Baby Sulcata barely growing (almost no growth at all)

[Ryuken15]

So about 4 months ago I bought a 7 cm sulcata tortoise.He is really active before I bought him and still is now.The problem is,he is not growing.When I first got him,he was 80 grams.Now he weighs about 93 grams.He eats normally but some days he just eat a bit.I gave him repcal every 3 days and veggies everyday.I just don't know the problem with him and really is confused why he isn't growing.I'll Insert a picture when I first got him.

 

[Tom]

Tell us how you are housing him. What temps? What heating and lighting equipment to achieve and maintain those temps?

What veggies are you feeding him? They should be eating mostly weeds, grasses and leaves.

 

[Ryuken15]

Tell us how you are housing him. What temps? What heating and lighting equipment to achieve and maintain those temps?

What veggies are you feeding him? They should be eating mostly weeds, grasses and leaves.

I'm housing him indoors the substrate is reptile carpet.The humidity is about 70%.I use exoterra 150 UVB and exoterra daylight basking.The temperature in the cool area is about 28-29°C and under the light 32-34°C.He rarely eats grass cause he doesn't like to eat it.The grass that he likes,unfort unfortunately is not good for him (wood sorrel).I feed him a vegetable called fumak and siomak mostly.I heard that it is one of the best food u could give the tortoise.Sometimes I also give romaine lettuce just for variety.Every week I also give him papaya so that he doesn't have bladder stone.Before his urates has a moderate amount of hardening.It is a mix of normal urates which have a consistency like toothpaste and small sand like rocks.After giving him papaya,the amount of sand like rocks has considerably decreased.

 

[Tom]

View attachment 269040 View attachment 269040

I'm housing him indoors the substrate is reptile carpet.The humidity is about 70%.I use exoterra 150 UVB and exoterra daylight basking.The temperature in the cool area is about 28-29°C and under the light 32-34°C.He rarely eats grass cause he doesn't like to eat it.The grass that he likes,unfort unfortunately is not good for him (wood sorrel).I feed him a vegetable called fumak and siomak mostly.I heard that it is one of the best food u could give the tortoise.Sometimes I also give romaine lettuce just for variety.Every week I also give him papaya so that he doesn't have bladder stone.Before his urates has a moderate amount of hardening.It is a mix of normal urates which have a consistency like toothpaste and small sand like rocks.After giving him papaya,the amount of sand like rocks has considerably decreased.

I list the problems I see:

• Reptile carpet is no good as a substrate. Fine grade orchid bark works best.
• Its highly unlikely that humidity is 70% with dry reptile carpet. Not even in a humid climate. The pyramiding that is showing is evidence of this.
• The MVB bulbs cause pyramiding too. I would switch to something different. I like 65 watt flood bulbs and florescent tubes for UV if needed.
• Babies can't eat regular grass. They need to be fed freshly sprouted soft, tender grass. If you mix it in with their food they will eat it all.
• Wood sorrel is not grass. Its a weed. Definitely don't let him eat that. You might have to sprout your own grass.
• Romaine is not a good food. I don't know those other two foods, but you should be looking for the right weeds, leaves and grasses. Some flowers and succulents are good too. Look here: https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/for-those-who-have-a-young-sulcata.76744/
• Sulcatas should never be fed fruit. The sugars mess up their intestinal flora and fauna.
• The scute formation is due to low humidity and lack of hydration. You should be soaking daily, and using the right substrate for humidity will help too.

Its all explained here:
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-sulcata-or-leopard-version-2-0.79895/

Any or all of these things could be contributing to slower growth. Also, does the tortoise live alone? Has it ever had contact with other species? That could be a factor too.

 

[Ryuken15]

I list the problems I see:

• Reptile carpet is no good as a substrate. Fine grade orchid bark works best.
• Its highly unlikely that humidity is 70% with dry reptile carpet. Not even in a humid climate. The pyramiding that is showing is evidence of this.
• The MVB bulbs cause pyramiding too. I would switch to something different. I like 65 watt flood bulbs and florescent tubes for UV if needed.
• Babies can't eat regular grass. They need to be fed freshly sprouted soft, tender grass. If you mix it in with their food they will eat it all.
• Wood sorrel is not grass. Its a weed. Definitely don't let him eat that. You might have to sprout your own grass.
• Romaine is not a good food. I don't know those other two foods, but you should be looking for the right weeds, leaves and grasses. Some flowers and succulents are good too. Look here: https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/for-those-who-have-a-young-sulcata.76744/
• Sulcatas should never be fed fruit. The sugars mess up their intestinal flora and fauna.
• The rate formation is due to low humidity and lack of hydration. You should be soaking daily, and using the right substrate for humidity will help too.

Its all explained here:
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-sulcata-or-leopard-version-2-0.79895/

Any or all of these things could be contributing to slower growth. Also, does the tortoise live alone? Has it ever had contact with other species? That could be a factor too.

