illness & throwing up

[tvboys]

so uh, sorry if this isn't the place to post this, sort of out of options and desperate tbh

our russian tortoise (~11 - 14 y/o) was recently prescribed danofloxacin for respiratory issues. maybe 10 to 15 minutes after her shot, she got ill.
at ~6 - 7 pm tonight (no vets open, of course we'd get that unlucky; not to mention no emergency vets that'll take her) she started vomiting.

we raised her temperature since she was a bit cold and made sure she at least got water through a 10-ish minute soak. it was hard to tell if she did drink, seeing as we had to put her back early after she got ill in the water and we didn't want to risk her drowning herself at this point. she's vomited 5 times at this point. the first 2 - 3 had food, but the remainders didn't have much of anything other than foamy spit.

her enclosure has been cold lately (under 70 degrees) but considering my life situation, i wasn't able to do anything about it. i know, that sounds bad, but i'm disabled and unable to get access to things she needs (and the person who could in this household did not believe/know(?) it was an issue until she started showing symptoms of illness.) currently, the back end of her enclosure is 70-75 and the front is 76.8 (i know, still low, the best we have right now. i'm sorry)

again, sorry for being a newbie, i promise to be out of everyones hair after.

 

[KarenSoCal]

Since she's a Russian, normally the current temps you stated would be OK for her. Russians don't need the amount of heat that other species require.

However, because of her respiratory infection, her temps should be raised. A couple of suggestions...first, does her enclosure have a top on it? If it is open topped, find something to put over it. You could try a blanket, a plastic tarp of some kind, like a shower curtain, or even aluminum foil. Just be careful that you place the cover so it doesn't catch fire from the lights.

Do you have a hot water bottle? Some of the "ice" packs you can buy can also be heated. Maybe you have one. If you have a lamp that you could remove the shade, you could possibly hang the lamp in the enclosure to provide some heat...again, be very careful of fire dangers. Ideally you could raise the enclosure temp to at least 80°, and preferably to 85°.

Soak her in warm water for as long as you can, at least twice a day. Assuming she has some kind of heat in her enclosure, add some water in to her substrate, just enough to make it damp, not wet. The additional humidity will help her respiratory infection. If there is no heat supply in the enclosure, don't dampen the substrate. Cold + damp = resp illness.

Was it a vet who injected her with danofloxacin? If so, don't ever go back there! That drug is prescribed for beef cattle! I doubt if it should ever have been given to a tortoise! Hopefully she will recover from this, but also keep an eye on her skin where she was injected (where was she injected? Front or back legs?). It can cause skin and muscle damage at the site. It is very important that you keep her hydrated well as long as she is vomiting. It's also important that you find a vet who knows about reptiles; usually they are called exotic vets.

I'm tagging a couple members who may be able to offer more assistance.

@Yvonne G
@Tom
@zovick
Do you have any suggestions?

 

[Tom]

so uh, sorry if this isn't the place to post this, sort of out of options and desperate tbh

our russian tortoise (~11 - 14 y/o) was recently prescribed danofloxacin for respiratory issues. maybe 10 to 15 minutes after her shot, she got ill.
at ~6 - 7 pm tonight (no vets open, of course we'd get that unlucky; not to mention no emergency vets that'll take her) she started vomiting.

we raised her temperature since she was a bit cold and made sure she at least got water through a 10-ish minute soak. it was hard to tell if she did drink, seeing as we had to put her back early after she got ill in the water and we didn't want to risk her drowning herself at this point. she's vomited 5 times at this point. the first 2 - 3 had food, but the remainders didn't have much of anything other than foamy spit.

her enclosure has been cold lately (under 70 degrees) but considering my life situation, i wasn't able to do anything about it. i know, that sounds bad, but i'm disabled and unable to get access to things she needs (and the person who could in this household did not believe/know(?) it was an issue until she started showing symptoms of illness.) currently, the back end of her enclosure is 70-75 and the front is 76.8 (i know, still low, the best we have right now. i'm sorry)

again, sorry for being a newbie, i promise to be out of everyones hair after.

70 is fine for night and the cool side, but the tortoise must have a basking lamp during the day so it can warm up. If you can't provide this, you need to immediately give the tortoise to someone who can. They can't survive without it.

Read this for the correct care info:

The Best Way To Raise Any Temperate Species Of Tortoise

I chose the title of this care sheet very carefully. Are there other ways to raise babies and care for adults? Yes. Yes there are, but those ways are not as good. What follows is the BEST way, according to 30 years of research and experimentation with hundreds of babies of many species. What is...

tortoiseforum.org

The only way for this tortoise to recover is for you to offer it the correct environmental parameters.

 

[tvboys]

Since she's a Russian, normally the current temps you stated would be OK for her. Russians don't need the amount of heat that other species require.

