EVs?

[ZEROPILOT]

I know that I'm going to be a minority.
I'm just a fan of internal combustion engines and I haven't been able to get over my dislike of EVs.
I like the mechanical parts, the smells, the sounds. All of it.
I have 3 old Kawaski two stroke motorcycles. These engines went out of favor in the early 80s. Too polluting. I've kept them because of how they make me feel. Like they are alive almost.
I know that electric vehicles may even be faster and have less maintenance needs. But to me they have no "soul".
I hope I never get so old that I won't have at least one gasoline powered vehicle in my garage. (Or a shed because gasoline is no longer being made)
I'm not trying to be insensitive to the future. An alternative needs to be found. And for more than one reason.
But you asked.

 

[TheLastGreen]

50, 000

Fifty thousand! As in dollars? That's ridiculous. Here in SA we have loadsheding, (like now while I'm typing). So we installed solar, bought everything on our own, DIY as far as possible, paid for someone to install it and it cost us $4600.

 

[jsheffield]

I'm interested in owning an EV at some point, but am happy to be a late adapter, letting the first dozen generations of EVs, and groups of EV-owners, work through the kinks and birthing struggles and growing pains before I dive in.

Jamie

 

[wellington]

Fifty thousand! As in dollars? That's ridiculous. Here in SA we have loadsheding, (like now while I'm typing). So we installed solar, bought everything on our own, DIY as far as possible, paid for someone to install it and it cost us $4600.

Yes as in 50,000 dollars and I don't have a big house. I do have a big electric bill though. Over 400 in the winter, tortoise shed is the main drain. Yes it is ridiculous. They also told us we would only pay delivery charge on our electric bill of like 30 to 50 bucks, which here in Illinois is also not true.
Where Tom is, they buy his extra solar so he makes money from his, correct me @Tomif I got that wrong. Where I am, they won't buy only store it for my use but won't even buy what I might not use. I believe there is even a charge for them to store it. Not worth it yet where I am.

 

[mark1]

if electric cars are better and cheaper , it shouldn't take artificially increasing the cost of oil to sell them ........ if they are a better alternative they should sell themselves on an even playing field , shouldn't need subsidized with federal and state tax dollars ..........
“build a better mousetrap, and the world will beat a path to your door”

 

[Tom]

I know a few people that have solar. They still get a high electric bill and will be dead before they have it paid off.
I was quoted 50, 000 even if I paid cash. Wouldnt see any savings until after I was probably dead. It needs to be much cheaper then it is and I need my electric bull to be zero before I will get it.

You talked to one of those ridiculous companies with the middle men. I paid $30,000 for my system. I built it large enough to make more than I need. They pay me for the excess that goes back into the grid. It paid for itself in 5-6 years, and I put it in 12 years ago. My meter is running backwards right now.

Another way to do it is to simply get a loan form a bank or the solar company. Zero money out of pocket and instead of paying $300-400 for electricity, or in some cases $600-800, you pay $150-200 a month for your loan while your solar system generates free electricity.

 

[Tom]

if electric cars are better and cheaper , it shouldn't take artificially increasing the cost of oil to sell them ........ if they are a better alternative they should sell themselves on an even playing field , shouldn't need subsidized with federal and state tax dollars ..........
“build a better mousetrap, and the world will beat a path to your door”

Mark, I agree with this whole-heartedly. I've been watching the EV market with interest for 20 years. The point of this thread was me saying that I think we are there. It took a lot longer than I thought it would or should, and for endless reasons I'll never comprehend, but the reasons to not get one are all evaporating. I think we are balancing at the tipping point now, and the advances coming in just the next two or three years will soundly tip the advantage to the EVs. And I say this without the gas price craziness going on. Even when gas was still reasonable, we were talking .04 cents a mile (or free), vs. .20-.30 cents a mile for gas powered vehicles. The current gas prices just make it more so.

I see tremendous resistance, trepidation and suspicion from most people I've asked about it. I'm obviously pretty sold on the idea, but I want to hear from the people who see it differently and why.

 

[Tom]

I'm interested in owning an EV at some point, but am happy to be a late adapter, letting the first dozen generations of EVs, and groups of EV-owners, work through the kinks and birthing struggles and growing pains before I dive in.

