Misled about age?

[Tom]

I still think they meant well for the most part. Thanks for all the help!

I think in most cases you are right. The pet store people are usually not malicious or lying on purpose. I think many of them have been misled and taught the usual old wrong info, but they mean well. Its a sad situation all around.

 

[Kevboosh]

Tortoises flip upside down in those bowls. Its not safe to use for tortoises, even with no water. Those bowls are great for lizards and snakes, but unsafe for a rigid shelled animal. Use terra cotta plant saucers sunk into the substrate for food and water. Keep a couple of extras on hand for if one gets dirty or broken. These saucers are cheap and can be found at any hardware store or garden center.

I know it is upsetting to find out the pet store gave you all the wrong info and products after you spent all that money and worked so hard to do everything right. This happens to soooo many people. It would be even more upsetting if you were to come home and find your tortoise upside down, covered with its own feces, and dead in that ramped bowl.

We don't want to upset and frustrate you. We want to help you have a healthy tortoise and a happy tortoise keeping experience. Once you get through all this and have the right set up, you'll be able to go about the process of enjoying your new tortoise. Sorry man. I wish I could push a magic button and fix this problem, but so far I have not been able to find a magical solution.

Nah it's fine. I was frustrated at the pet store and myself but you guys did an amazing job of making me feel better.

 

[Cathie G]

I think in most cases you are right. The pet store people are usually not malicious or lying on purpose. I think many of them have been misled and taught the usual old wrong info, but they mean well. Its a sad situation all around.

Yes.

 

[Cathie G]

Yes.

And what I've found is the employees actually don't mind learning a bit. I'm not an expert but I know a little from experience and what I've learned here. It's fun to share it with them through conversation. Spread the good work ☺️🐢

 

[Cathie G]

I've been here reading over the past couple months, preparing. Just did a bad job at it lol. Found out which species I thought I could give a great home too and what they needed(shouldve looked up brand names and models for the lights). Been on waiting lists for a russian but I knew they wouldnt be captive bred and was scared to order one through the mail. When I, on a whim, called a pet store a little further away and they said they had one who was captive bred, I jumped on it. They impressed me so I deferred supply selection to them. I still think they meant well for the most part. Thanks for all the help!

You'll be ok don't worry. I decided I wanted a Russian too. Sapphire is still here with me 17 years later despite all the odds. That cheers me up just thinking about it. Just Don't trust that dang Russian whatever you do!🙃😁. Their nickname is escape artist for a reason 😜 nothing you read could prepare you for a little Russian.😊😘

 

[Kevboosh]

Those are not recommended. The way they make heat is not good for tortoise shells. Overly desiccating.

You probably don't need ambient heat living in CA. Your heat lamp can warm things up during the day, and room temp is fine for night.

It would be best to move this guy to a safe secure outdoor enclosure with a temperature controlled shelter. This is explained further in the care sheet in the link from SinLA.

This looks a lot like what I used for my sulcata years ago. Thoughts? Bad for eyes? If this is good, what else should I have with it? Will I still need a uvb tube light? I will get a dome fixture thing for it.

 

[Tom]

This looks a lot like what I used for my sulcata years ago. Thoughts? Bad for eyes? If this is good, what else should I have with it? Will I still need a uvb tube light? I will get a dome fixture thing for it.

No. Wrong type of bulb. Those cause pyramiding, and they are unreliable for their UV output.

Here is a breakdown of the four heating and lighting essentials:

1. Basking bulb. I use 65 watt incandescent floods from the hardware store. Some people will need bigger, or smaller wattage bulbs. Let your thermometer be your guide. I run them on a timer for about 12 hours and adjust the height to get the correct basking temp under them. I also like to use a flat rock of some sort directly under the bulb. You need to check the temp with a thermometer directly under the bulb and get it to around 95-100F (36-37C).
2. Ambient heat maintenance. I use ceramic heating elements or radiant heat panels set on thermostats to maintain ambient above 80 degrees day and night for tropical species. In most cases you'd only need day heat for a temperate species like Testudo or DT, as long as your house stays above 60F (15-16C) at night. Some people in colder climates or with larger enclosures will need multiple CHEs or RHPs to spread out enough heat.
3. Ambient light. I use LEDs for this purpose. Something in the 5000-6500K color range will look the best. Most bulbs at the store are in the 2500K range and they look yellowish. Strip or screw-in LED bulb types are both fine.
4. UV. If you can get your tortoise outside for an hour 2 or 3 times a week, you won't need indoor UV. In colder climates, get one of the newer HO type fluorescent tubes. Which type will depend on mounting height. 5.0 bulbs make almost no UV. I like the 12% HO bulbs from Arcadia. You need a meter to check this: https://www.solarmeter.com/model65.html A good UV bulb only needs to run for 2-3 hours mid day. You need the basking bulb and the ambient lighting to be on at least 12 hours a day.

 

[Kevboosh]

No. Wrong type of bulb. Those cause pyramiding, and they are unreliable for their UV output.

Here is a breakdown of the four heating and lighting essentials:

1. Basking bulb. I use 65 watt incandescent floods from the hardware store. Some people will need bigger, or smaller wattage bulbs. Let your thermometer be your guide. I run them on a timer for about 12 hours and adjust the height to get the correct basking temp under them. I also like to use a flat rock of some sort directly under the bulb. You need to check the temp with a thermometer directly under the bulb and get it to around 95-100F (36-37C).
2. Ambient heat maintenance. I use ceramic heating elements or radiant heat panels set on thermostats to maintain ambient above 80 degrees day and night for tropical species. In most cases you'd only need day heat for a temperate species like Testudo or DT, as long as your house stays above 60F (15-16C) at night. Some people in colder climates or with larger enclosures will need multiple CHEs or RHPs to spread out enough heat.
3. Ambient light. I use LEDs for this purpose. Something in the 5000-6500K color range will look the best. Most bulbs at the store are in the 2500K range and they look yellowish. Strip or screw-in LED bulb types are both fine.
4. UV. If you can get your tortoise outside for an hour 2 or 3 times a week, you won't need indoor UV. In colder climates, get one of the newer HO type fluorescent tubes. Which type will depend on mounting height. 5.0 bulbs make almost no UV. I like the 12% HO bulbs from Arcadia. You need a meter to check this: https://www.solarmeter.com/model65.html A good UV bulb only needs to run for 2-3 hours mid day. You need the basking bulb and the ambient lighting to be on at least 12 hours a day.

Thank you

 

[Kevboosh]

No. Wrong type of bulb. Those cause pyramiding, and they are unreliable for their UV output.

Here is a breakdown of the four heating and lighting essentials:

1. Basking bulb. I use 65 watt incandescent floods from the hardware store. Some people will need bigger, or smaller wattage bulbs. Let your thermometer be your guide. I run them on a timer for about 12 hours and adjust the height to get the correct basking temp under them. I also like to use a flat rock of some sort directly under the bulb. You need to check the temp with a thermometer directly under the bulb and get it to around 95-100F (36-37C).
2. Ambient heat maintenance. I use ceramic heating elements or radiant heat panels set on thermostats to maintain ambient above 80 degrees day and night for tropical species. In most cases you'd only need day heat for a temperate species like Testudo or DT, as long as your house stays above 60F (15-16C) at night. Some people in colder climates or with larger enclosures will need multiple CHEs or RHPs to spread out enough heat.
3. Ambient light. I use LEDs for this purpose. Something in the 5000-6500K color range will look the best. Most bulbs at the store are in the 2500K range and they look yellowish. Strip or screw-in LED bulb types are both fine.
4. UV. If you can get your tortoise outside for an hour 2 or 3 times a week, you won't need indoor UV. In colder climates, get one of the newer HO type fluorescent tubes. Which type will depend on mounting height. 5.0 bulbs make almost no UV. I like the 12% HO bulbs from Arcadia. You need a meter to check this: https://www.solarmeter.com/model65.html A good UV bulb only needs to run for 2-3 hours mid day. You need the basking bulb and the ambient lighting to be on at least 12 hours a day.