However, because of her respiratory infection, her temps should be raised. A couple of suggestions...first, does her enclosure have a top on it? If it is open topped, find something to put over it. You could try a blanket, a plastic tarp of some kind, like a shower curtain, or even aluminum foil. Just be careful that you place the cover so it doesn't catch fire from the lights.

Do you have a hot water bottle? Some of the "ice" packs you can buy can also be heated. Maybe you have one. If you have a lamp that you could remove the shade, you could possibly hang the lamp in the enclosure to provide some heat...again, be very careful of fire dangers. Ideally you could raise the enclosure temp to at least 80°, and preferably to 85°.

Soak her in warm water for as long as you can, at least twice a day. Assuming she has some kind of heat in her enclosure, add some water in to her substrate, just enough to make it damp, not wet. The additional humidity will help her respiratory infection. If there is no heat supply in the enclosure, don't dampen the substrate. Cold + damp = resp illness.

Was it a vet who injected her with danofloxacin? If so, don't ever go back there! That drug is prescribed for beef cattle! I doubt if it should ever have been given to a tortoise! Hopefully she will recover from this, but also keep an eye on her skin where she was injected. It can cause skin and muscle damage at the site. It is very important that you keep her hydrated well as long as she is vomiting. It's also important that you find a vet who knows about reptiles; usually they are called exotic vets.

I'm tagging a couple members who may be able to offer more assistance.

@Yvonne G
@Tom
@zovick
Do you have any suggestions?

thank you so much for the reply and tags, i wasn't entirely sure how to go about this

right now she's asleep so i'm worried about stressing her out if i put her in for a soak; she's gotten another soak since first post (& vomited two more times) but she still hasn't been in very long because of how much she whips her head around when she vomits.

as for her vet, absolutely we're never going back. any mentions of the medicine i had seen prior were in reference to gopher tortoises, so i was under the assumption "hey, he's the professional"; not to mention i got the whole "i know what i'm doing and you don't" spiel when i asked about gopher tortoise vs russian. i had no idea about beef cattle. the vet himself does have certifications and is referred to as their exotic vet, but i should have been more cautious.

she was injected in her front left leg, i believe? she seems to be holding it a bit odd (not completely putting weight on it), but right now, the area generally looks fine. i'm keeping an eye on it but i don't see it looking too much different from her appointment.

i don't know how many exotic vets there are in town, since so few seem willing to take her. we've called around almost everywhere that even vaguely mentions exotic pet; hopefully we can find one who can. in the meanwhile i'm keeping an eye on her, the only vets we have as (theoretical) options open in ~6 - 11 hours and i don't know if she'll make it until then with how sickly she seems right now.

i'll see if i can find any blankets or clean tarps and safe ways to put them over her enclosure, since you're right on it being open top. the lamps are installed with god-awful clips that hang up & point over, so i'm sure they're not as close as they could be; i'll see what i can do in addition to that so long as she can't reach them.

as for the water bottle, i'll have to fish around. i'm not entirely sure what to do with it from there seeing as she has a bad habit of chewing on things she finds odd or new, but right now, she might be too sleepy to even consider.

70 is fine for night and the cool side, but the tortoise must have a basking lamp during the day so it can warm up. If you can't provide this, you need to immediately give the tortoise to someone who can. They can't survive without it.

Read this for the correct care info:

The Best Way To Raise Any Temperate Species Of Tortoise

I chose the title of this care sheet very carefully. Are there other ways to raise babies and care for adults? Yes. Yes there are, but those ways are not as good. What follows is the BEST way, according to 30 years of research and experimentation with hundreds of babies of many species. What is...

tortoiseforum.org

The only way for this tortoise to recover is for you to offer it the correct environmental parameters.

she does have a basking lamp thankfully, it's really the best thing she has. she's resting under it at the moment. i've read through the guide thoroughly and have followed the steps the best i can with the options i have available, but right now, said options are limited.

she was an impulse purchase from someone else in the household so unfortunately rehoming her is a bit of a tricky option, but hopefully i can get them to consider should it be necessary. so far, everyone's working with me when it comes to getting her care, but i'm worried about that changing.

 

[TammyJ]

I really hope the little tortoise recovers. You are certainly doing what you can. Good luck!

 

[tvboys]

I really hope the little tortoise recovers. You are certainly doing what you can. Good luck!

thank you so much, it's really comforting to hear that
i hope she does too, she's a silly little guy and deserves nothing but the best

 

[Maggie3fan]

thank you so much, it's really comforting to hear that
i hope she does too, she's a silly little guy and deserves nothing but the best

Hi may I ask where you are in Washington? I'm in Corvallis Oregon. It's possible I could help you...also any equipment you need for the tort can be found on Amazon...you don't have to even leave the house. That might make you a little less dependent on anybody else. I have some equipment you might need...I can bring you...if you want. No place in Washington is too far for me. Let me know if you need my help...also I imagine that TFO can give you recommendations about me...haha good or bad...

