Russian breeding update...

[-ryan-]

Right now, from my 1.3 group, I have 14 eggs in the incubator, and 6 hatchlings that have hatched in the past month or so. Just wanted to give an update on how things are going. Eventually I will probably start offering some of the hatchlings for sale to my fellow tortoise forum members (at a discounted price, of course ), but for now I have a reptile dealer in the area who says they want as many as I can produce.

At some point I may turn it into a 1.4 or even 1.5 group, but I am a little overwhelmed with the amount of eggs/hatchlings I'm getting already!

 

[Yvonne G]

How lucky you are. We've had several new forum members looking for baby Russian tortoises recently.

 

[Cameron]

alright, how are you doing it??!! i have a 1.3 group and after they came out of hibernation last year there was breeding but i never found any eggs. is there anything special i need to do when they come up out of hibernation this spring??

 

[kimber_lee_314]

Congratulations! I had my first Russian eggs last summer - but they were not fertile. I'm hoping for some this year.

 

[tortoises101]

Congrats on the torts. Do provide some pics for us. I'd love to see some russian hatchlings.

 

[-ryan-]

alright, how are you doing it??!! i have a 1.3 group and after they came out of hibernation last year there was breeding but i never found any eggs. is there anything special i need to do when they come up out of hibernation this spring??

To be honest, I have never hibernated them, and I believe that my success indicates that it is at least not necessary to hibernate them. I keep them indoors 99.9% of the year (just take them out a couple hours at a time throughout the summer). I don't use UVB, and I keep them in a smallish 6'x3' enclosure with hay on one side, and a 3'x2'x8" cement mixing bin sunk into the floor full of dirt that they have had for over four years (I add water to it, and occasionally I dig it all out and stir it). I use two 45 watt halogen flood bulbs for heat, placed about 10-12" above the surface of the dirt, and a standard GE compact fluorescent for ambient light over the other side. The whole setup is in a cold basement, and when all of the lights go out at night it can go below 60f in the winter.

So when I write it all out, it doesn't sound like I'm doing anything right, but I have gotten incredible results, and my tortoises eat well and thrive.

When we move in a month or two (hopefully) I am going to try to build a larger enclosure for them. I would like to build an 8'x4' enclosure, but I need to make sure there's enough space in the room I have planned for it, and I am trying to make sure I know exactly how I want to build it.

I keep saying I'm going to post pictures and I never do. I'll try to get working on it though.

 

[pdrobber]

To be honest, I have never hibernated them, and I believe that my success indicates that it is at least not necessary to hibernate them. I keep them indoors 99.9% of the year (just take them out a couple hours at a time throughout the summer). I don't use UVB, and I keep them in a smallish 6'x3' enclosure with hay on one side, and a 3'x2'x8" cement mixing bin sunk into the floor full of dirt that they have had for over four years (I add water to it, and occasionally I dig it all out and stir it). I use two 45 watt halogen flood bulbs for heat, placed about 10-12" above the surface of the dirt, and a standard GE compact fluorescent for ambient light over the other side. The whole setup is in a cold basement, and when all of the lights go out at night it can go below 60f in the winter.

So when I write it all out, it doesn't sound like I'm doing anything right, but I have gotten incredible results, and my tortoises eat well and thrive.

I keep saying I'm going to post pictures and I never do. I'll try to get working on it though.

That's interesting. Makes me think even I could breed Russians...could you explain your previous success from prior to using an incubator?

 

[pdrobber]

^oops** thought you had said you never incubated them instead of hibernate.

 

[-ryan-]

Yeah. I don't really understand why I have been so successful with them, other than the fact that I keep them hotter than most people, and I don't mess with them other than a bath twice a month (when I do a thorough enclosure cleaning). Other people tell me they have difficulty getting them to breed outdoors, let alone indoors. It did take me a while to get everything dialed in to the point that it all keeps happening regularly.

Two more are hatching this morning.

 

[Torty Mom]

That's great news. You don't use uvb? Do you supplement with D3? Just wondering how you work that out, since no uvb, seems that that would cause a problem, or many problems actually.

