Normal behavior?

[Sunshine82]

Greetings.

I can’t quite determine how you are maintaining overnight temperatures? I read you have a basking light, good, but no reference to any other heating source attached to a thermostat to maintain a solid 80 F ambient throughout the day and night.

Info from the care sheet:

Heating and Lighting:
Use a 65 watt incandescent flood bulb on a 12 hour timer and adjust the height of the fixture to get a hot spot of around 100 directly under the bulb. Then use a ceramic heating element set to 80 degrees on a reptile thermostat to maintain ambient temperature in the enclosure. Sometimes the basking lamp raises the day time ambient into the low 90s. "Ambient should be no lower than 80, but drifting up to 90 during the heat of the day is good…" This is fine and the thermostat will keep your CHE off during these times, but ready to click on after the basking lamp clicks off and the ambient temperature starts to drop at night. I use long florescent tubes when I want to brighten up the whole enclosure and I run these on the same timer as the basking bulb. The above are just what works for me and are suggestions for what might work for you. Every enclosure and home is different, and some customization will usually be necessary to get things "just right".

Best of luck n Happy Torting

Thanks for the info.

I originally was only using one light at night. It was a 100 W night heat lamp ( the purple version )
Since then I've added a thermostat and a ceramic heating element.
I do realize now that my temperatures are not on target for an optimal environment.

 

[Sunshine82]

Welcome!

Here is the caresheet Chasen mentioned. Is says Sulcata tortoise but the care is the same.
It sounds like something is wrong so check your temps and humidity against the caresheet. Soak her often. Post pics of your setup and we can trouble shoot for you.

I love her name. Is it from the Land Before Time? I loved that movie!

Littlefoot is from the movie.

 

[Sunshine82]

You've come to the right place. Have a read on the care sheets provided on this forum, make sure your humidity and temps are where they should be, basking spot is provided and you're giving daily soaks. The experienced members here will provide you with much more in depth advice. I purchased a hatchling at an expo in July and he was just never as vigorous as I thought she should be. After finding this forum I discovered the proper husbandry for the little ones and realized mine hadn't had the right start in life. I got everything in order and just made him as good a life as I could. Right about the time that I had resigned myself to the inevitable, I was given a suggestion to do carrot soaks. It was the miracle cure my youngster needed. He turned a corner and is now thriving. I don't know if it's the miracle for your Littlefoot, but I can't imagine it will do any harm. Good luck and hope he pulls thru.

That's Awesome ! I'm hoping for the same miracle

 

[Sunshine82]

I can't know for sure from reading a story and looking at pictures, but my GUESS is that the tortoise isn't warm enough. I've had good luck with this type of temperature reader:

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Greenpro...hguid=ef7bc5e4-661-168619d6d929a4&athena=true

You want your baby's WHOLE enclosure to be in the 80-85F range down at baby level.

You asked if it were normal. To answer the question, I'll tell you what my baby leopard does. The light (on a timer) comes on at 6a. The baby comes out of his cave and sits under the light. I put down the food at this time. After he's sat under the light for a half hour or so, he wanders over to the food and eats his fill. There's still a lot of food left when he's finished. Then he wanders back over to the light and sits there for another few minutes before going back into the cave. Throughout the day he repeats this process until, at the end of the day, all the food is gone.

Thanks for the information Yvonne.

I bought some digital thermometers from the pet store but I will also check out the ones from Walmart.
Littlefoot has a similar routine and started out with a good appetite. As soon as the lights come on she heads write for her food plate. It was just this past week I noticed she would fall asleep when she got to her food and not eat much.

 

[Sunshine82]

I see two main possibilities:

1. Improper set up. I see one fixture there. What is in it? You need something to maintain ambient heat day and night, a daytime basking lamp, a UV lamp and sometimes additional light just for brightness. What ever is in that fixture, you are still missing the other elements.
2. Most breeders start babies of this species all wrong and much too dry. Its sad, but true. I'd say most of them from most breeders don't survive. Here is more explanation on that: https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/hatchling-failure-syndrome.23493/. One clue is that this breeder sold this baby to a novice tortoise keeper at only three weeks old. This tells me about their mindset and experience level. I hold babies for at least 6 weeks in most cases, and I won't sell them unless I'm seeing every indication of health and growth. At only 3 weeks, a breeder really can't be sure yet. I will only sell them to very experienced tortoise keepers that I personally know when they are under one month old.

More bad news: Most vets have no idea what they are doing with a tortoise. All that stuff they did is probably going to kill this baby. Babies can't handle all that stuff, even when they are healthy. The vet didn't seem to understand what was wrong and treated things that are not the issue.


Once we see the answers to these questions, we can narrow down the focus and hopefully figure this out.

