Tortoise not brumating

[Noyo]

Hey all, hope you’re doing well!
Every year i let my tortoises brumate, as i think its generally healthier than skipping. Every year it goes smoothly, but this year seems to be an exception. I own two tortoises, both relatively the same age. One of them entered brumation perfectly and smoothly, and it is calmly brumating. The other one, even though it followed the exact same pre-brumation routine, seems to be a lot more active. At first i thought its just the personality, as this one is very energetic and determined. But it isn’t settling in. It seems to be digging up and down, scratching the bottom of the enclosure or the sides, and a lot of burrowing. This is normal, but it’s way longer than any other year. By now it should be sound asleep, but it isn’t. Since they aren’t at my house, my father decided to pick it up and put in in the middle of the substrate instead of it being right at the bottom, which is a good move but i never would pick a tort up in brumation. A few days follow and now the enclosure is placed on the floor and in a cold, stable corner, yet no reduced activity. Today, my father uncovered a small piece of the substrate (not deep digging) and found the little tort eyes open, looking at him as if it was waiting. It did not tuck in and let my father pet him. I am a bit concerned that it is awake and not sleeping, and i would like to hear your suggestions on how to make it sleep. I would prefer if i didn’t abort the brumation, but i will if necessary. By the way, the other tort is in the same conditions as this one, same room, same everything, yet the activity is vastly different between the two

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

What are the temperatures like? How did you prepare for brumation? What is the timeline like?

 

[Noyo]

What are the temperatures like? How did you prepare for brumation? What is the timeline like?

currently its 12 Celsius, but ever since moving them to the corner, its about 9-ish Celsius. I prepared them for brumation by slowing them down, such as reducing their UV light bulb duration, amount of food, and the lowering the temperature. I did move houses though so i guess i haven’t found a stable cold corner like in the previous house.

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

currently its 12 Celsius, but ever since moving them to the corner, its about 9-ish Celsius. I prepared them for brumation by slowing them down, such as reducing their UV light bulb duration, amount of food, and the lowering the temperature. I did move houses though so i guess i haven’t found a stable cold corner like in the previous house.

You might want to consider fridge brumation. Many think it is the safest way to brumate and keep temperatures stable.

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

You might want to consider fridge brumation. Many think it is the safest way to brumate and keep temperatures stable.

Here is a great thread by @Tom Tom's Brumation Thread | Tortoise Forum https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/toms-brumation-thread.201823/

 

[Tom]

Hey all, hope you’re doing well!
Every year i let my tortoises brumate, as i think its generally healthier than skipping. Every year it goes smoothly, but this year seems to be an exception. I own two tortoises, both relatively the same age. One of them entered brumation perfectly and smoothly, and it is calmly brumating. The other one, even though it followed the exact same pre-brumation routine, seems to be a lot more active. At first i thought its just the personality, as this one is very energetic and determined. But it isn’t settling in. It seems to be digging up and down, scratching the bottom of the enclosure or the sides, and a lot of burrowing. This is normal, but it’s way longer than any other year. By now it should be sound asleep, but it isn’t. Since they aren’t at my house, my father decided to pick it up and put in in the middle of the substrate instead of it being right at the bottom, which is a good move but i never would pick a tort up in brumation. A few days follow and now the enclosure is placed on the floor and in a cold, stable corner, yet no reduced activity. Today, my father uncovered a small piece of the substrate (not deep digging) and found the little tort eyes open, looking at him as if it was waiting. It did not tuck in and let my father pet him. I am a bit concerned that it is awake and not sleeping, and i would like to hear your suggestions on how to make it sleep. I would prefer if i didn’t abort the brumation, but i will if necessary. By the way, the other tort is in the same conditions as this one, same room, same everything, yet the activity is vastly different between the two

What species are we talking about?

9-12C is too warm for any species. Most Mediterranean species would need temps closer to 7C, with horsfield tortoises needing it around 2-4C. Those few degree can make a big difference.

Also, they need to be fasted at normal operating temps for about 2 weeks before dropping temps and shortening the days. Continuing to feed them while dropping the temps is a big mistake that can result in food rotting in the gut. If there is food in there, they need warm temps and basking lamps (or sunshine) to warm up enough to digest it and pass it. Only after they've passed most of it and not been fed for a couple of weeks, should the temperatures be lowered.

Further, they don't lose consciousness or really "sleep" when brumating. They are still "awake" and can open their eyes when touched or messed with.

All of this and more is in the thread that @The_Four_Toed_Edward linked for you.

 

[Noyo]

What species are we talking about?

9-12C is too warm for any species. Most Mediterranean species would need temps closer to 7C, with horsfield tortoises needing it around 2-4C. Those few degree can make a big difference.

Also, they need to be fasted at normal operating temps for about 2 weeks before dropping temps and shortening the days. Continuing to feed them while dropping the temps is a big mistake that can result in food rotting in the gut. If there is food in there, they need warm temps and basking lamps (or sunshine) to warm up enough to digest it and pass it. Only after they've passed most of it and not been fed for a couple of weeks, should the temperatures be lowered.

Further, they don't lose consciousness or really "sleep" when brumating. They are still "awake" and can open their eyes when touched or messed with.

All of this and more is in the thread that @The_Four_Toed_Edward linked for you.

I did fast them, they didn’t eat any food for a week and a half. They’re greek tortoises, more specifically the Testudo graeca armeniaca. I’ll read the thread and take the necessary actions, I’ll update you on what happens. Thanks!

 

[SinLA]

I’ll let others chime in, but I don’t think a week and a half is enough time to guarantee their systems are empty. I think about 4 weeks are recommended

 

[EppsDynasty]

The life of both of the torts in in real jeopardy. You mention reduction in food but say nothing about hydration schedule. In order to 'flush' the system properly you need to do daily soaks for 2 weeks AFTER stopping all food. As mentioned this has to all be done while at the warm temps of the species, NOT after stopping feed and cold. This tort is awake for a reason and if you do not address this it will most likely die. You mention the other tort did the same .... well it wasn't right for this one therefore it isn't right for the other either. To have the mentality of "They know what they're doing" or "This is what I do every year" is how tortoises die every year in masses.