New Male Hingeback, Need Info Please

[kathluvsandy]

Hello all! I'm looking for any advice on my new male Home's Hingeback. I have a female whom I acquired about 4 years ago from a friend's daughter who had lost interest her, hoping to give her a better home so she wasn't neglected. I wanted to get her a companion bc I heard tortoises enjoy companionship, and I don't want her to be lonely. Like I said i've had her about 4 years now and she's been fine on her own, but I feel like she must be extremely bored. I notice whenever I come out on our patio enclosure to garden she sort of follows me around and stares at me. It seems like she would really enjoy some interaction with another companion. I have her in a large enclosure (about 5' x 4') on our covered patio (we live in Florida) but I'm wondering if I'm going to need to expand it further after I introduce the male. Also, she is probably about 7 years old but the male must be much younger bc he is only about 5" - 6". Is the age difference going to be an issue? I'm not looking to breed them. Also, do I need to quarantine him first before putting him in the enclosure with her? The breeder said they are bred in captivity and not wild caught. Any advice on introducing another hingeback tortoise would be much appreciated Thanks!
Also, can anyone tell me how long this breed of tortoise lives? I'm hoping these 2 can enjoy a very long lifetime together

 

[Tortoise]

Hi
I don't think that tortoises need companionship really. If you don't intend to breed them it perhaps wouldn't be a good idea to get a male for your female. He may pester her and will only be interested in breeding.

If you are happy with one tortoise that is fine and she will not suffer by being alone. They only really come together in the wild for breeding and otherwise are quite content to lead a solitary life.

I hope others will comment too soon to reassure you.

Welcome to a great forum, lots of great tortoise fanatics here and always willing to lend a hand

Louise

 

[Kristina]

If you have a male and a female, they will breed whether you intend it or not. It is not a good idea to only keep a pair. The male will focus all of his attention on the single female and can pester and stress her to the point of death. Tortoises do not require companionship at all, they are solitary animals that only come together for breeding. Any other individuals are seen as competition for food, living space, mates, etc. The reason she follows you around is not because she is lonely, but because she associates you with food and is hoping you will give her something.

Make sure to quarantine for at LEAST 6 months. All Home's available in the US are wild caught imports and are often riddled with parasites and other illness. Introducing the male to your female may prove deadly for both. He will need a vet check and a fecal done to check for parasites. If you are going to keep them together I would seriously consider getting another female NOW and starting a quarantine process. Either that or if you are not going to breed (because as I said before they will do it whether you like it or not ) forgo the male altogether and just get a female companion.

Here is an article I wrote on the care and keeping of Home's. http://www.tortoiseforum.org/Thread-The-Home-s-Hingeback-Tortoise#axzz1SU7Yhr00 I have a group of two males and five females.

I don't believe your "breeder." The only place that I am aware of where Home's have been successfully bred is Hawaii. I think you are being told they are captive bred and this is in fact a lie. Can you PM me privately and give me the name of this person?

 

[Yvonne G]

Hi Kathluvsandy:

Welcome to the Tortoise Forum!!

May we know your name?

We have several hingeback keepers here on the forum. One of them will offer you some advice, I'm sure. In the meantime, I can answer your "general" questions. Yes, even tho' he's captive bred (cb) a quarantine period is still in order. Yes, you will have to make your habitat a bit bigger when you add the other tortoise. Bigger is always better! The age difference isn't a problem, however if they are very different in size that might be a problem. It helps if you set up two different feeding stations, out of sight of each other. That way they don't feel competition for the food.

 

[kathluvsandy]

Thank you all for the information. Problem is I already ordered the male hingeback, after being told by many reptile specialists in the area that a male and female would do fine together, maybe I got my info from bad sources?? The place I ordered him from is Florida Herpetology (website is floridaherps dotcom). They said the tortoises are bred in Naples Florida and when I asked if I could drive to pick him up instead of having the tortoise shipped they said that was fine. So I think they really do breed them there. But I decided to just have him shipped bc it's a 2 hour drive and they said he would get here early tomorrow morning via fed-ex over night delivery. Should I order a female too? They had one female available and 2 males, all 4"-6" in size, not sure how old that means they are. Has anyone heard of this organization and if they are reputable? How can I tell if he has any parasites? Thanks so much, Kathryn

---

Ok I spoke with a rep from the company and they were hatched in captivity, not bred, and they do regular fecal exams on them to make sure they are parasite free. They also recommended to quarantine them as well, but more of as a precaution to make sure the new male isn't too stressed and to make sure he is eating regularly, etc. before introducing him. They also have a fecal lab you can send samples too and get results by mail so I will take this extra precaution as well before taking him out of quarantine. They have been very helpful and responsive to my emails and calls. They sounded like a very reputable source to buy from, the guy was very happy to hear I have been doing all this research on the hingeback tortoise and that I had the animal's best interest in mind

 

[Kristina]

FloridaHerps is a broker, not a breeding facility. They purchase animals from another source and resell them. The FLHerps facility is located in Lakewood Ranch, FL, not Naples.

