Lighting issues as well as a check-in on tortoise health

[addyson123]

Hello everyone, first of all I hope you are all having a good day and staying safe.

So when I first got my russian tortoise on my 13th birthday, about a year ago, I did a lot of research and thought that the best option would be to buy a combo "Lighting Kit" like the one here. It came with the lamp that holds two compact bulbs, one uvb and one basking. This seemed like the right option as I had seen on many official looking websites and was told by the people at the pet store that I bought him at that it would work great. However, in the past few months I have discovered this forum and it has helped me a lot with a bunch of different issues that I have encountered. Well, after reading some of the posts here I have noticed that a lot of my set-up is not ideal for my tortoise. With that being said, I have a few questions.

I live in Oregon, so the weather hasn't been perfect to take him outside very often but I let him roam around my house some and in the summertime last year I would take him out to a small outdoor enclosure for a few hours to get some natural sunlight while I worked on school work on my porch and I plan to do this again as soon as the weather gets consistently dry. Right now he is and has been living in a 50 gallon aquarium that I have covered about halfway up the sides with wallpaper so he can't see out. I know that this isn't a great size and I do plan on getting a bigger enclosure, probably by making it myself. As of now it is filled with about 4 inches of damp coconut coir substrate that I dump water in and mix around every other day so that it stays damp. I feed him a mixture of food everyday, usually a bit of romaine and radicchio as well as a few weeds from my garden like dandelions and clovers. He has a cave that I made out of a wooden basket that I cut an entrance out of as well as a bendable wooden hide/bridge that he can go under of walk across. His lamp hangs above the right side of his enclosure directly above his basking slate and a patch of substrate that he likes to dig in.

I have heard that the compact florescent uvb bulb doesn't work well and can hurt tortoises' eyes so I would like to find a better option. I don't have a lid for my enclosure so ideally I would want to find a bulb that works in my mini lamp fixture but if that isn't possible, I can figure something else out. I also want to fix the basking lamp issue because I have had to replace it about every two months and I haven't had to replace the uvb bulb at all yet. This might just be how it works with those kind of bulbs, but do any of you have suggestions for better bulbs that could fit in the lamp fixture that I already have? I am also worried that his enclosure gets too cold at night as I have a large air conditioner near him, but it is facing away, and towards the other side of the room. What is your suggestion for nighttime heaters?

Okay, so with all of that information, I will post some pictures of him and can you tell me if he has any obvious issues based on his appearance? The people at the pet store I got him (which was a place in Newberg, OR called Critter Cabana) told me that he was about 2 years old at the time, which would make him nearly 3 now. I am also fairly certain that he is a male because his tail is very long and it curls to the side. He is 5 inches long and 4 inches wide, I'm not sure of his weight. He also has a few "battle scars" or chipped pieces off of his shell from when I first got him, which makes me think he could be wild caught and not bred like the store told me. Here are the pictures:

 

[iAmCentrochelys sulcata]

He’s a male, it doesn’t appear that your tortoise has any issues from the picture.
Is he eating, drinking, and pooping?
I’m not sure about the age. If does look pretty young.
Those UVB coil bulbs are bad. You should use a T5 which I’ll link.
Good luck!

T5 Lamps - Effective UV-B Energy - Arcadia Reptile

Arcadia T5 lamps are world renowned as being the best on the market. We guarantee the UV-B output for 12 months. Powers into enclosures and through mesh.

www.arcadiareptile.com

 

[addyson123]

He’s a male, it doesn’t appear that your tortoise has any issues from the picture.
Is he eating, drinking, and pooping?
I’m not sure about the age. If does look pretty young.
Those UVB coil bulbs are bad. You should use a T5 which I’ll link.
Good luck!

T5 Lamps - Effective UV-B Energy - Arcadia Reptile

Arcadia T5 lamps are world renowned as being the best on the market. We guarantee the UV-B output for 12 months. Powers into enclosures and through mesh.

www.arcadiareptile.com

Okay, thank you very much! I’ll check those out, I want the very best for him.

 

[iAmCentrochelys sulcata]

Okay, thank you very much! I’ll check those out, I want the very best for him.

