is a great benefit to reducing pyramiding once growing outside. In Florida, you have a much more humid weather to start with, but exposed to the sun is still desiccating. At the size of your sulcata, pyramiding should not be a concern with even reasonable conditions. It seems once the major bone structure has developed to a very solid state, and a tortoise has grown close to a mature size, they are much more resistant to pyramiding.

Your tortoise looks great and seems to be doing great!
 

JAveroff

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Sunrise, Fl
Your tortoise looks to be growing nicely now. The noticable step, or ridge in a shell is caused by a stop or marked slow-down of growth for an extended period of at least a few months. Periods of aestivation do that in the wild. A sickness will also cause this to happen. When the growth slows or stops, the bone is not longer expanding beneath the scutes and the keratin forming at the seams stacks as it also then slows down. But the slow down in keratin production is after the bone growth has stopped = a ridge forms.

The darker color is normal coloring for new growth in a sulcata. Each year that growth will lighten until it matches the old growth as a lighter tan. Normally you can see about 3 shades of brown in a sulcata as each band of the previous years growth is darker than the previous years. I find with mine, it takes about 3 years for the keratin to totally lighten to match the older color it will remain. You can easily see both this years growth and, a bit lighter - last years growth in yours.

Plants your sulcata can push under will help tremendously for smooth growth. Under a dense plant, like a large elephant grass tuft, retains almost 100% humidity even in dry areas. The use of plants to push beneath is a great benefit to reducing pyramiding once growing outside. In Florida, you have a much more humid weather to start with, but exposed to the sun is still desiccating. At the size of your sulcata, pyramiding should not be a concern with even reasonable conditions. It seems once the major bone structure has developed to a very solid state, and a tortoise has grown close to a mature size, they are much more resistant to pyramiding.

Your tortoise looks great and seems to be doing great!
Thanks that's exactly the info I was looking for. I have elephant grass that I blocked his access too because it's still young. Once established I'll move it so he can get under it.
 

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