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My angulate

TortillaTheTortioise

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Recently got a hatchling angulate tortoise. I live in its native country so they are quite common here :)

His round about a month old, not sure about the gender so I call him a him because he does have a tiny concave in his bottom shell I can feel when I pick him up, he also keeps his tail tucked to the side.

I have owned angulates before in the passed

I'll be posting some pictures of Tortilla and what he eats daily

•He wakes up at 7:30am when I put his lamp on, he will then eat for an hour

•He will go back to sleep and come out in the afternoon for 4 hours, go outside in his pen and eat some more

•He will burrow in his potting soil and sleep from 6pm, his lamp goes off at 7 when the sun sets
IMG_20190422_100134.jpg IMG_20190430_151105.jpg IMG_20190424_161233.jpg IMG_20190430_151105.jpg IMG_20190424_161233.jpg
 

TortillaTheTortioise

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Some pictures loaded doubles-sorry! Not sure why

His in a 52cm and 34cm open top tub with potting soil, succulents, sedum, aloes, grass and ice plant growing in the soil. He gets natural UVB everyday for 3-4 hours and gets weeds and grass

I mist the cage several times a day to have a bit of humidity (5IMG_20190428_082434.jpg IMG_20190422_100159.jpg 0-60%) Im conflicting different cage setups because angulates are susceptible to shell rot and I've seen a lot of angulates growing up in wet areas with it.
 
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Sterant

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I'm raising a baby angulate in monsoon conditions as I would a radiated tortoise and it is growing perfectly smooth - no signs of any shell issues yet, but time will tell.
 

TortillaTheTortioise

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I'm raising a baby angulate in monsoon conditions as I would a radiated tortoise and it is growing perfectly smooth - no signs of any shell issues yet, but time will tell.
Because tortilla is a newly acquired tortoise I'm doing research on people's different angulate set ups, humidity and diets to plan for future enclosures and cage conditions. I'll do some research on monsoon conditions, another experienced angulate member CarolM suggested closed chambers which I am also looking into
 

Sterant

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Because tortilla is a newly acquired tortoise I'm doing research on people's different angulate set ups, humidity and diets to plan for future enclosures and cage conditions. I'll do some research on monsoon conditions, another experienced angulate member CarolM suggested closed chambers which I am also looking into
Yes - Closed Chamber is the proper term and that's what I use to replicate the humid conditions. I also think things might be different for you than they are for me depending on where you got your baby and if it was exposed to wild animals / bacteria / parasites, etc... I am finding drastic differences in almost every aspect, between Wild Caught animals and truly Captive Bred animals. By Truly Captive, I mean born in an incubator using non-native substrate vs. babies born outdoors but inside some sort of fenced in area, thereby referring to them as "captive".
 

TortillaTheTortioise

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Yes - Closed Chamber is the proper term and that's what I use to replicate the humid conditions. I also think things might be different for you than they are for me depending on where you got your baby and if it was exposed to wild animals / bacteria / parasites, etc... I am finding drastic differences in almost every aspect, between Wild Caught animals and truly Captive Bred animals. By Truly Captive, I mean born in an incubator using non-native substrate vs. babies born outdoors but inside some sort of fenced in area, thereby referring to them as "captive".
His a garden hatchling, so he was never in an incubator but was a garden. I do use potting soil and plants from outside, as this was what his been eating and living before I got him.
With the closed chambers, can tortoises more easily get respiratory infections and shell rot? I know someone who has a angulate living in there garden and it grew up in wet conditions from sprinklers and the shell is rotting and turning black (it's about 15-20 years old now) so that's why I'm worried about humidity and moisture

It's hard to keep up with info on the enclosure sizes and conditions because every site has different views on how a tortoises should be kept and angulates aren't a very talked about topic in the tortoise community
 

Sterant

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It's hard to keep up with info on the enclosure sizes and conditions because every site has different views on how a tortoises should be kept and angulates aren't a very talked about topic in the tortoise community
I am trying to change that ;-)

This is a complicated topic. I have seen Wild Caught animals respond very badly to wet conditions. I have seen CB animals in the US deal with very humid conditions for years on end with no ill-effects. I am convinced , through testing and research I have personally done, this has to do with bacterial and parasitic loads that WC animals carry. These loads seem to be mitigated in the wild (through diet, seasonality, etc??), but can quickly overcome an animal that has been taken into captivity.