What’s the size of the enclosure?

 

[addyson123]

What’s the size of the enclosure?

I mentioned in the post, but it's a 50 gallon tank. I may replace it with a bigger one soon though, I have more time now that school is online.

 

[iAmCentrochelys sulcata]

Pardon me I was skimming thru the post, you'll need something way bigger.

 

[addyson123]

Pardon me I was skimming thru the post, you'll need something way bigger.

Yes I know, I'm looking into it now. The place I got him said I needed a 40 gallon or above so I got 50 gallon but the more I look into it and get professional advice, I now know that it's not enough.

 

[addyson123]

I've been researching more about enclosures and I've got to say I'm very disappointed in ZooMed's website! It says "If being kept indoors an adult Russian tortoise will need at least a 30 gallon terrarium" That's way too small right??

They also said "Do not keep Russian Tortoises on damp substrate! (Substrate must be kept dry)" ?

 

[KBeam]

Looks like you’re doing a great job with him. Keep reading and keep learning and I’m sure you’ll do great.

 

[addyson123]

Looks like you’re doing a great job with him. Keep reading and keep learning and I’m sure you’ll do great.

Thanks so much! I love him and I'm trying very hard to make him as happy as he can be.

 

[addyson123]

@Tom @Yvonne G @CarolM @Tidgy's Dad

I could really use your help!

 

[addyson123]

Hello everyone, first of all I hope you are all having a good day and staying safe.

So when I first got my russian tortoise on my 13th birthday, about a year ago, I did a lot of research and thought that the best option would be to buy a combo "Lighting Kit" like the one here. It came with the lamp that holds two compact bulbs, one uvb and one basking. This seemed like the right option as I had seen on many official looking websites and was told by the people at the pet store that I bought him at that it would work great. However, in the past few months I have discovered this forum and it has helped me a lot with a bunch of different issues that I have encountered. Well, after reading some of the posts here I have noticed that a lot of my set-up is not ideal for my tortoise. With that being said, I have a few questions.

I live in Oregon, so the weather hasn't been perfect to take him outside very often but I let him roam around my house some and in the summertime last year I would take him out to a small outdoor enclosure for a few hours to get some natural sunlight while I worked on school work on my porch and I plan to do this again as soon as the weather gets consistently dry. Right now he is and has been living in a 50 gallon aquarium that I have covered about halfway up the sides with wallpaper so he can't see out. I know that this isn't a great size and I do plan on getting a bigger enclosure, probably by making it myself. As of now it is filled with about 4 inches of damp coconut coir substrate that I dump water in and mix around every other day so that it stays damp. I feed him a mixture of food everyday, usually a bit of romaine and radicchio as well as a few weeds from my garden like dandelions and clovers. He has a cave that I made out of a wooden basket that I cut an entrance out of as well as a bendable wooden hide/bridge that he can go under of walk across. His lamp hangs above the right side of his enclosure directly above his basking slate and a patch of substrate that he likes to dig in.

I have heard that the compact florescent uvb bulb doesn't work well and can hurt tortoises' eyes so I would like to find a better option. I don't have a lid for my enclosure so ideally I would want to find a bulb that works in my mini lamp fixture but if that isn't possible, I can figure something else out. I also want to fix the basking lamp issue because I have had to replace it about every two months and I haven't had to replace the uvb bulb at all yet. This might just be how it works with those kind of bulbs, but do any of you have suggestions for better bulbs that could fit in the lamp fixture that I already have? I am also worried that his enclosure gets too cold at night as I have a large air conditioner near him, but it is facing away, and towards the other side of the room. What is your suggestion for nighttime heaters?

