What species is this Greek?

[NinaBree]

Anybody know?

 

[GBtortoises]

Ibera Greeks, Testudo {gracea} ibera

 

[Irwin4530]

are these both ibera too?
I know the right one is (from a breeder) but the other is a
craigslist "save"

 

[GBtortoises]

are these both ibera too?
I know the right one is (from a breeder) but the other is a
craigslist "save"

The tortoise on the left looks to be an Antykan Greek based on the view in the photo. Closely related to Ibera, some researchers consider them a geographical variation of Ibera. But, Antykans are found in an area of Turkey that is drier and hotter than that of what Ibera would. Ibera are much more cold and moisture tolerant. Than Antykan and other Middle Eastern Greeks.

 

[Irwin4530]

Should I seperate them, or will they be alright living together?
I will take soe more photos today to see if it helps with identification.
Thanks so much for your help!

 

[GBtortoises]

Ibera generally do better with ambient daytime temperatures in low 70's to very low 80's, night times in the high 50's to low 60's with an ambient humidity of about 50-70%. Middle Easterns do better with ambient daytime temperatures in the mid 70's to mid 80's, night times in the 60's. Ambient humidity much lower, in the 40-50% range. Middle Easterns do not tolerate cool temperatures combined with dampness well.

 

[Irwin4530]

O.K got some photos...
Can you I.D for me?

 

[GBtortoises]

Yep definitely looks like the subspecies currently being called an Antakyan Greek, Testudo gracea antakyensis

 

[Irwin4530]

Thank you!
Can he live with my greek?

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...my Iberian?

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They are indoors and on he damp side but warm and offeted a gradient.

 

[GBtortoises]

Ibera generally do better with ambient daytime temperatures in low 70's to very low 80's, night times in the high 50's to low 60's with an ambient humidity of about 50-70%. Middle Easterns do better with ambient daytime temperatures in the mid 70's to mid 80's, night times in the 60's. Ambient humidity much lower, in the 40-50% range. Middle Easterns do not tolerate cool temperatures combined with dampness well.

See the difference in their "comfort zones" above. By common name and scientific family name they are both similar tortoises. Generally speaking when trying to keep two tortoises from different environments a compromise in "ideal" conditions has to be made for one or both of them. Sometimes this may work, sometimes not. When it doesn't it can lead to disaster. I personally would not keep an Ibera and a Middle Eastern Greek together. A-because of different environmental needs. B-because of possibly interbreeding later on. But people do put different but closely related subspecies together often, especially in the case of the gracea subspecies.

 

[JoesMum]

The usual reason for them not cohabiting is discovering that one or more of them is male... the other(s) cannot take the constant harassment and sexual advances. Greek males are hormonally driven