mandymo
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I already have a spurthigh but getting a hermann and horsefield next saturday, will i be able to house the 2 new ones together, they will be 6 months old x
can you have mixed species live together
- Thread starter mandymo
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It is a poor idea. There is a herpes virus that Greek tortoises carry, but are unaffected by; is is easily transmissible and Hermann's are susceptible.
In a mixed collection is is very important to keep the species apart, and to wash your hands and articles between handling the different species. I'm sure other members like @HermanniChris will have something to add, but please wait before you mix the species.
In a mixed collection is is very important to keep the species apart, and to wash your hands and articles between handling the different species. I'm sure other members like @HermanniChris will have something to add, but please wait before you mix the species.
As i understand it, it is a pretty bad idea to mix male tortoises together even of the same species as they will fight.
As for mixing 2 or 3 different species, this too seems to be a no-no, not only because of possible territorial aggresion, but because of possible diseases that may be carried by one species, but not harm them, yet prove fatal to another species.
Certainly a quarantine period for new ones would be recommended.
Tortoises are pretty much solitary animals, they don't have 'friends' and don't require company to keep them happy, though they can learn to enjoy a bit of love and attention in moderation.
Some owners are successful in keeping threes or more of the same species together, usually 1 male and a group of females, but 2 never seems a good idea.
Others on this forum know far more than I, but I don't think cross-species mixing is at all a good idea.
As for mixing 2 or 3 different species, this too seems to be a no-no, not only because of possible territorial aggresion, but because of possible diseases that may be carried by one species, but not harm them, yet prove fatal to another species.
Certainly a quarantine period for new ones would be recommended.
Tortoises are pretty much solitary animals, they don't have 'friends' and don't require company to keep them happy, though they can learn to enjoy a bit of love and attention in moderation.
Some owners are successful in keeping threes or more of the same species together, usually 1 male and a group of females, but 2 never seems a good idea.
Others on this forum know far more than I, but I don't think cross-species mixing is at all a good idea.
No bad idea, for the reasons listed above.
Mixing Species is very risky, I would never advise it to anyone. IMO.. Tortoises Do Not Get Lonely, they Do Not Need A Friend, buddy, or pal. They are solitary creatures ,they see other tortoises as competition for food, and territory.. Maybe @ Tom can help explain this in more detail.
I agree with all of the above. Spelled out very well already.
Species should not be mixed.
Species should not be mixed.
Killerrookie
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Tbh it just really depends on what your mixing together. I recommend not mixing species of you don't have experience. I mix species but I know what I'm doing so just really depends.
You may THINK you know what you're doing, but you may find out the hard way some time down the road. Those pesky little micro organisms that one species lives with symbiotically just may kill a different species...and it probably won't happen today or tomorrow. But when it does I'll be willing to bet that mixing species won't be your first guess as to what went wrong.
Agreed, mixing species is a ticking time bomb. Sooner or later outbreaks will happen. CB lessens the risk however the risk is still very real.
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I wholeheartedly agree with all of the above. We need to remember one thing at all times. Tortoises are WILD animals and no matter how many times we produce them in captivity, we will never change that. Therefore, it's best we do things as close to natural as possible. Nature intended it that way and we are the ones that have stepped over those boundaries, so it's important to remember our place. Tortoises don't need or want buddies, they simply go about their lives as they have for thousands of years or more. While seeing members of their own kind is stimulating and does replicate their situation in the wild, it is just that and there isn't an emotion associated with it. On some occasions two species may encounter each other in nature where ranges overlap but they will mostly ignore one another and may not actually physically come in contact. Nature knows what it's doing. By purposely forcing different species to coexist in confinement we open new doors to new problems and possibly disaster. Tortoises are a complex group of animals that we have barely scratched the surface in truly understanding. Captive bred or not, problems exist, pathogens exist and mysterious outbreaks are a real threat not just a bad dream. Hope this helps. We're just trying to save you from a possible heartbreaking situation that very well can take place.
mandymo
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Thanks guys, i won't be mixing them, i don't want to take any risks
I've always been something of an extremist in this regard, given the experiences of my uncle and many friends. In San Antonio, many pet stores mix species when it comes to turtles and tortoises, and I never buy from these places. Petsmarts around here are always mixing Russians and Hermanns, as well as red ears, western paints, and various African sidenecks. Whenever I see this reckless behavior, it enrages me.
Mixing species is a bad idea. One of the big reasons I reduced my collection down to two species was because I was sick and tired of having to laboriously wash my hands and change my shoes when stepping between enclosures. When I was fostering tortoises, I had sulcatas, Russians, Margies, Greeks, Hermanns, and Redfoots on regular rotation, with an odd pancake or box turtle in the outlying enclosures. This meant that I would have to wash my hands a minimum of ten times between enclosures, and I had 8 pairs of slippers marked for each set of enclosures. I'm pretty fastidious, but after spending most of my twenties doing this and after the passing of my old man, I finally decided that I was burning myself out. I have serious respect for members of the forum who keep and even manage to breed multiple species of tortoise. I mean, the amount of work that goes into separating the animals, not cross contaminating food and water sources, growing and maintaining an even wider array of food items to satisfy a range of species' tastes, and maintaining a variable set of environmental systems is quite challenging, not to mention time consuming. Such dedication is truly admirable. But honestly, I just couldn't do it after a while. I had a business to run, friendships outside the tortoise hobby to maintain, and all that other stuff of life that doesn't involve tortoises (I mean, yeah, there isn't much more to life than tortoises, but still).