 

[Sunshine82]

I see two main possibilities:

1. Improper set up. I see one fixture there. What is in it? You need something to maintain ambient heat day and night, a daytime basking lamp, a UV lamp and sometimes additional light just for brightness. What ever is in that fixture, you are still missing the other elements.
2. Most breeders start babies of this species all wrong and much too dry. Its sad, but true. I'd say most of them from most breeders don't survive. Here is more explanation on that: https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/hatchling-failure-syndrome.23493/. One clue is that this breeder sold this baby to a novice tortoise keeper at only three weeks old. This tells me about their mindset and experience level. I hold babies for at least 6 weeks in most cases, and I won't sell them unless I'm seeing every indication of health and growth. At only 3 weeks, a breeder really can't be sure yet. I will only sell them to very experienced tortoise keepers that I personally know when they are under one month old.

More bad news: Most vets have no idea what they are doing with a tortoise. All that stuff they did is probably going to kill this baby. Babies can't handle all that stuff, even when they are healthy. The vet didn't seem to understand what was wrong and treated things that are not the issue.


Once we see the answers to these questions, we can narrow down the focus and hopefully figure this out.

Thanks Tom

I have two fixtures in the picture One is a Arcadia 24 W 22 inch D3 reptile Lamp 12 % UVB. You can not see it in the picture because I have a screen on top of the enclosure and it is underneath. I did read that screens can interfere with UVB so I put it underneath. I have this now on a 12 hour timer
The other is a 100 W Daytime Multipurpose Heat Lamp (by Exo Terra) I leave them both on for about 12-13 hours a day. I've also installed an under tank heater
During the night I use a 100 W Night Heat Lamp - night vision it's a purple bulb.
I've also added a ceramic heat emitter on a thermostat. I admit I did not have that at the very beginning but I have since added it to help with the temperature.
I have three digital thermometers. Two are Exo-Terra brand I got in the reptile section at the pet store. The third is a digital home thermometer that measures humidity and temperature.
The temperatures right now in night mode are 78.1, 79.3 and 78 with 69& humidity
I was / still am having trouble with the humidity. I've had a reptile fogger almost since I first got her. Recently I've noticed that she seems to be negatively impacted by the fogger. I discovered that it blows cool mist into the enclosure.
I thought she developed pneumonia from the cool mist from the fogger that is why I initially took her to the vet.
The vet did state that normally they do not treat for parasites but since her intestines were slightly inflamed and the moderate gas they thought she was being sensitive to the issue. Because of her size ( her weight is one ounce and she is about 2.5 inches long ) they only gave her one drop of the medication.
The morning after the appointment she responded positively. She woke up and after a soak ate her food. She made a couple cycles between eating and sleeping and emptied her dish that day. I did at the advice of the vet increase the temperature in her enclosure by adding a second heat source the same day.
Since her appointment she has improved slightly but no weight gain. She is more responsive and continues to have a good appetite.
Today for the first time in awhile I saw her walking around her enclosure
I know the odds are probably not in her favor but I don't want to give up.

 

[Chasen]

Thanks Chasen

Littlefoot has shown some improvement in the last few days. She is more active and responsive and is eating more.
I don't know if it will be enough but I'll take it as a good sign for now.

Improvement is a good start. Best wishes

 

[Tortuga Girl]

I use spangum moss (not peat moss) , the kind you use for orchids and I dip it in water and ring it out. I bed my baby tortoises in this the first three months and it keeps the moisture in the tank . I also add organic canned pumpkin to their diet once or twice a week and I sprinkle a pinch vitamineral green( available on amazon)on their food once a week. Good luck, it sounds like you are doing the right things. I am just throwing some things that consistently work for me out there.

 

[Tortuga Girl]

Correct spelling for the moss is SPHAGNUM.

 

[Grandpa Turtle 144]

Correct spelling for the moss is SPHAGNUM.

We are here to help people with their torts ! Not to correct their spelling problems ! They may speak English as a second language. And it’s 2019 we have spell check ! Have a great day [emoji217]

 

[Sunshine82]

I use spangum moss (not peat moss) , the kind you use for orchids and I dip it in water and ring it out. I bed my baby tortoises in this the first three months and it keeps the moisture in the tank . I also add organic canned pumpkin to their diet once or twice a week and I sprinkle a pinch vitamineral green( available on amazon)on their food once a week. Good luck, it sounds like you are doing the right things. I am just throwing some things that consistently work for me out there.

Thanks !!
I already bought the pumpkin. I will check out the vitamins.
I already have some moss but wasn’t sure if I was going to use it. Maybe I will try.

Littlefoot is showing small improvements. She was up and getting herself a drink of water this morning. We shall see

By the way I didn’t even notice the spelling error

Thanks again for the advice