I'm looking to rescue some Box Turtles when they come out of hibernation but I'm trying to understand all the laws and restrictions. I know there are a few Texas folks on here, so I was wondering if anyone knows the current laws.
Anyone that understands or knows the current Texas laws
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What specific species of box turtle ?
I don't know the laws in Texas. But what do you mean rescue after they come out of hibernation? Someone has them already and you are getting them? It sounds almost like you are "rescueing" taking them from the wild after they come up from hibernation? Which I am sure is not what you mean.
No I'm referring to rescue them from a rescue, they are hibernating now.
Thanks Yvonne, I have seen that, but I'm trying to find out all the info I can on non-game animals white and black list in Texas and permits required to own these animals. I'd also like the most current information just to make sure what is legal what is not and what is possibly being proposed.
Thanks Yvonne, I have seen that, but I'm trying to find out all the info I can on non-game animals white and black list in Texas and permits required to own these animals. I'd also like the most current information just to make sure what is legal what is not and what is possibly being proposed.
well i dont know any of the texas laws but i am glad that you werent referring to rescuing them from the wild : )
jaizei said:
Thanks I already read those and that's what caused me to have more questions. I suppose I will have to call them.
The very first link I gave them tells exactly how many they can legally own. Each person in the household is allowed to have 6 of one species that is indigenous to Texas. So you can have 6 three-toed box turtles and 6 gulf coast box turtles. Because the other types of box turtles are NOT indigenous to Texas, you can have as many of them as you'd like. And each member of the household can have 6 as above.
Well I was wanting to know all the laws pertaining to non game animals, turtles and tortoises specifically. Everything from Breeding and Selling to wild capture, exporting and importing. Of course I have no desire to export or wild capture, I would like to know what the Texas Laws are. I was just hoping someone on here new the current laws or had a link to find them, all I can find is where to get a permit and a FAQ about permits. I would like to buy some Ornate Box Turtles as well as rescue some three toed and I want to know all the rules and regulations before I purchase any out of state turtles.
You know every ad says know your state laws, well I thought, I don't. I can read through the lines or guess or even go by info from 2007, but I was hoping for the letter of the law.
Now my assumption is if the animal is on the black list it can not be sold in Texas or exported out of Texas, nor can it be wild captured. But what about import, it sounds like importation is fine since you can own 6 of each species per person. Now what if they breed, is that when I need a permit. We will be moving to a neighborhood with small acreage lots and I'd like to make it a sanctuary for Box Turtles since they are native here. It's a long term goal but something to keep me busy in the country while I grow old.
You know every ad says know your state laws, well I thought, I don't. I can read through the lines or guess or even go by info from 2007, but I was hoping for the letter of the law.
Now my assumption is if the animal is on the black list it can not be sold in Texas or exported out of Texas, nor can it be wild captured. But what about import, it sounds like importation is fine since you can own 6 of each species per person. Now what if they breed, is that when I need a permit. We will be moving to a neighborhood with small acreage lots and I'd like to make it a sanctuary for Box Turtles since they are native here. It's a long term goal but something to keep me busy in the country while I grow old.
emysemys said:
This is not correct, even according to your link. Three-toed and Gulf coast are sub-species of the same species, so those would be a cumulative total of 6. You can have 6 Ornate in addition to the 6 Three-toed/Gulf coast.
ripper7777777 said:
Somewhat busy at the moment, but I'll post something in detail later.
Thanks for the correction, Cameron.
It can be a bit confusing. A rough summary.
An animal on the black list can be sold, imported, exported, etc as long as the person has the right permit. Black list animals can not be wild caught. A nongame dealer's permit would be required to breed them. To break down the different "levels":
An animal on the black list can be sold, imported, exported, etc as long as the person has the right permit. Black list animals can not be wild caught. A nongame dealer's permit would be required to breed them. To break down the different "levels":
- Anyone can possess up to 6 black list and 25 white list animals, as long as they don't engage in commercial activity
- A nongame permit allows one to:
- exceed above mentioned limits
- collect white list animals from wild
- purchase/acquire nongame animals, including black list, from someone with nongame dealer's permit or from out of state.
- can only sell to someone with nongame dealer's permit
- A nongame dealer's permit allows one to (in addition to above):
- sell nongame animals to anyone
- acquire nongame animals for commercial activity
- import nongame animals, including black list, for any purpose (additional conditions apply- documentation required)
- export nongame animals, including black list, for any purpose (additional conditions apply- documentation required)
- engage in captive breeding
jaizei said:
Thanks that helps a lot. Sounds like I may need a dealer permit in the future, we would like to breed them, of course you never really know, I could end up with no breeding at all or I could end up with an epic amount of box turtles, just wanted to know the law so I can be prepared. I also wanted to make sure I can bring in Easterns or Ornates, because there isn't anywhere locally to buy them.
Thanks again, any more clarification or links would be great, I like early morning reading with my coffee.
Something else - some sources say that only the subspecies that are native to Texas are affected (three-toed & Gulf coast), however, the actual regulation doesn't specify subspecies but lists just the species (Terrapene carolina). IIRC, there was a case where someone (pet store) actually got into trouble for selling Terrapene carolina carolina. They thought that since the turtles weren't native to Texas and were purchased from PA that they were in the clear. I do not recall how it ended, but they did try to fight it.
It'd probably be a good idea to give them a call and run your idea by them and see what they say as far as what permits you'll need. A lot of what I read refers to the commercial activity. If you were just keeping/breeding them as a hobby, with no intent to sell, you might be able to get away with just a nongame permit rather than a dealer's permit. But I haven't seen it worded in a way that makes that clear.
It'd probably be a good idea to give them a call and run your idea by them and see what they say as far as what permits you'll need. A lot of what I read refers to the commercial activity. If you were just keeping/breeding them as a hobby, with no intent to sell, you might be able to get away with just a nongame permit rather than a dealer's permit. But I haven't seen it worded in a way that makes that clear.
dr. james koukl at the University of Texas at Tyler does A LOT of stuff with box turtles, he could help you if you email him with your concerns. His contact info is on his website: http://wwwold.uttyler.edu/biology/Faculty/Koukl/boxturtlesstudy.htm
I will warn you though, he can be quite frank in his views, however he has been studying box turtles for many many years.
I will warn you though, he can be quite frank in his views, however he has been studying box turtles for many many years.
Yea, the state regulations are a bit open or hard to find, which is probably why all pet stores just don't sell them at all. I really wish the state would work out a way to encourage captive breeding programs for retail while stopping wild capture.
Thanks I will check out his site, and thanks for the warning, but I'm used to people having harsh opinions, It doesn't bother me, I'll do as I please and could careless if it makes others mad, I get one chance to live this life so I'm gonna do it my way.
Thanks I will check out his site, and thanks for the warning, but I'm used to people having harsh opinions, It doesn't bother me, I'll do as I please and could careless if it makes others mad, I get one chance to live this life so I'm gonna do it my way.
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