 

[-ryan-]

That's great news. You don't use uvb? Do you supplement with D3? Just wondering how you work that out, since no uvb, seems that that would cause a problem, or many problems actually.

UVB bulbs are great for spending money, but most people overlook heat, which is much more important for digestion which allows them to synthesize a vast number of vitamins and nutrients. I give mine hot basking spots (compared to the accepted norm), and I don't use UVB. I don't use it with the adults or with the babies, and I have raised several to adulthood from hatchlings (some from the egg, actually) without ever using UVB bulbs and end up with energetic, robust tortoises. I do supplement with vitamin w/d3 a few times a week, and I am sure that helps.

 

[tortoises101]

Ryan, since you're a breeder of russians, would it be possible to breed them indoors? Up here in Canada outdoor keeping year-round isn't an option and if I have tortoises they'd usually be indoors.

 

[-ryan-]

Ryan, since you're a breeder of russians, would it be possible to breed them indoors? Up here in Canada outdoor keeping year-round isn't an option and if I have tortoises they'd usually be indoors.

I keep mine indoors for all but a few hours a week for about two months out of the year. So basically, they are indoors 99.9% of the time, and yes, I breed them indoors. In my opinion, the two most important (and often overlooked) aspects of an indoor breeding enclosure are hot basking lamps with deep dirt beneath them. Hot is over 100f surface temp, and deep is at least as deep as your largest female is long (or at least 7-8", in my opinion). They dig their nests deep, and they always seem to dig directly underneath the heat lamp.

But yeah, mine breed indoors, and I'm sure that anyone else with healthy, large animals and enough space/resources (dirt and heat) should be able to do the same.

---

Oh, and also, I'm in upstate new york just a few miles south of lake Ontario, so we probably have similar climates. Right now everything is frozen and there is over a foot of snow on the ground (down from several feet a couple weeks ago).

 

[tortoises101]

Okay, thanks for the reply.

 

[goodsmeagol]

Awesome thread!!! thanks for all the reading.
I am in Canada too tortoises101, and keep mine indoors 99.99% too, I have an outdoor 8x4 pen, however because of work, they rarely get the chance to stay out more then 30-45 minutes.

I will keep in mind to bump my bask to 100 and add in 3-4" of substrate!

I just upsized my enclosure, in prep for adding a female who will be free of quarantine next month, assuming her fecal goes well.
To save MONEY, I actually went with a 400watt High pressure sodium light at 4ft to provide a 95 ambient to more of the cage, and also increase UVB output to much more of the cage, (10x3).
With this light, I took away 2 MVB bulbs each 160 watts, and replaced a 100watt incan with a cfl(at 3ft to ensure no eye damage). This increased light, even in the 3 days it has been up, I have noticed a difference in activity levels. They run around a lot more(never corner climbing or corner digging, only exploration)! But bask much less.

 

[-ryan-]

Awesome thread!!! thanks for all the reading.
I am in Canada too tortoises101, and keep mine indoors 99.99% too, I have an outdoor 8x4 pen, however because of work, they rarely get the chance to stay out more then 30-45 minutes.

I will keep in mind to bump my bask to 100 and add in 3-4" of substrate!

I just upsized my enclosure, in prep for adding a female who will be free of quarantine next month, assuming her fecal goes well.
To save MONEY, I actually went with a 400watt High pressure sodium light at 4ft to provide a 95 ambient to more of the cage, and also increase UVB output to much more of the cage, (10x3).
With this light, I took away 2 MVB bulbs each 160 watts, and replaced a 100watt incan with a cfl(at 3ft to ensure no eye damage). This increased light, even in the 3 days it has been up, I have noticed a difference in activity levels. They run around a lot more(never corner climbing or corner digging, only exploration)! But bask much less.

Cool! Can you post some pics of your setup? I will have to post some pics of mine in the near future, but I am actually going to be building a larger enclosure when I move (might be as soon as 2-3 weeks from now!). I have always heated enclosures with the philosophy in mind that the lights should be as close to the animals as possible while maintaining a safe environment, which is how I get away with using such low wattage bulbs, but I would like to see how you have yours setup.