HD (or Lowes) can be extremely competitive on 'residential' building supplies so I could believe that. An account may not be "required" - I think you'd end up getting signed up before it's all finished regardless - but I think it opens other options up. You may have to get a quote from them to get the volume pricing, and it'd have to meet a threshold. I'd try to create the largest possible order you can and get pricing from both, along with other suppliers.
Is Tortoise-Breeding creating a Time-Bomb?
- Thread starter JoesMum
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HD (or Lowes) can be extremely competitive on 'residential' building supplies so I could believe that. An account may not be "required" - I think you'd end up getting signed up before it's all finished regardless - but I think it opens other options up. You may have to get a quote from them to get the volume pricing, and it'd have to meet a threshold. I'd try to create the largest possible order you can and get pricing from both, along with other suppliers.
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Will,
Some people have no business sense. If they did, they'd be writing off their turtle-based expenses
When I asked my tax preparer if I could deduct any of the $$ spent on my tortoise hobby, I was told I could not.
You can deduct an amount equal to any income from the hobby. Can't take a loss.
Aw, I see..."income from the hobby"...what's that?
Actually, you get bupkiss if the IRS finds your business to simply be a hobby. But, if you are a legitimate business selling tortoises, supplies, etc., you can certainly take a loss in any given year.
Actually, I claimed my dog breeding/showing, as a business years ago. Didn't sell anything except dogs. Was able to deduct portions of anything dog or dog showing and breeding related and portions of my home, utilities bills, car and gas. Yes, on the business alone, was able to show a loss every year. A percentage of my actual expenses, not all of the actual expenses. Laws may have changed since then. Most likely tighter!
Prob don't want to start the 'difference between business and hobby debate'.
I think there's a fair number of breeders that try to squeeze in under hobbyist exemption to the 4" rule that also consider themselves a business for tax purposes.
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"I have accountants pay for it all" Joe Walsh. I have a business sellers permit, which is given oversight by the franchise tax board. My costs always exceed my income by design. The CPA I use sorts the details out. No body and I mean no body is a tax code expert. If you use TurboTax and stay in the green it means you erred so far to the benefit of the IRS nobody will audit you. I use a CPA and for not so much more I get much better accounting relative to what Turbo Tax shows as my return. I have done this two times now, compared a Turbo Tax estimated return and the CPA. A reputable CPA is worth it. They work for you, not the IRS, and good CPA's are not so easy to find IMO, I got lucky.
Yvonne we all know you are a tortoise millionaire, and want to keep a low profile. Opps, secrets out now. My bad. hahahahahhahahahahahhhahahahah
Yvonne we all know you are a tortoise millionaire, and want to keep a low profile. Opps, secrets out now. My bad. hahahahahhahahahahahhhahahahah
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Will,
Some people have no business sense. If they did, they'd be writing off their turtle-based expenses
Many people have businesses that are not productivity based in a traditional resource use sense, and they are very successful. Most that come to mind are entertainment and amusement businesses. It's more timing and popularity in that case, neither of which I have any. Artists of many manners fit this too.
Tiger Woods comes to mind, it was both his skill as a sportsman and his name that got him many sponsors, and all that went away when he got caught fooling around. Crushed his spirit and took away his sponsors.
This is a bit apples and oranges. The point being understanding business is somewhat different than being good at it. My Dad ran a business for his whole life, never failed, never grew past a point, His craftsmanship is impeccable, not his business savvy.
That debate gets hairy when it is with an IRS agent.Prob don't want to start the 'difference between business and hobby debate'.
I also claimed the $$ spent on my horse breeding operation (Mighty small operation, but had high hopes). This was years ago...over 30. At that time, I was able to show a loss for only 5 years. After that it would be deemed a hobby and no longer deductible.
We seem to have gotten pretty far afield and off track from the time bomb premise of this thread. I think it's time we got back on track.
Not my experience at all. We had accountants for years. Then one year, I got turbotax free and decided to do it for fun and compare it to the CPA-prepared return. I discovered my CPA had made 3 mistakes, costing us about $1300. I've done our own returns ever since, complete with small business income, investment income, capital gains, and itemized deductions.
In Poland per- Cites animals can be registered as found if you confirm what type of species are they at the Vets office. In UK found ones probably can be registered as well. I assume that they can not be sold or taken out of the country but given out for free to a neighbor I think yes. Tortoise are quite expensive in my country alderly or not. In most cases per- cites ones will have a much shorter lifespan due owners lack of knowledge and improper care. Concluding in my opinion there will be no problem ...
Vanessa Schnautz
New Member
Getting back to the original question... I don't think it is creating a time bomb. If it were, we would already be there. Not all hatchlings survive once they get to their new owners. Between malnutrition, poor general care, accidents, escapees, predators, and so forth, many pets die. Those that don't, end up in rescues, or with family/friends once the owners pass on, or the kids get disinterested. I think that breeding ANY type of pet animal, ends up supporting rescues. Think of how many cats, dogs, reptiles, cockatiels, parakeets, large parrrots, rabbits, you name it, end up in rescues/humane societies. I don't like breeding pugs, because they have genetic issues. I don't like breeding lop rabbits, like one of my four little cuties (rescue bunny), because their head structure causes dental problems that result in pain, ulcers, and interference with their eating. They get ear infections, and are prone to blindness. The list goes on for various pedigree animals. Pets for kits - any type of pet - is more prone to ending up surrendered. Large parrots that live over 50 years are int he same boat as sulcatas. So I think there are problems everywhere int he pet trade, but none that will come to hit us as a time bomb. Nothign is new under the sun. We have had these same pet issues for a long time now.
For those reasons, I won't get a baby animal that lives longer than 50 years. I woudl rather rescue an adult animal, so I dont' end up with a pet that outlives me.
For those reasons, I won't get a baby animal that lives longer than 50 years. I woudl rather rescue an adult animal, so I dont' end up with a pet that outlives me.
Big Ol Tortoise
Well-Known Member
*looks at sulcatas* It's quite sad how people breed these animals in hundreds or even thousands. Just for money. Sulcatas don't need to bread anymore. Same with other tort. (Or at least just not as much)
My feelings exactly. I bred my sulcata 1 time for the experience. After that I stopped. Not so much for the,"future time-bomb" effect that I might contribute to, but more for my heart. I care for these little critters, and it became hard for me to just sell them to someone that wanted "bigger than the Russian they got at Petsmart." Make sense? I was attached to these little guys and was kind of a hard a** about the home they'd end up in. Pyramids are not normal and all of that.
Vanessa Schnautz
New Member
Yeah... My cockatiels have been producing babies... I got to where I swap out their eggs for dummy eggs, because it is difficult vetting out new owners. Cockatiels are such social creatures, I don't want them being cage birds, and not getting enough attention. They can't compete with a dog for attention. My turaco also bred (larger fruit eating birds), and I turned down 2 potential buyers before going with the third. You just never know how the animal will end up being cared for. Not criticizing breeders - I just found it too difficult on my heart. I'm still ok with breeding finches, because they have a short lifespan, and don't require social interaction with their owner. Typically - anyone interested in a Lady Gouldian Finch - knows what they are doing.
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I look at it like this . The sulcata in its home rang is hurting . Here in America it's numbers are great . So this tortoise will live on for generations . We need to get more of the tortoises that are disappearing in the wild into breeders hands . Home breeders produce and have more successful breeding rates than most zoos . The tortoise we have in our hands will never disappear from the plant .
