Sick baby?

[Cerys92]

Hi all,
I've got 2 leopard tortoises, both around 6 months old.
One seems to be growing a lot more than the other. I know they won't all grow at the same rate but it's quite noticable. I weighed them a few days ago and one was 94g and the other 49g.
They are both slightly pyramided as they were in a tortoise table up until about a month ago. They are now in a closed chamber where humidity is a lot easier to control.
One thing I am slightly concerned about is that neither of them have put on much weight since moving into their new home. The bigger one, Siony, has not put on any weight and the smaller, Calon, has put on 2g. This is over the last 3 weeks.
Is this something to be concerned about?
The other thing concerning me is the little one, Calon, is making a little squeaking noise every now and then.
I thought at first he could be constipated as he seemed to be straining his back legs when doing it but he has pooped since.
However today while soaking them he seemed to be sort of washing his face with his front legs, like wiping his face and squeaking at the same time. As he was squeaking little bubbles were coming from his nose.
I checked and his nose looks clear to me. Could the bubbles just be because he was wet?
I've not noticed bubbles any other time.
After that 20 seconds or so of 'cleaning' his face he's fine.

Any advice would be really appreciated, not sure whether to be concerned or not.
Thanks

 

[taza]

An expert should come by soon to help you out. Do you have pics of your enclosure?

 

[StarSapphire22]

I'm not an expert, but what jumps out at me is that you have two. Usually in situations where there are two torts one will be smaller...torts are pretty solitary creatures and there's likely some bullying going on. These cues are often subtle and can be easily missed, but there is a reason we warn against pairs on the forums. Likely, your little one is stressed from bullying, possibly missing out on his fair share of foods, and caught a bug. Torts are very sensitive to stress. I'll leave diagnosis to the experts, but you should really separate the two.

 

[diamondbp]

sounds like an URI. I would increase your soak times because when they claw at their face it's because they are attempting to help the mucus come out. Increased soak times will help soften the mucus hopefully allowing it to come out. Make sure the water stay fairly warm though. Cold water will not help in any way. good luck

 

[Tom]

The first issue is the possible URI. What are your night temps and how are you heating them at night in the new enclosure? Along with continuing the daily soaks, you ought to raise the ambient temps day and night to about 85.

Sometimes they rub at their eyes because they hurt. What sort of UV bulb are you using?

Then read these to address a couple of your other potential problems:
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/hatchling-failure-syndrome.23493/
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/pairs.34837/

 

[Neal]

Agreed, it definitely sounds like URI. Raise the temperatures and maintain hydration as suggested. Keep fresh food available for him at all times too.

If one is growing faster than the other along with one possibly being ill, I would definitely recommend keeping them separate.

 

[Cerys92]

The basking temperature at the warm end of the enclosure is around 32-34C. The cooler end of the enclosure is around 24C.
At night it drops to around 20-24 depending on the temperature of the room.
There is a heat mat in one corner of the enclosure which is on all night.
I use a 100w arcadia d3 uv basking bulb which is just over 11inches from the floor of the enclosure. I know this is quite close, could it be a problem?

As for the soaking, how would you recommend keeping the water warm?

Thanks for all the help

 

[Neal]

Your temperatures are fine on the warm end, but the night time drops are not going to help the possible respiratory infection. I recommend that you keep the temperature of the enclosure 32c - 34c all day long until he gets better.

A lamp that close could be a problem, but the only way to figure that out is to measure the temperatures directly underneath it.

You can keep the water warm with a lamp above the water or just replace the water with warmer water after it cools down.

 

[Tom]

The basking temperature at the warm end of the enclosure is around 32-34C. The cooler end of the enclosure is around 24C.
At night it drops to around 20-24 depending on the temperature of the room.
There is a heat mat in one corner of the enclosure which is on all night.
I use a 100w arcadia d3 uv basking bulb which is just over 11inches from the floor of the enclosure. I know this is quite close, could it be a problem?

As for the soaking, how would you recommend keeping the water warm?

Thanks for all the help

1. 20 is MUCH too cool for a baby leopard, especially with humidity. The whole enclosure should not drop below 26-27 day or night. Since they are already sick you should keep the ambient at least 30ish for then next few weeks to help them recover.
2. 32-34C is too cool for a basking temp. They need it warmer than that. Shoot for around 37-38 directly under the basking bulb.
3. Arcadia bulbs are good and they tend to produce a lot of UV. 11" might be too close. You need a good UV meter to be able to tell. I recommend this one: http://www.solarmeter.com/model65.html This is just as important as a thermometer is for being able to tell your temperature.
4. Soak them somewhere warm. On the heat pad or under a basking bulb might work, but watch your temps carefully. You can also dump and refill the water several time if need be.
5. Please read this thread next: http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/

 

[Cerys92]

Okay, I really appreciate all the advice.
To increase the temperature would I need to put in another heat lamp? Or a higher wattage?
I have a night light I can put in to keep the heat up in the night. I'll try that and keep an eye on the night temps to see if I need to increase them more.
I will also set up another enclosure to separate them.
Hopefully this will help clear up the illness.

 

[Neal]

What type of night light is it? Is it like a ceramic heat emitter or does it produce visible light? If it produces visible light, I would recommend a CHE for the night time. I'm not sure what you would have available in your area.

Both adding another heat lamp or higher wattage will work, but your warm temperatures are pretty good so you wouldn't want to raise them up too much more. I think a higher wattage bulb might be the better option. You could adjust the height of it to get the temperature where you want it.

 

[Cerys92]

Its a 'moonlight bulb'. It does give off some light but it's not very bright.
http://www.internetreptile.com/komodo-moonlight-bulb:-es-screw-50w_3439.aspx
It's like that.
I will have a look for something more suitable over the weekend.

Okay, I'll give that a go