Molly update

[animalfreak]

Hi everyone! I know recently I posted saying Molly was sick. She's fine now after I raised her temps. We changed her substrate to Eco Earth but my only concern is they get it in their mouths. I've heard some people mix it with something else but I'm not sure. Also I had questions on an outdoor enclosure. I have the Zee MEd tortoise house. I'm not sure exactly how that works so any help would be great. Also thank you to all the people that have helped me. They are both healthy, but I am noticing slight pyramiding. In trying to soak them everyday when I take a shower so the steam helps too. I also try to spray the enclosure at least once a day. I am trying to stop the pyramiding!! I feed them pellets and spring mix. I'm sure they love their fresh meals eevery other day! I usually just re awryt their food. Any suggestions or help would be great thanks! Hopefully my pics works!

 

[wellington]

Glad all is okay. Have you read Toms threads on raising a smooth sulcata? They, the leopard thread too, are at the bottom of my post. They both apply to a sulcata or leopard. The humidity needs to be 80% with temps no lower the 80, day and night. About the only way to get the humidity up is to cover the enclosure 1/2 to 3/4. Coconut coir will not cause impactions, so you don't have to worry about that if they eat it. However, we don't really want to keep letting them eat it either. If you want to try mixing it, you can use cypress mulch or plain dirt.

 

[sibi]

I think you need to make a habit of soaking your babies twice a day at least. I firmly believe that you should invest in a fogger because it is difficult to keep the humidity high with just spraying. I found that when i switched to a fogger, it was easier, especially if you have it on a controlled timer. Also, did i read you feed them fresh food every other day? If that's what you're doing, i suggest that you change their feeding habit. They should be feed fresh food 2-3 times a day! Finally, proper exercise and UVb is extremely important in preventing pyramiding.

 

[Dizisdalife]

If you pack that Ecoearth down with your hands you won't have as much of a problem with it. You may need to do it a few times before you get it so that it is packed down enough. Your tortoises look pretty good by the way.

 

[animalfreak]

I think you need to make a habit of soaking your babies twice a day at least. I firmly believe that you should invest in a fogger because it is difficult to keep the humidity high with just spraying. I found that when i switched to a fogger, it was easier, especially if you have it on a controlled timer. Also, did i read you feed them fresh food every other day? If that's what you're doing, i suggest that you change their feeding habit. They should be feed fresh food 2-3 times a day! Finally, proper exercise and UVb is extremely important in preventing pyramiding.

Okay thank you I will keep all of that in mind and try my best to improve! Any advice on out door enclosures

 

[lovelyrosepetal]

You do not need to soak them at least twice a day. Once a day is fine. Look at Tom's threads, he has never said to soak them that much and he is King when it comes to Sulcatas and leopards. When I say king, I mean he is the expert on their care. You should be feeding them fresh food every day and I think your tortoises look beautiful! Keep us updated.

 

[animalfreak]

You do not need to soak them at least twice a day. Once a day is fine. Look at Tom's threads, he has never said to soak them that much and he is King when it comes to Sulcatas and leopards. When I say king, I mean he is the expert on their care. You should be feeding them fresh food every day and I think your tortoises look beautiful! Keep us updated.

Awe thank you very much! I will try to read the threads tomorrow on my computer. Thanks for your help!

 

[sibi]

Lovelyrosepetal, I appreciate that you read Tom's threads, and I for one respect his judgements on many factors. But, I think you would be wrong on the issue of soaking twice a day. PM him and ask him if it would be more beneficial or harmful to soak a baby twice a day especially if you are worried about pyramiding. I believe he would say once or twice is fine. So, soaking twice is something he will not discourage. Tom, for one, would be the first to say he's not a King, or God, or even an authority, although most of us know he is certainly an authority for all the lessons he learned about rearing sulcatas. Be careful not to criticize others because you happen to take a man's words a God's.

You do not need to soak them at least twice a day. Once a day is fine. Look at Tom's threads, he has never said to soak them that much and he is King when it comes to Sulcatas and leopards. When I say king, I mean he is the expert on their care. You should be feeding them fresh food every day and I think your tortoises look beautiful! Keep us updated.