I live at Indonesia and when u search Jakarta humidity it will not be far from 70%.I give rarely give romaine, it's just occasionally.The pyramiding was from before I bought him.Which type of grass is good?He won't eat mini elephant grass and Bermuda grass.I will also put some moist sphagnum moss on his hiding cave.He is living alone but has a cherry head neighbour.When he is soaked,eating and sunbathing,they will meet each other.The veggies that I give him is really famous here in Indonesia as the best torto food.Even the vet suggests it.

 

[Tom]

We don't have fumak or siomak here, so I can't comment on those. Even if they are great tortoise foods, you still need a lot more variety. Mulberry leaves, hibiscus leaves, grape vine leaves, dandelions, mallow, spineless opuntia... There are lots of options.

Do they sell seed mixtures over there for grazing animals? Like goats or horses? Get some of that and grow it for your tortoise. There are many types of suitable grasses. Sulcatas are grass eaters. They need grass in their diet.

There are places here in the US that have humidity in the 80-95% range for much of every year. The humidity in their indoor enclosures under a hot bulb is still way too low.

Species should never be mixed. They should have no contact at all. Ever. It is possible and likely that they have exchanged disease organisms and this might be why he's not growing. I can't say this for sure, but it is one of several possibilities.

 

[Ryuken15]

We don't have fumak or siomak here, so I can't comment on those. Even if they are great tortoise foods, you still need a lot more variety. Mulberry leaves, hibiscus leaves, grape vine leaves, dandelions, mallow, spineless opuntia... There are lots of options.

Do they sell seed mixtures over there for grazing animals? Like goats or horses? Get some of that and grow it for your tortoise. There are many types of suitable grasses. Sulcatas are grass eaters. They need grass in their diet.

There are places here in the US that have humidity in the 80-95% range for much of every year. The humidity in their indoor enclosures under a hot bulb is still way too low.

Species should never be mixed. They should have no contact at all. Ever. It is possible and likely that they have exchanged disease organisms and this might be why he's not growing. I can't say this for sure, but it is one of several possibilities.

I sometimes give spineless opuntia but not too often as I heard that too often of it is not good.He doesn't really like hibiscus leaves. I've put some sphagnum moss at his hiding cave.

 

[Reptilony]

I sometimes give spineless opuntia but not too often as I heard that too often of it is not good.He doesn't really like hibiscus leaves. I've put some sphagnum moss at his hiding cave.

I wouldn't...they may end up eating it causing problems, make sure you change your basking spot light for something less damaging as tom stated and you just need to have a substrate that can hold humidity better along with a closed chamber, that's the only way you will counter the pyramiding. Opuntia is very good food you can feed it often just feed a lot of other things, search on this forum all the things you can give a sulcata im sure you can easily find a whole lot of stuff your tort will like in Jakarta.

 

[Tom]

I sometimes give spineless opuntia but not too often as I heard that too often of it is not good.He doesn't really like hibiscus leaves. I've put some sphagnum moss at his hiding cave.

I've given you the explanation of what is going on and why. Its up to you if you want to do any of it, or continue on doing it the way you have been. My babies are not pyramided, and they grow at a normal rate using the methods I've described here for you. You're call from here.

 

[Yvonne G]

Even though the overall humidity in your country is 70%, it is NOT 70% inside your tortoise's enclosure. The lights are drying it out in there, and the dry reptile carpet isn't allowing any more to form.

 

[Ryuken15]

O

I've given you the explanation of what is going on and why. Its up to you if you want to do any of it, or continue on doing it the way you have been. My babies are not pyramided, and they grow at a normal rate using the methods I've described here for you. You're call from here.

Ok.Is it possible that he is infested with worms?Cause someone told me it was possible

 

[Tom]

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Ok.Is it possible that he is infested with worms?Cause someone told me it was possible

Yes. That could be a contributing factor.

 

[Donna Albu]

I've given you the explanation of what is going on and why. Its up to you if you want to do any of it, or continue on doing it the way you have been. My babies are not pyramided, and they grow at a normal rate using the methods I've described here for you. You're call from here.

I've only been following all of you for a bit over a week, so there's a lot that went on before I joined that I haven't seen, but I'm curious that no one has mentioned parasite problems in young tortoises. Here in the southwest USA, it seems to be quite an issue, especially if the tort(s) have been acquired from one of the large breeders. In my case, my 2 older sulcatas were bred "in the wild", and seemed to do well while they were in the house. But, after being let out into the back yard with grass, spurge, and several other weeds, one ended up not growing as fast. Having initially found them in the yard, of course we were totally stupid as to how to take care of them. Fourteen years later - not so stupid any more.

