Two angulates, two very different behaviours

batchick

Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2012
Messages
124
Hi All - Been several years since I last posted. We've had Ned, our Angulate for about 10 years. He lives in our garden in Cape Town, which we planted up with all indigenous plants after he arrived. About a month ago, the neighbours delivered a second angulate to us ("Not Ned") on the assumption that it was Ned escaped. We tried to see if there was an owner missing a tort in the nieghbourhood, but no-one seems to be, so we are in the process of getting a permit for him too. The garden is big enough that they're not competing much.
Now - a question. Not Ned behaves completely differently to Ned. While Ned races around the garden most of the day most days and is constantly on the scrounge for food, Not Ned is much more sedentary. He's got his patch that he walks around in, but not that much and eats pretty well only from there. I have checked his poop and there's no paragraphs. While sometimes his urine has urates, he doesn't seem to be dehydrated. Do you think he's just a lethargic kind of guy, and the Ned is just a little hyper, or should I be concerned?
 

Tom

The Dog Trainer
10 Year Member!
Platinum Tortoise Club
Joined
Jan 9, 2010
Messages
54,786
Location (City and/or State)
Southern California
Welcome back.

I have seen this species kept in large outdoor pens in large groups in the RSA, but normally, they need to be housed individually as adults. They are very territorial. Ned is in his "home" territory, is very comfortable with your family and his surroundings, and Not Ned has just been deposited in a very foreign land where he is feeling very out of his element, and he knows from scent and sight that another tortoise already dominates this strange area and he doesn't want to be there, but he can't escape, he doesn't know where to escape to, and he can't seem to find any familiar scents or landmarks to tell him how to get "home". Very stressful time to be "lost" and stuck in some other tortoises territory where he knows he shouldn't be.

Daily soaks, or every other day, will help get Not Ned rehydrated and keep him healthy while he adjusts.

You need to make a separate pen for Not Ned and keep them apart at all times. If they are male and female and you want to breed them, you can periodically introduce the female into the male's territory during the breeding seasons, but keep them separate the rest of the time.

Here is updated care info. This is exactly how I house my Chersina, and the pics are of my Chersina house. My climate is very similar to yours, although the seasons are reversed.

Eventually, Not Ned will either adapt, get comfortable and healthy, and survive, or he'll remain overly stressed, not adapt, and die. If he gets comfortable and healthy, you can expect them to do battle and hurt each other badly.
 

batchick

Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2012
Messages
124
Welcome back.

I have seen this species kept in large outdoor pens in large groups in the RSA, but normally, they need to be housed individually as adults. They are very territorial. Ned is in his "home" territory, is very comfortable with your family and his surroundings, and Not Ned has just been deposited in a very foreign land where he is feeling very out of his element, and he knows from scent and sight that another tortoise already dominates this strange area and he doesn't want to be there, but he can't escape, he doesn't know where to escape to, and he can't seem to find any familiar scents or landmarks to tell him how to get "home". Very stressful time to be "lost" and stuck in some other tortoises territory where he knows he shouldn't be.

Daily soaks, or every other day, will help get Not Ned rehydrated and keep him healthy while he adjusts.

You need to make a separate pen for Not Ned and keep them apart at all times. If they are male and female and you want to breed them, you can periodically introduce the female into the male's territory during the breeding seasons, but keep them separate the rest of the time.

Here is updated care info. This is exactly how I house my Chersina, and the pics are of my Chersina house. My climate is very similar to yours, although the seasons are reversed.

Eventually, Not Ned will either adapt, get comfortable and healthy, and survive, or he'll remain overly stressed, not adapt, and die. If he gets comfortable and healthy, you can expect them to do battle and hurt each other badly.

Thanks Tom. Great to get your perspective. I had been hoping that our garden would be big enough to accommodate both. We've been watching them closely, given that we're working from home (Thanks 2020). Every third day or so there is a bit of scrapping from Ned (he's got a bit of a size advantage, as well as the territorial advantage).

I will speak to the permitting agency to find out what a safe release plan for Not Ned is, if that's the best option for him, as no-one seems to be looking for him.
 

Yvonne G

Old Timer
TFO Admin
10 Year Member!
Platinum Tortoise Club
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
89,274
Location (City and/or State)
Clovis, CA
I'd love to see pictures,
 

Sterant

Well-Known Member
Tortoise Club
5 Year Member
Platinum Tortoise Club
Joined
Mar 6, 2016
Messages
687
Location (City and/or State)
Albany, NY
I can tell you from personal experience that two males together will get very aggressive and potentially dangerous very quickly. A male and a female is also bad as the males are very aggressive and relentless breeders. Two females, though not outwardly problematic, do bully and isn't a good idea. I keep all of my adults separate other than for weekly breeding - which I only allow for a few hours.
 
Top