Now that I have Margies and one Greek, I've gotta say, life is a lot easier. I handle all the business with my Greek Graecus first, and once he's been taken care of, I change my shoes, wash my hands, and take care of my Margies. It's great. I don't have to worry about potential food contamination; I focus all my energy on growing broadleaved weeds and shrubs; I don't worry if a heavy rain or my cat Stinky is going to spread foreign parasites and pathogens between the enclosures. And after allowing the ground of the other tortoise enclosures to lay fallow for three years, I've finally decided it should be safe, and once some of the new baby margies I got last year from Gary and Chris reach subadult status, I can move them from their baby pens into what was once the Hermanns' and Russians' paddock.
If you're going to keep multiple species, then all the more power to you, but please, keep them separate. Like Chris said, there is much we don't know about the microbiology concerning tortoises. We've really just begun to scratch the surface. And mixing animals that would never encounter one another in the wild can have serious consequences, many experienced by the veteran members of this forum, others perhaps undiscovered but equally catastrophic in their potential. Whenever I speak of this, I bring up The Western European invasion of the Americas. It is estimated that one in four natives succumbed to foreign disease, many before even seeing a European face. Disease spreads quickly, and the effects can be devastating. Interestingly, the tortoise counterparts of this analogy are equally incompatible, given that Mediterranean Testudo apparently harbor pathogens that can kill North American tortoises. I can only hope that anyone given the privilege of keeping a desert or Texas tortoise has the good sense to keep them isolated from foreign species. After all, disease is a big factor in contributing to their endangered status, and lord knows they don't need any other hurdles put in the way of their survival.
T.G.
Mixing species is a bad idea. One of the big reasons I reduced my collection down to two species was because I was sick and tired of having to laboriously wash my hands and change my shoes when stepping between enclosures. When I was fostering tortoises, I had sulcatas, Russians, Margies, Greeks, Hermanns, and Redfoots on regular rotation, with an odd pancake or box turtle in the outlying enclosures. This meant that I would have to wash my hands a minimum of ten times between enclosures, and I had 8 pairs of slippers marked for each set of enclosures. I'm pretty fastidious, but after spending most of my twenties doing this and after the passing of my old man, I finally decided that I was burning myself out. I have serious respect for members of the forum who keep and even manage to breed multiple species of tortoise. I mean, the amount of work that goes into separating the animals, not cross contaminating food and water sources, growing and maintaining an even wider array of food items to satisfy a range of species' tastes, and maintaining a variable set of environmental systems is quite challenging, not to mention time consuming. Such dedication is truly admirable. But honestly, I just couldn't do it after a while. I had a business to run, friendships outside the tortoise hobby to maintain, and all that other stuff of life that doesn't involve tortoises (I mean, yeah, there isn't much more to life than tortoises, but still).
Now that I have Margies and one Greek, I've gotta say, life is a lot easier. I handle all the business with my Greek Graecus first, and once he's been taken care of, I change my shoes, wash my hands, and take care of my Margies. It's great. I don't have to worry about potential food contamination; I focus all my energy on growing broadleaved weeds and shrubs; I don't worry if a heavy rain or my cat Stinky is going to spread foreign parasites and pathogens between the enclosures. And after allowing the ground of the other tortoise enclosures to lay fallow for three years, I've finally decided it should be safe, and once some of the new baby margies I got last year from Gary and Chris reach subadult status, I can move them from their baby pens into what was once the Hermanns' and Russians' paddock.
If you're going to keep multiple species, then all the more power to you, but please, keep them separate. Like Chris said, there is much we don't know about the microbiology concerning tortoises. We've really just begun to scratch the surface. And mixing animals that would never encounter one another in the wild can have serious consequences, many experienced by the veteran members of this forum, others perhaps undiscovered but equally catastrophic in their potential. Whenever I speak of this, I bring up The Western European invasion of the Americas. It is estimated that one in four natives succumbed to foreign disease, many before even seeing a European face. Disease spreads quickly, and the effects can be devastating. Interestingly, the tortoise counterparts of this analogy are equally incompatible, given that Mediterranean Testudo apparently harbor pathogens that can kill North American tortoises. I can only hope that anyone given the privilege of keeping a desert or Texas tortoise has the good sense to keep them isolated from foreign species. After all, disease is a big factor in contributing to their endangered status, and lord knows they don't need any other hurdles put in the way of their survival.
T.G.
Actually, we have plenty of experience with interspecies pathogen cross-over if you consider smallpox, AIDS, ebola and many other human diseases caused by nasties that originated in other genera and species.
Oh yes, there is certainly a great deal of research when it comes to cross contamination in regards to humans. However, I'm simply saying there isn't anything even close to the volume of research when it comes to tortoises in particular. There is no reason to believe that interspecies contagion works too differently than this, but it is certainly plausible that there may be interactions, incredibly harmful ones, that as yet remain unstudied and poorly understood.
T.G.
T.G.