To make a long story short, The one whose growth had slowed down was found to have 3 different kind of worms, presumably from eating bird droppings while outside. Both torts were treated, successfully eradicating the worms. When we adopted the next sulcata from a family in New Jersey, we had him tested as soon as he got here - he also had parasites. He'd originally come from a breeder in Florida. The last one that we took in had not grown hardly at all while the young ladies had had it in their dorm room at college. It also had parasites.

Just thought I'd throw that out there. I might also note that none of the sulcata were willing to eat their food with the medication on or mixed in with it. So each of them went to the vet for it to be given to them by force. And all have done very well ever since!

 

[Tom]

I've only been following all of you for a bit over a week, so there's a lot that went on before I joined that I haven't seen, but I'm curious that no one has mentioned parasite problems in young tortoises. Here in the southwest USA, it seems to be quite an issue, especially if the tort(s) have been acquired from one of the large breeders. In my case, my 2 older sulcatas were bred "in the wild", and seemed to do well while they were in the house. But, after being let out into the back yard with grass, spurge, and several other weeds, one ended up not growing as fast. Having initially found them in the yard, of course we were totally stupid as to how to take care of them. Fourteen years later - not so stupid any more.

To make a long story short, The one whose growth had slowed down was found to have 3 different kind of worms, presumably from eating bird droppings while outside. Both torts were treated, successfully eradicating the worms. When we adopted the next sulcata from a family in New Jersey, we had him tested as soon as he got here - he also had parasites. He'd originally come from a breeder in Florida. The last one that we took in had not grown hardly at all while the young ladies had had it in their dorm room at college. It also had parasites.

Just thought I'd throw that out there. I might also note that none of the sulcata were willing to eat their food with the medication on or mixed in with it. So each of them went to the vet for it to be given to them by force. And all have done very well ever since!

This is good info to share. I've run fecal exams on my tortoise many times over the years and they always come back negative. There is no harm in people checking this out on their own tortoises, but the parasite thing is debatable with tortoises. Some vets think they are commensal and even symbiotic in some cases. Also depends on the degree of infestation. Some vets will leave it alone when the numbers are under a certain threshold and treat for them when the numbers are too high. Some parasites are also self-eliminating.

I have observed that when any tortoise is moved outside full time, even with a night box that provides conditions similar to what they had inside, their growth slows down tremendously for a while.

 

[Ryuken15]

I've only been following all of you for a bit over a week, so there's a lot that went on before I joined that I haven't seen, but I'm curious that no one has mentioned parasite problems in young tortoises. Here in the southwest USA, it seems to be quite an issue, especially if the tort(s) have been acquired from one of the large breeders. In my case, my 2 older sulcatas were bred "in the wild", and seemed to do well while they were in the house. But, after being let out into the back yard with grass, spurge, and several other weeds, one ended up not growing as fast. Having initially found them in the yard, of course we were totally stupid as to how to take care of them. Fourteen years later - not so stupid any more.

To make a long story short, The one whose growth had slowed down was found to have 3 different kind of worms, presumably from eating bird droppings while outside. Both torts were treated, successfully eradicating the worms. When we adopted the next sulcata from a family in New Jersey, we had him tested as soon as he got here - he also had parasites. He'd originally come from a breeder in Florida. The last one that we took in had not grown hardly at all while the young ladies had had it in their dorm room at college. It also had parasites.

Just thought I'd throw that out there. I might also note that none of the sulcata were willing to eat their food with the medication on or mixed in with it. So each of them went to the vet for it to be given to them by force. And all have done very well ever since!

So it is very possible then for a 7cm tortoise to get worm infestation,probably from my seller before which keeps some species together and some are already about 15 cm.

 

[Ryuken15]

I

This is good info to share. I've run fecal exams on my tortoise many times over the years and they always come back negative. There is no harm in people checking this out on their own tortoises, but the parasite thing is debatable with tortoises. Some vets think they are commensal and even symbiotic in some cases. Also depends on the degree of infestation. Some vets will leave it alone when the numbers are under a certain threshold and treat for them when the numbers are too high. Some parasites are also self-eliminating.

I have observed that when any tortoise is moved outside full time, even with a night box that provides conditions similar to what they had inside, their growth slows down tremendously for a while.

Is it safe for me to give panacur(animal dewormer)in small doses for a 7cm tortoise?Also is it safe to deworm without knowing that there is a worm in the tortoise?

 

[Yvonne G]

I

Is it safe for me to give panache(animal dewormer)in small doses for a 7cm tortoise?

No, it is not safe. De-wormer medicine is poison. One should NEVER dose a tortoise with it unless you know the correct dosage to give per your tortoise's body weight.

 

[Ryuken15]

No, it is not safe. De-wormer medicine is poison. One should NEVER dose a tortoise with it unless you know the correct dosage to give per your tortoise's body weight.

I can find the correct dosage but I'm scared that he is too small or if he really does have worms.