So, for you, the question is - has your baby been exposed to these same things in its short time outdoors. I don't know. And, more importantly, will it be exposed in captivity due to the fact that you are feeding it foods from outside, handling it, etc... Likely - yes. And, to complicate things - your animal will not be exposed to the natural diet and seasonal conditions that might allow the animal to keep these pathogens under control. The one major thing, however, that your animal will not have to endure, which WC animals in the US do, is the extreme stress of capture, shipment, new diet, new climate, being confined in an enclosure, etc... Yours will never see those stresses, and that's a significant consideration.

I am raising my baby , here in the US, in a humid closed chamber. RH is always above 85%, daily soaks, daily misting, water always available to drink. I am using orchid bark as the substrate. I will let you know if I see any issues I would attribute to the humidity - shell rot, respiratory issues, etc... I don't expect I will.



Dan
 

CarolM

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His a garden hatchling, so he was never in an incubator but was a garden. I do use potting soil and plants from outside, as this was what his been eating and living before I got him.
With the closed chambers, can tortoises more easily get respiratory infections and shell rot? I know someone who has a angulate living in there garden and it grew up in wet conditions from sprinklers and the shell is rotting and turning black (it's about 15-20 years old now) so that's why I'm worried about humidity and moisture

It's hard to keep up with info on the enclosure sizes and conditions because every site has different views on how a tortoises should be kept and angulates aren't a very talked about topic in the tortoise community
There is a trick to it. In my enclosure I put coco coir which holds water well and then I put orchard bark on the top. I also keep lots of plants in the enclosure. That way the humidity stays high, from the wet substrate under the orchard bark and from the plants. And the torts stay dry from the relatively dry orchard bark on the top.
And regarding the RI remember I mentioned that if your temps are correct then the humidity will not cause RI problems. Your tort needs to be warm and wet, not cold and wet. The latter will make it sick and the former will keep it nice and healthy.
 

CarolM

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Because tortilla is a newly acquired tortoise I'm doing research on people's different angulate set ups, humidity and diets to plan for future enclosures and cage conditions. I'll do some research on monsoon conditions, another experienced angulate member CarolM suggested closed chambers which I am also looking into
Thank you for the compliment, however Dan (Sterant) is the person I turn to when I need advice.
 

TortillaTheTortioise

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@CarolM @Sterant

Tortilla is doing amazing, his growing slowly but steady, his about 1 and a half months old and is 5cm in length, I just realised my kitchen scale is faulty so he could weigh any where between 25-35g, his weight was 31g the other day, then pooped and peed and lost some grams.

He eats succulents, Burgess mountain range guinea pig dried plants and lots of different weeds.

He made his first poop in his soak on Friday and then pooped on his newly washed clean towel the next day!

Here's some pics, he seems to have a knob on his front scute that his had since I got him, is that normal? Otherwise his shell is smooth and flat-no signs of pyramiding yet from his dryer conditions IMG_20190518_173504.jpg
 

TortillaTheTortioise

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He also loves to be handfed on my lap while I watch TV, I didn't know he could eat so much! He eats 2-3 times a day. his gotten so used to being handled he hardly ever gets scared and goes in his shell, will even explore my desk while I'm working.
 

TortillaTheTortioise

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Here's some more photos I took today, not sure why the first few make his shell look wet, I think it's just the lighting. IMG_20190519_151813.jpg IMG_20190519_151750.jpg IMG_20190519_151805.jpg IMG_20190519_151832.jpg
 

CarolM

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Sterant

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Looks great to me. The fact that the new growth is plump and stands proud of the initial scute is good. If he were starting to pyramid than the new growth would be lower than the older growth. What is the humidity in the enclosure and what are you using for lighting? I don't see a basking lamp. I don't use basking lamps for my babies.
 

CarolM

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Looks great to me. The fact that the new growth is plump and stands proud of the initial scute is good. If he were starting to pyramid than the new growth would be lower than the older growth. What is the humidity in the enclosure and what are you using for lighting? I don't see a basking lamp. I don't use basking lamps for my babies.
Aahhh, I have learn't something new. Good to know. [emoji3]
 

TortillaTheTortioise

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Looks great to me. The fact that the new growth is plump and stands proud of the initial scute is good. If he were starting to pyramid than the new growth would be lower than the older growth. What is the humidity in the enclosure and what are you using for lighting? I don't see a basking lamp. I don't use basking lamps for my babies.
The humidity is low, depending on the weather here, mostly 40-60% humidity. I'm not keeping him in a humid environment even tho I know it's recommended on the forum. He does have a basking light at 33°C and then a cooler side of 22-24°C with an ambient temp of 26°C

He sleeps under the basking lamp, but he can get quite hot to the touch, is that good or bad?
 
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