 

[tvboys]

Hi may I ask where you are in Washington? I'm in Corvallis Oregon. It's possible I could help you...also any equipment you need for the tort can be found on Amazon...you don't have to even leave the house. That might make you a little less dependent on anybody else. I have some equipment you might need...I can bring you...if you want. No place in Washington is too far for me. Let me know if you need my help...also I imagine that TFO can give you recommendations about me...haha good or bad...

thank you so much for the offer, but i wouldn't want to burden you any unless i had to. i'll stick with amazon if i can, once i can get ahold of my card again. i'll make sure to message you if i need to, though! its an absolute help, thank you so much

 

[Maggie3fan]

thank you so much for the offer, but i wouldn't want to burden you any unless i had to. i'll stick with amazon if i can, once i can get ahold of my card again. i'll make sure to message you if i need to, though! its an absolute help, thank you so much

Frankly...it's no burden, It's what I do. The offer is there...

 

[tvboys]

Frankly...it's no burden, It's what I do. The offer is there...

thank you so much either way. i'll message you if needed, but i'm hoping i don't have to get to that quite yet.

 

[Maggie3fan]

thank you so much either way. i'll message you if needed, but i'm hoping i don't have to get to that quite yet.

If a tortoise vomits, you must try to find a cause of the vomit and remove it. Vomiting is not common in tortoises and can be serious. If this behavior persists after changes to diet and living conditions.

 

[tvboys]

If a tortoise vomits, you must try to find a cause of the vomit and remove it. Vomiting is not common in tortoises and can be serious. If this behavior persists after changes to diet and living conditions.

we're working on finding the cause right now and have figured its either that it was too cold, the medicine she was prescribed, or because of dehydration since she hasn't been interested in soaking lately. we've cleaned up her enclosure pretty thoroughly and we're hoping to get her to a different vet once they're able to see her. thank you for the help

 

[TammyJ]

I think you should be aware that the little one may die from dehydration before anything else. Long, warm (warm like you would have it for a human baby's bath) soaks are very much indicated! This may save his life, and in any case, can do no harm. Make the water level just to where his top and bottom shells meet. You can also add Pedialyte to the water.

 

[TammyJ]

When taking her out of the warm soak, put her quickly into her warm enclosure so she is not exposed to cold air.

 

[TammyJ]

It seems to me that the vomiting is a result of the medication she was injected with. Most likely, in my view.

 

[Yvonne G]

Danofloxacin is a broad spectrum antibiotic used to treat respiratory infections in swine, cattle and chickens. This is fine, however, because it's an injectable, I'm thinking the vet overdosed the tortoise. There's quite a bit of difference in the weight of a chicken per the weight of a tortoise (without his shell).

I suggest daily soaks in warm water for at least an hour each time for about a week to help get the drug out of his system.

 

[zovick]

Danofloxacin is a broad spectrum antibiotic used to treat respiratory infections in swine, cattle and chickens. This is fine, however, because it's an injectable, I'm thinking the vet overdosed the tortoise. There's quite a bit of difference in the weight of a chicken per the weight of a tortoise (without his shell).

I suggest daily soaks in warm water for at least an hour each time for about a week to help get the drug out of his system.

Danofloxacin (Advocin) is in the same "family" of drugs as Baytril (enrofloxacin) which is most likely the reason the tortoise is favoring the leg where it was injected. The same reaction is often noted with Baytril injections.

The vomiting may be due to the drug as well. I would not use it (or Baytril) to inject any tortoise which I owned.

Hopefully the tortoise will be able to overcome the problems and survive.

 

[tvboys]

thank you everyone for the replies! i'm getting her a soak as we speak since shes awake now. shes still very lethargic, but she's at least acknowledging we're here, now. i'll make sure to mention all of this to the vet when we get her there.

 

[TammyJ]

thank you everyone for the replies! i'm getting her a soak as we speak since shes awake now. shes still very lethargic, but she's at least acknowledging we're here, now. i'll make sure to mention all of this to the vet when we get her there.

Remember also that the stress of being moved around and being treated can affect her, so try to organize things so that she is not subjected to more manipulation than absolutely necessary. Keep her quiet, snug and warm.

 

[tvboys]

Remember also that the stress of being moved around and being treated can affect her, so try to organize things so that she is not subjected to more manipulation than absolutely necessary. Keep her quiet, snug and warm.

i've made sure to set up everything in advance, but reminders always help. thank you!