Jamie

Remember the EV1 in 1996? I do. Tesla started in 2003. Other makers have been slowly joining the queue, but its been slow going for sure. I see it the same way you do. I never buy a first model year vehicle just for this reason, but its looking more and more like the bugs are worked out. The recent improvements mentioned in post number one make me think it may be time to jump. Close to it, if not.

I need a cargo van, and it looks like that is at least a year or two away. The Ford Lightning looks promising in many ways, and it has two way charging. I can power my whole house off that truck for 3-10 days in the event the power goes out. It would be amazing to be able to power my house without having to run a gennie all day and night. They are advertising a "Pro" model workhorse type starting at $32,000. Could pop a camper shell on it and use it like a van, I suppose...

 

[Okapizebra]

For me the issue would be charging. I live in an apartment complex that is old and doesn't have any EV charging parking spaces. So how do I charge my car at home? I imagine this would be an issue for many people as I'm sure a large portion of the population lives in an apartment building or something similar.

 

[wellington]

For me the issue would be charging. I live in an apartment complex that is old and doesn't have any EV charging parking spaces. So how do I charge my car at home? I imagine this would be an issue for many people as I'm sure a large portion of the population lives in an apartment building or something similar.

Many many people live in apartment buildings and high rises here in Chicago. Our hospitals are about the only places with a few charging parking spots. Maybe 5 to 10 spots. The bad thing there, the people that use them are parking there for some time, not just the charging time.

 

[wellington]

I think it's going to be quite a few years before they will sell this to enough people to make a difference. They started with the cart before the horse. They needed to get the charging figured out to the fastest it can be and then get enough of them all over the place so people would feel confident that they would always be able to charge up.
A cross over or hybrid I think they are called one of those, that uses electric and gas is a better choice.

 

[ZEROPILOT]

Yes as in 50,000 dollars and I don't have a big house. I do have a big electric bill though. Over 400 in the winter, tortoise shed is the main drain. Yes it is ridiculous. They also told us we would only pay delivery charge on our electric bill of like 30 to 50 bucks, which here in Illinois is also not true.
Where Tom is, they buy his extra solar so he makes money from his, correct me @Tomif I got that wrong. Where I am, they won't buy only store it for my use but won't even buy what I might not use. I believe there is even a charge for them to store it. Not worth it yet where I am.

Damn.
My A/C is cranked down to 73° 24/7 and I've got regular household stuff. Plus tortoise and fish pond and Chameleon electronics and my electric bill never excedes $130 a month

 

[wellington]

Damn.
My A/C is cranked down to 73° 24/7 and I've got regular household stuff. Plus tortoise and fish pond and Chameleon electronics and my electric bill never excedes $130 a month

My summer bill is around 240-260 without the AC on. I do have a hot tub that doesn't only raise the electric bill 30 some bucks like they say. Electric here not cheap. Hell nothing here is cheap. But I love Chicago anyway😁

 

[ZEROPILOT]

My summer bill is around 240-260 without the AC on. I do have a hot tub that doesn't only raise the electric bill 30 some bucks like they say. Electric here not cheap. Hell nothing here is cheap. But I love Chicago anyway😁

South Florida does have cheap gas.
It takes some of the sting out of the cost of homeowners insurance and the hurricane policy

 

[Tom]

Damn.
My A/C is cranked down to 73° 24/7 and I've got regular household stuff. Plus tortoise and fish pond and Chameleon electronics and my electric bill never excedes $130 a month

Its not uncommon for CA bills in summer with the AC running a lot to exceed $600-800 a month. And I get into that range during our coldest winter months too with all the tortoise heaters running so much.

 

[Tom]

I think it's going to be quite a few years before they will sell this to enough people to make a difference. They started with the cart before the horse. They needed to get the charging figured out to the fastest it can be and then get enough of them all over the place so people would feel confident that they would always be able to charge up.
A cross over or hybrid I think they are called one of those, that uses electric and gas is a better choice.

The full size Dodge truck that will be coming out soon has that. Its all electric, but it has a small diesel or gas engine stuck somewhere in it that will power a generator and keep you driving if your battery runs low. I designed a compact car like this for a science project in high school. I put a small Briggs and Stratten engine in the trunk with an intake and exhaust vent. I had the batteries under the hood where the engine used to go. I did not know how to calculate how much electricity could be generated by such a small engine, and I guessed that it wouldn't work because of this and that is why no one ever made one in real life. I guess I was wrong. No... wait... I guess I was right!