Also, I don't even see that they HAVE Home's hingebacks, only Serrated hingebacks, Kinixys erosa. Home's are Kinixys homeana.

At any rate, hopefully everything turns out the way it should, and just make sure to do the quarantine.

Age really has no bearing, it is almost impossible to tell what age they really are (4-6" is actually the typical import size for WC individuals ) and it won't make any difference as far as housing them together. Make sure to keep him really well hydrated.

 

[ALDABRAMAN]

Welcome.

 

[egyptiandan]

I'm afraid like Kristina said they are dealers through and through. The animals they sell you will for sure be wild caught and hopefully be Home's hingebacks (though for that price I would think they would be). They were even nice enough (if you scroll to the bottom of the page for the hingebacks for sale) to post a video from a member of tortoiseforum. Those 3 hingebacks were sold on the forum in 2008. http://www.tortoiseforum.org/Thread...-Sale-Trade?highlight=hingeback#axzz1RYXctYDJ
Kristina has given you some great advice about your new male. If you don't plan on breeding them (which isn't easy to do (from getting eggs to actually getting hatchlings)), I'd keep your new male seperate as it will cause less stress for both of them. Hingebacks are great tortoises, but one of the least social of all tortoises.

Danny

 

[Jacqui]

I don't believe your "breeder." The only place that I am aware of where Home's have been successfully bred is Hawaii. I think you are being told they are captive bred and this is in fact a lie.

This part I have to disagree with, they are and have been bred in many locations in the USA. I know of VA, CA, FL to name a few other states.

---

You said there is the option of getting another female, correct? I would go that way, as trios work very well and the second female does allow a bit of a break for the other female. Still often a male will fixate more on one female over the other. I keep most of my Homes as trios.

Make sure your enclosure is heavily planted with several hides too. These plants not only give humidity and a secure feeling, but act as visual barriers for the females.

I would certainly do a quarantine, so as to not risk my established female.

 

[kathluvsandy]

Thank you so much everyone for the great advice! Since I've already purchased the male as a companion, I guess the best route is to take your advice and get a second female. Are there any reputable sources to buy one from that any of you would recommend? Also, I had already bought supplies yesterday to remodel my enclosure from 5' x 4' to 6' x 6' to make additional room for the new male. Would I need to expand it even more for an additional female or is that adequate? I was sure to purchase a new hideout, soak bowl, and flat feeding rock for the male as you said having to share these items can sometimes cause competition. And I read that Home's like to burrow in mulch. I never knew that as I've never seen my girl do that, but I made a 4" tall "sand box" of sorts, accept it is filled with loose mulch and leaves and moss for her to burrow in. I'm hoping this will also give her some privacy and help if she wants to be out of site from the male. Does anyone know if Spanish Moss is safe to put in their enclosure?? It is hanging everywhere from the trees down here and I think would provide an excellent source to hide in and holds moisture really well.
Thanks so much everyone for your knowledge and time!
-Kathryn

 

[Kristina]

I purchased two of my females from Outback Reptiles and was extremely pleased. I do not recommend purchasing from DTS Herps. I had a bad experience with them and have photos/emails to back that claim up upon request.

Only purchase the new female now if you have room to quarantine each separately. It probably would be best to do it sooner rather than later, so that you can get the quarantine started and then introduce all three to each other at the same time.

I have never noticed mine to burrow, they prefer to hide in hollow logs, etc. Certainly the mulch can't hurt. I use just plain soil with leaf litter on top and inside the hollow logs.

In the indoor enclosures I use the half logs that they have at the pet store, you can use them outside as well, I use the bigger ones outside because they are easy for me to find and are free.

I prefer to have one hide per tortoise, plus one extra, so two hides for one, three for two, four for three, etc.

Not sure about the spanish moss. I use long fiber sphagnum moss.

 

[Jacqui]

Kathryn, how is the new male doing? What did you decide about getting another female?

Kristina, every time I see that log hide, I just think it is so great!