Unknown object in Sulcata Tortoise - Help!

[Tokka1218]

My Sulcata Tortoise of approximately 5-6 months has been acting lethargic for the last few days, it’s not eating or defecating. He was originally sharing an enclosure with another baby Sulcata but was separated and isolated from that tortoise as I thought he was showing signs of sickness. Their substrate consists of Eco-Earth and Cypress Mulch with Timothy Hay widely available in part of the enclosure. They were receiving daily soaks with a basking temperature of 95-100°F and hides set at around 75-80°F. They’re fed Romaine lettuce, Collard greens, Weeds and Grass as well as an occasional batch of Mazuri and Watermelon to aid in Hydration. (Hydration levels seem to have greatly improved).

As of the last few days, my smaller Sulcata has become very lethargic and will not eat or defecate, he came in at 48g during this weeks weigh in, a 4g increase from last week. I have no exotic pet vets around me and have tried warm soaks as well as Gerber Carrot soaks for today. He seems to be more active while in his soaks but continues to sleep whenever placed down in his isolated enclosure. I placed a flashlight onto his plastron and noticed a large free floating foreign object inside his shell. Could this potentially be constipation or Loose organs? Should I Be concerned? Please help.

 

[KarenSoCal]

@zovick

 

[Tom]

My Sulcata Tortoise of approximately 5-6 months has been acting lethargic for the last few days, it’s not eating or defecating. He was originally sharing an enclosure with another baby Sulcata but was separated and isolated from that tortoise as I thought he was showing signs of sickness. Their substrate consists of Eco-Earth and Cypress Mulch with Timothy Hay widely available in part of the enclosure. They were receiving daily soaks with a basking temperature of 95-100°F and hides set at around 75-80°F. They’re fed Romaine lettuce, Collard greens, Weeds and Grass as well as an occasional batch of Mazuri and Watermelon to aid in Hydration. (Hydration levels seem to have greatly improved).

As of the last few days, my smaller Sulcata has become very lethargic and will not eat or defecate, he came in at 48g during this weeks weigh in, a 4g increase from last week. I have no exotic pet vets around me and have tried warm soaks as well as Gerber Carrot soaks for today. He seems to be more active while in his soaks but continues to sleep whenever placed down in his isolated enclosure. I placed a flashlight onto his plastron and noticed a large free floating foreign object inside his shell. Could this potentially be constipation or Loose organs? Should I Be concerned? Please help.

Hello and welcome.

That looks like food.

Hay is for adult tortoises. It has no place in a baby enclosure and if your substrate is suitably moist it will quickly mold and that could be part of the problem.

The tell tale clue here is 48 grams at 5-6 months. The gain of four grams is likely hydration. At this age your baby should be in the neighborhood of 300 grams.

They should never live in pairs, and the stress from months of living like that is likely a contributor.

No part of the enclosure should drop below 80 degrees at night. Ambient temp during the day should rise to the high 80s or low 90s. Your 95-100 basking area is perfect.

The weeds and grass are good, as long as the grass is soft fresh sprouted tender young grass and chopped into small pieces. Go easy with collards. That should only be offered occasionally. Romaine isn't a great food unless you are adding amendments like soaked horse hay pellets or Zoomed pellets, calcium, and dried leaf or flower options.

Where did you get these babies and how were they started? Here is my best guess about what is happening:

"Hatchling Failure Syndrome"

I've heard this term for many years and I don't like it. Its a way to excuse our ignorance and failure. I will agree that an occasional hatchling is born that is just not going to make it no matter what anybody does, but MOST of them, if they make it full term and hatch, SHOULD survive and...

tortoiseforum.org

Read this one for the correct care info. Look toward the bottom for the heating/lighting breakdown and the sulcata care sheet:

Info For New People. Please Read This First.

Hello and welcome to tortoiseforum.org! We are all glad you are here! There is no other forum like this anywhere. We have tens of thousands of members from all over the world ranging from kids with their first tortoise to people who have been breeding and keeping high end tortoises since the...

tortoiseforum.org

 

[zovick]

My Sulcata Tortoise of approximately 5-6 months has been acting lethargic for the last few days, it’s not eating or defecating. He was originally sharing an enclosure with another baby Sulcata but was separated and isolated from that tortoise as I thought he was showing signs of sickness. Their substrate consists of Eco-Earth and Cypress Mulch with Timothy Hay widely available in part of the enclosure. They were receiving daily soaks with a basking temperature of 95-100°F and hides set at around 75-80°F. They’re fed Romaine lettuce, Collard greens, Weeds and Grass as well as an occasional batch of Mazuri and Watermelon to aid in Hydration. (Hydration levels seem to have greatly improved).

As of the last few days, my smaller Sulcata has become very lethargic and will not eat or defecate, he came in at 48g during this weeks weigh in, a 4g increase from last week. I have no exotic pet vets around me and have tried warm soaks as well as Gerber Carrot soaks for today. He seems to be more active while in his soaks but continues to sleep whenever placed down in his isolated enclosure. I placed a flashlight onto his plastron and noticed a large free floating foreign object inside his shell. Could this potentially be constipation or Loose organs? Should I Be concerned? Please help.



View attachment 366157

That dark area may indicate an intestinal blockage IMHO. If it remains the same in size and shape for 2-3 days, I would seek veterinary attention for the tortoise (assuming it lives that long).