 

[lovelyrosepetal]

Sibi, I meant no disrespect to you. I was not trying to be critical at all. I was just saying that soaking them once a day is fine. Soaking them twice is okay if you want to but I do not think you are going to hurt them by doing it once a day. You may not, and Tom may not, regard Tom as the expert in Sulcata care but I have seen his babies and they are superior to any of the numerous Sulcatas I have seen. If Tom says that soaking them once a day is fine, that is what I go off of. I know he has said you can soak them more but that once a day is sufficient. If I am wrong, I apologize quite sincerely, but unless Tom has found new evidence to suggest otherwise his stance was once a day was usually enough. Looking at those pictures, the tortoise looked beautiful and I felt that recommending once a day was fine. Tom, please chime in and educate us. I thought I was correct in my assessment but maybe I am wrong. Again, I meant no disrespect to you or anyone else.

---

Also, I never said he was God. I don't know why you want to bring religion in this when that is clearly against forum rules.

 

[sibi]

Lovelyrosepedal, I know you are going by what Tom suggest; and frankly, so do I. I have learned more from him on how to care for my sulcatas than from this whole forum. However, he would not disagree with two soaks, and here's why. The problem this member is having is to stop the pyramiding. If you want to ensure that your tort is well hydrated, and has water available to them, and they are under one year old, soaking twice may be a very good thing. It certainly isn't harmful. So, if you want to stress soaking daily, I wouldn't discount that. On the other hand, you shouldn't discount two soaks either...that's all. We all learn, and we all have misunderstandings. That's ok so long as we can be civil about it. Just for your information, a king is often considered a god...it's not meant to inject religion into the discussion. Just look at the way you worded your post. You made it sound like Tom is a god, a king, an authority better than anyone else. Tom would not like that people would consider him even an authority. If you ask him, he'll tell you because he's also a very humble person. And, when people speak of him like that, it's embarrassing to him. I wouldn't do that to him; I respect him too much for that. I also respect you too much to want to make an argument over this either. I recall when you lost your baby and I still think about him. You didn't know that did you? So, let's just be kind and caring and respectful toward each other.

Sibi, I meant no disrespect to you. I was not trying to be critical at all. I was just saying that soaking them once a day is fine. Soaking them twice is okay if you want to but I do not think you are going to hurt them by doing it once a day. You may not, and Tom may not, regard Tom as the expert in Sulcata care but I have seen his babies and they are superior to any of the numerous Sulcatas I have seen. If Tom says that soaking them once a day is fine, that is what I go off of. I know he has said you can soak them more but that once a day is sufficient. If I am wrong, I apologize quite sincerely, but unless Tom has found new evidence to suggest otherwise his stance was once a day was usually enough. Looking at those pictures, the tortoise looked beautiful and I felt that recommending once a day was fine. Tom, please chime in and educate us. I thought I was correct in my assessment but maybe I am wrong. Again, I meant no disrespect to you or anyone else.

---

Also, I never said he was God. I don't know why you want to bring religion in this when that is clearly against forum rules.

---

 

[Yvonne G]

Sylvia and Rose: It is quite ok for each of us to have our own opinions on tortoise-keeping. All we can do is to give our opinion, and allow the person seeking help to try it or not. Personally, I only soak once a day. It is MY opinion that soaking more causes the food to pass through the tortoise's system faster than normal and he might lose some of the nutrients he needs to grow strong and healthy. In my opinion, it is more important to have moisture in the habitat than to soak more than once a day. But, having said that, there are many people who soak more than once a day and it works quite well for them. So its really up to the person asking for advice, which one to take. Why not try them both?

 

[sibi]

That's exactly my point. I have tried both methods, and I feel when there's worry about pyramiding, soaking twice helps with that issue, along with a humid enclosure and other factors. Like you said, we all have opinions, and mine are based on personal experience. Both opinions are valid, that's why I responded to Rose when she said that the two soaks were not necessary. I appreciate your wisdom in the matter because it is just an opinion after all.

Sylvia and Rose: It is quite ok for each of us to have our own opinions on tortoise-keeping. All we can do is to give our opinion, and allow the person seeking help to try it or not. Personally, I only soak once a day. It is MY opinion that soaking more causes the food to pass through the tortoise's system faster than normal and he might lose some of the nutrients he needs to grow strong and healthy. In my opinion, it is more important to have moisture in the habitat than to soak more than once a day. But, having said that, there are many people who soak more than once a day and it works quite well for them. So its really up to the person asking for advice, which one to take. Why not try them both?

 

[Tom]

I appreciate the compliments from all concerned and thank you. However, I don't deserve all the credit I'm given. All I do is try stuff, and report the results I see. I just share what I've learned over the years and try to help. I got tired of typing the same thing over and over, so I made that sulcata care sheet. It needs revision, btw... Then I got tired of arguing about pyramiding, so I started "The End Of Pyramiding" thread. I'm just a regular tortoise keeper.