The Chevy Volt is like this too. Its all electric for about 170 miles, if memory serves, and if you run out of battery, the gasoline engine kicks on and keeps you driving. Best of both worlds.

All the car manufacturers are launching EVs. New car companies are popping up all over too. Rivian, Canoo, and nobody had ever heard of Tesla not too long ago. Tesla is in its infancy compared to Ford.

 

[jeff kushner]

I have a present for Z;

I know that I'm going to be a minority.
I'm just a fan of internal combustion engines and I haven't been able to get over my dislike of EVs.
I like the mechanical parts, the smells, the sounds. All of it.
I have 3 old Kawaski two stroke motorcycles. These engines went out of favor in the early 80s. Too polluting. I've kept them because of how they make me feel. Like they are alive almost.
I know that electric vehicles may even be faster and have less maintenance needs. But to me they have no "soul".
I hope I never get so old that I won't have at least one gasoline powered vehicle in my garage. (Or a shed because gasoline is no longer being made)
I'm not trying to be insensitive to the future. An alternative needs to be found. And for more than one reason.
But you asked.

Enjoy the eye candy Z, we think alike! As you can still see in the background if you open the pic in a new tab to make it bigger, this is about half my garage...the little silver car goes on the left side. You should see the b4 pics for the 2 closest, both are very highly modified, I do my own work. #3 is '75 H2-100% Stock, #4 is '82 Yammy Turbo running 18psi w/ blowoff @22, #5 is my vstrom1000 rigged for hwy I ride to Vintage Days in Ohio on it.


iF WE CAN'T SERVE UP A GIFT oops, for a Mod, who can we do it for?



That done, keep in mind folks as we discuss things, that for thousands of years there have been two classes of information. Let me explain what I mean;

We all learned for instance that Columbus discovered/proved/braved that the Earth was round and he could have FALLEN off the edge................BS.

The Greek knew hundreds of years BC that the Earth was not only round, observed by lunar eclipses, they knew the size of it as well! With no ability to read, no access to books or education, the COMMON people didn't know so they relied on word of mouth, myths etc....a lack of info in other words..........

Yet we still learned nearly two thousand years later that some guy in 1492 had something to do with the shape of the planet?

I'm not so sure it's not still the same way today......just a little different.....

There are so many competing agendas, it's difficult to discern the truth since most arguments are built on partial truths. The "News" is now so loaded with personal opinion that the Geodesic station near the cemetery where Walter Cronkite is buried is reporting near-constant Richter activity as he rolls in his grave, so most of us will wait for the dust to settle knowing that there is risk in adopting early.


When you find people who have found a way to make huge sums of money by using YOU as a tool, one should be wary, don't you think?


FWIW- I use window shakers after learning the efficiency of them, gas heat and gas FP that I use most days in the winter..........I use year round budget billing and pay 226mo for a 3200sf and I use the tstat as a personal comfort unit. According to the bill, it's underwater by a few hundred so they will prob adjust it up to 250 or 270 soon. I keep it 72W and 70S...I like to be comfy.

6-800 a month? What does one get extra for that? Sparkles, ouch?

 

[jeff kushner]

I'm breaking all kinds of forum protocols by double posting but you guys are asleep and now I'm at work, 1st couple emails out and have a cup of coffee, Toms post reminded me of that 1st Tesla......I almost bought one....it was 96-THOUSAND dollars!!! & went 200 miles but I was drooling so badly over that beautiful sports car that my wife at the time had to drug me with her womanly ways to settle me down......I'm not against EV at all. Within a week, the price jumped to 108K.........naw.......it was a cool dream but, I mean, it's not a jetpack afterall! I would put that down in a heartbeat for a jp and figure out the $$ later!

EV Jetpacks......Eureka!

 

[Maro2Bear]

Just watched this…forget the Lithium batteries….are Solid State the way to go?

 

[KarenSoCal]

What I really want is a home solar system, hardware now very affordable but the install costs are obscene (that part of the industry is a total racket).

I used a company that I was quite pleased with. There were installation delays, but they were the fault of the county I live in. I have 22 310w panels.

As for my bill, as long as I was still paying the system off, I wasn't saving any money. Remember, I live in low desert...AC runs continuously, day and night, from May through September. No rooftop system is going to fully supply that load.

I got tired of paying more interest than principal on the loan, so I paid off the remainder. Last month, the electric company credited me with $9.00 With no loan payment, I can say the system is now saving me money.