If you don't want to wait, take it to a vet and have it examined and X-rayed. This will cost more than the tortoise cost you, so be prepared or you can just wait it out and hope for the best.

 

[KarenSoCal]

... so be prepared or you can just wait it out and hope for the best.

I completely understand where you're coming from, Bill. But I think it deserves saying that this option comes with a possibly astronomical cost...the agonizing, slow death of that suffering baby, and the OP having to watch it happen.

 

[Tokka1218]

Hello and welcome.

That looks like food.

Hay is for adult tortoises. It has no place in a baby enclosure and if your substrate is suitably moist it will quickly mold and that could be part of the problem.

The tell tale clue here is 48 grams at 5-6 months. The gain of four grams is likely hydration. At this age your baby should be in the neighborhood of 300 grams.

They should never live in pairs, and the stress from months of living like that is likely a contributor.

No part of the enclosure should drop below 80 degrees at night. Ambient temp during the day should rise to the high 80s or low 90s. Your 95-100 basking area is perfect.

The weeds and grass are good, as long as the grass is soft fresh sprouted tender young grass and chopped into small pieces. Go easy with collards. That should only be offered occasionally. Romaine isn't a great food unless you are adding amendments like soaked horse hay pellets or Zoomed pellets, calcium, and dried leaf or flower options.

Where did you get these babies and how were they started? Here is my best guess about what is happening:

"Hatchling Failure Syndrome"

I've heard this term for many years and I don't like it. Its a way to excuse our ignorance and failure. I will agree that an occasional hatchling is born that is just not going to make it no matter what anybody does, but MOST of them, if they make it full term and hatch, SHOULD survive and...

tortoiseforum.org

Read this one for the correct care info. Look toward the bottom for the heating/lighting breakdown and the sulcata care sheet:

Info For New People. Please Read This First.

Hello and welcome to tortoiseforum.org! We are all glad you are here! There is no other forum like this anywhere. We have tens of thousands of members from all over the world ranging from kids with their first tortoise to people who have been breeding and keeping high end tortoises since the...

tortoiseforum.org

Where did you get these babies and how were they started?

Hello, thank you for your response

After reading your post on “Hatchling Failure Syndrome,” a lot of those symptoms are present in my tortoise. This tortoise was handed down to me after the original buyer lost interest in the Sulcata so I attempted to educate myself on their proper care but have now realized I was messing up with the aspects of the enclosure that you mentioned, thank you for informing me better. After about two weeks of having the tortoise under my care I went back to the Pet shop they were being sold at only to find about 10-15 baby sulcata in a 10 Gallon tank with some romaine as well as a single deep dome UVB or Heat lamp (Looked similar to a Powersun from what I remember). Seeing the condition in which those babies were in, I tried giving my sulcata a better enclosure only for his health to deteriorate after a few months together.

Thank you again for your response, I will make those changes for my tortoise enclosures.

 

[wellington]

Make all the needed changes. Soak him as you were and add piedialyte to the soak water. Make the tub to soak in big enough the baby can move around a lot. Try to keep him moving. The movement can help get the insides moving and hopefully get things passing thru again.
Good luck. Keep us updated.

 

[Tom]

Hello, thank you for your response

After reading your post on “Hatchling Failure Syndrome,” a lot of those symptoms are present in my tortoise. This tortoise was handed down to me after the original buyer lost interest in the Sulcata so I attempted to educate myself on their proper care but have now realized I was messing up with the aspects of the enclosure that you mentioned, thank you for informing me better. After about two weeks of having the tortoise under my care I went back to the Pet shop they were being sold at only to find about 10-15 baby sulcata in a 10 Gallon tank with some romaine as well as a single deep dome UVB or Heat lamp (Looked similar to a Powersun from what I remember). Seeing the condition in which those babies were in, I tried giving my sulcata a better enclosure only for his health to deteriorate after a few months together.

Thank you again for your response, I will make those changes for my tortoise enclosures.

I wish you the best of luck, and please feel free to ask as many questions as you want. We are here to help.

 

[zovick]

I completely understand where you're coming from, Bill. But I think it deserves saying that this option comes with a possibly astronomical cost...the agonizing, slow death of that suffering baby, and the OP having to watch it happen.

Or it could be euthanized and replaced for far less cost than treating it. Maybe that would be the best option. In the end, it's up to the owner to decide these things.

Personally, I would euthanize it and get a new healthy one from a reliable breeder.

 

[Maggie3fan]

Zovick I absolutely know where you are coming from...however, I personally would do everything I have learned about Sulcata over the years, and I (would NOW) do all the stuff we have recommended over the years, closed chamber etc...I was taught this...about eggs, you keep them until they hatch or explode...I use the same context in Sulcata babies...keep working on them until they get better or die...I do understand that I know more about what to do than most newcomers...I believe a newbie will give up, where as I won't. I am NOT bragging about my Sulcata knowledge which is considered minimal, but I know if you do absolutely everything we know to do, sometimes they live, and that's what I shoot for...I do stuff like hold them and mess with them so they are not just sitting around with closed eyes, soak in carrots, and maybe add pedialite, (I never have used that)...I use whatever I have learned and I just don't give up...I use 100% of my whatever talent I have to make them live...Personally, I don't anymore believe that a newcomer can save a baby who is as far gone as it sounds...it takes time and patience and our collective knowledge to save them...I am at the well never mind...