I recommend once a day soaks for hatchling sulcatas and leopards. This works very well for me. Somewhere along the way a trend started of recommending two, or sometimes more, soaks a day. I'm not sure how or where this started, but it didn't come from me. On occasion during our super hot dry summers, I will soak tiny hatchlings before AND after a sunning session, but this isn't the norm for me. Now I don't think two soaks will hurt anything, but I don't see it as necessary as long as the baby has a humid substrate, shallow drinking water, a humid hide and frequent shell sprayings.

So here's the score: LovelyRosePetal is correct that I only recommend one soak a day normally. Sylvia is correct that I don't think two will hurt, and it might be a good idea in a case of STOPPING pyramiding already in progress. Once mine start to get some size on them, say 200-300 grams, I start to skip occasional soaking days. By the time they are 1000 grams, I usually have cut back to once or twice a week soaks, as a general rule.

 

[sibi]

Thank you Tom, and I'm sure Rose thanks you too. My soaks have helped my babies because they were starting to pyramid when I first joined. Now, they kind of expect the two soaks, and it's worked wonders on them especially when they are a little compacted, or when it's really hot outside. See what we've got to do to get you to chime in

I appreciate the compliments from all concerned and thank you. However, I don't deserve all the credit I'm given. All I do is try stuff, and report the results I see. I just share what I've learned over the years and try to help. I got tired of typing the same thing over and over, so I made that sulcata care sheet. It needs revision, btw... Then I got tired of arguing about pyramiding, so I started "The End Of Pyramiding" thread. I'm just a regular tortoise keeper.

I recommend once a day soaks for hatchling sulcatas and leopards. This works very well for me. Somewhere along the way a trend started of recommending two, or sometimes more, soaks a day. I'm not sure how or where this started, but it didn't come from me. On occasion during our super hot dry summers, I will soak tiny hatchlings before AND after a sunning session, but this isn't the norm for me. Now I don't think two soaks will hurt anything, but I don't see it as necessary as long as the baby has a humid substrate, shallow drinking water, a humid hide and frequent shell sprayings.

So here's the score: LovelyRosePetal is correct that I only recommend one soak a day normally. Sylvia is correct that I don't think two will hurt, and it might be a good idea in a case of STOPPING pyramiding already in progress. Once mine start to get some size on them, say 200-300 grams, I start to skip occasional soaking days. By the time they are 1000 grams, I usually have cut back to once or twice a week soaks, as a general rule.

 

[Tom]

Hi everyone! I know recently I posted saying Molly was sick. She's fine now after I raised her temps. We changed her substrate to Eco Earth but my only concern is they get it in their mouths. I've heard some people mix it with something else but I'm not sure. Also I had questions on an outdoor enclosure. I have the Zee MEd tortoise house. I'm not sure exactly how that works so any help would be great. Also thank you to all the people that have helped me. They are both healthy, but I am noticing slight pyramiding. In trying to soak them everyday when I take a shower so the steam helps too. I also try to spray the enclosure at least once a day. I am trying to stop the pyramiding!! I feed them pellets and spring mix. I'm sure they love their fresh meals eevery other day! I usually just re awryt their food. Any suggestions or help would be great thanks! Hopefully my pics works!

I suggest the following:
1. Keep your substrate more damp and pack it down with your hand.
2. Feed them on a upside down butter tub lid or a terra cotta saucer.
3. Add a a lot more variety to the diet. Weeds and grass. If you must use grocery store foods, then favor endive and escarole heavily. Your tortoise needs some grass in the diet. You can also add some mulberry, grape and hibiscus leaves to the mix. Spineless opuntia pads are also great.
4. Keep your tortoises up off the floor and in a proper enclosure.

 

[Zamric]

Just chiming in on my oppinion about soaking .... I soak once a day but only since hatching. I had no exisisting pyramiding when I started my 2 Leopards. With once a day Soaking and High Humidity enclosure, they are smooth as can be! 0% Pyramiding!

 

[animalfreak]

I suggest the following:
1. Keep your substrate more damp and pack it down with your hand.
2. Feed them on a upside down butter tub lid or a terra cotta saucer.
3. Add a a lot more variety to the diet. Weeds and grass. If you must use grocery store foods, then favor endive and escarole heavily. Your tortoise needs some grass in the diet. You can also add some mulberry, grape and hibiscus leaves to the mix. Spineless opuntia pads are also great.
4. Keep your tortoises up off the floor and in a proper enclosure.

Okay thank you I will start to work on that! Thank you all for your help! And what about the outdoor enclosure?