Apparently I cant get a 65 watt incandescent flood light in california because they're illegal here.... Any alternative you can suggest?

 

[SinLA]

Apparently I cant get a 65 watt incandescent flood light in california because they're illegal here.... Any alternative you can suggest?

Same. do you have friends or family in another state? I order it from amazon and send to my parents in NJ and then they forward it to me. It will take a little bit of time but that works.

Also if you are near any other TFO people they may have. If you are down in LA anytime soon I could give you from my stash to tide you over...

 

[Tom]

Apparently I cant get a 65 watt incandescent flood light in california because they're illegal here.... Any alternative you can suggest?

That is correct. You have to have someone buy it out of state and mail it to you. Its a pain. I buy them when I leave the state, or have a friend out of state order them on Amazon, and then slap a new label on it and forward it on to me once they get it.

 

[Kevboosh]

I have a friend in oregon who would help. Should I get something different than what I'd been using until then or just keep using what I have? Was going to return the dish and stuff to the pet store tomorrow. I looked up the prices on the things I got and that pet store charged me over double the petco prices. Any belief I had that they were just misinformed is completely gone. 100% crooked.

 

[Tom]

I have a friend in oregon who would help. Should I get something different than what I'd been using until then or just keep using what I have? Was going to return the dish and stuff to the pet store tomorrow. I looked up the prices on the things I got and that pet store charged me over double the petco prices. Any belief I had that they were just misinformed is completely gone. 100% crooked.

They might be crooked, but the costs to operate a brick and mortar store in CA have become astronomical. The government fees and restrictions are criminal, and the cost of everything has gone up everywhere. It might just be that their prices reflect what it takes to stay in business and make a living in a state run by morally bankrupt criminals. I highly doubt the owner of the pet store lives in a mansion and drives a Ferrari. And the information they shared with you is the same wrong information that is taught and learned everywhere. I used to be part of that machine. 30 years ago in the mid 80s, they taught me all that stuff, and I was the kid in the pet store with all the good intentions, but all the wrong information, telling every customer that walked in the door.

 

[Kevboosh]

They might be crooked, but the costs to operate a brick and mortar store in CA have become astronomical. The government fees and restrictions are criminal, and the cost of everything has gone up everywhere. It might just be that their prices reflect what it takes to stay in business and make a living in a state run by morally bankrupt criminals. I highly doubt the owner of the pet store lives in a mansion and drives a Ferrari. And the information they shared with you is the same wrong information that is taught and learned everywhere. I used to be part of that machine. 30 years ago in the mid 80s, they taught me all that stuff, and I was the kid in the pet store with all the good intentions, but all the wrong information, telling every customer that walked in the door.

I agree with you on all that stuff. I don't think this that type of situation though.

 

[Tom]

I agree with you on all that stuff. I don't think this that type of situation though.

Okay. And math is clearly not my strong point.

 

[Kevboosh]

I'm going to use this until I get my illicit 65 watt incandescent flood bulbs smuggled across the border.

 

[Cathie G]

I'm going to use this until I get my illicit 65 watt incandescent flood bulbs smuggled across the border.

I like Flukers stuff but Tom can tell you better about how to mount that bulb. Leave it to Flukers to get an incandescent bulb into California legitimately 😁 ☺️

 

[Tom]

I'm going to use this until I get my illicit 65 watt incandescent flood bulbs smuggled across the border.

That should be fine for a full grown adult. Set the bulb height by laying a digital thermometer on its back at tortoise shell height directly under the bulb and letting it bake there for an hour or more. Raise or lower the fixture to get the temperature stable at around 95-100 degrees.

 

[Kevboosh]

Update: The incandescent light and ceramic heat emitter setup is a huge improvement so far. He's done a little bit of exploring and a lot of basking. Right now he seems to be eyeing his food but not ready to stop basking yet. I'm setting up a bigger kiddie pool for him right now because the one I bought when I thought he was going to be a baby is an escape risk if he flips a dish or something. I will move him into it the day after he eats.