Okay, so with all of that information, I will post some pictures of him and can you tell me if he has any obvious issues based on his appearance? The people at the pet store I got him (which was a place in Newberg, OR called Critter Cabana) told me that he was about 2 years old at the time, which would make him nearly 3 now. I am also fairly certain that he is a male because his tail is very long and it curls to the side. He is 5 inches long and 4 inches wide, I'm not sure of his weight. He also has a few "battle scars" or chipped pieces off of his shell from when I first got him, which makes me think he could be wild caught and not bred like the store told me. Here are the pictures:

View attachment 293470View attachment 293471View attachment 293472View attachment 293473View attachment 293474

Just a little update, I am planning on DIY making a 4x6 table out of wood from Lowes sometime soon and I also am planning on getting a new lamp that holds higher wattages as well as a 100w ceramic heat emmiter bulb and a 125w mercury vapor bulb because after reading reveiws that seems to be the best option. Would this be a good set-up for him, and will he be getting enough heat and UVB with the bulbs listed above? Thanks!

 

[Tom]

There are four elements to heating and lighting:

1. Basking bulb. I use 65 watt floods from the hardware store. I run them on a timer for 12 hours and adjust the height to get the correct basking temp under them. You can mount a fixture on the ceiling, or hang a dome lamp from the ceiling. Go lower or higher wattage if this makes the enclosure too hot or not warm enough. Do not use "spot" bulbs, mercury vapor bulbs or halogen bulbs.
2. Ambient heat maintenance. Unless your house gets unusually cold at night, you can skip this step for a Russian or other Testudo species. Night lows above 60 require no night heat for Testudo species.
3. Light. I use florescent tubes for this purpose. Something in the 5000-6500K color range will look the best. Most tubes at the store are in the 2500K range and they look yellowish. I've been using LEDs lately and they are great, and run cooler than a florescent. This can be set on the same timer as the basking bulb. If your tortoises room is already adequately lit, you don't need this one either.
4. UV. If you can get your tortoise outside in a safe secure enclosure for an hour 2 or 3 times a week, you won't need indoor UV. If you want it anyway, get one of the newer HO type fluorescent tubes. Which type will depend on mounting height. It helps to have a UV meter to test and see what your bulb is actually putting out at your mounting height. Plexi-glass or screen tops will filter out some or all of the UV produced by your bulb. Regular "T 8" type UV tubes produce hardly any UV. CFL type UV bulbs are also ineffective, and sometimes dangerous, and should not be used.

 

[addyson123]

There are four elements to heating and lighting:

1. Basking bulb. I use 65 watt floods from the hardware store. I run them on a timer for 12 hours and adjust the height to get the correct basking temp under them. You can mount a fixture on the ceiling, or hang a dome lamp from the ceiling. Go lower or higher wattage if this makes the enclosure too hot or not warm enough. Do not use "spot" bulbs, mercury vapor bulbs or halogen bulbs.
2. Ambient heat maintenance. Unless your house gets unusually cold at night, you can skip this step for a Russian or other Testudo species. Night lows above 60 require no night heat for Testudo species.
3. Light. I use florescent tubes for this purpose. Something in the 5000-6500K color range will look the best. Most tubes at the store are in the 2500K range and they look yellowish. I've been using LEDs lately and they are great, and run cooler than a florescent. This can be set on the same timer as the basking bulb. If your tortoises room is already adequately lit, you don't need this one either.
4. UV. If you can get your tortoise outside in a safe secure enclosure for an hour 2 or 3 times a week, you won't need indoor UV. If you want it anyway, get one of the newer HO type fluorescent tubes. Which type will depend on mounting height. It helps to have a UV meter to test and see what your bulb is actually putting out at your mounting height. Plexi-glass or screen tops will filter out some or all of the UV produced by your bulb. Regular "T 8" type UV tubes produce hardly any UV. CFL type UV bulbs are also ineffective, and sometimes dangerous, and should not be used.

Okay, thanks for the reply. I will keep this in mind, I am just wondering, is there a specific reason you are against mercury vapor bulbs? From what I've read they seem like a good option because they let out UV as well as heat and light.

 

[iAmCentrochelys sulcata]

Okay, thanks for the reply. I will keep this in mind, I am just wondering, is there a specific reason you are against mercury vapor bulbs? From what I've read they seem like a good option because they let out UV as well as heat and light.

They Dry out the carapace, which results in Pyramiding.

 

[Tom]

Okay, thanks for the reply. I will keep this in mind, I am just wondering, is there a specific reason you are against mercury vapor bulbs? From what I've read they seem like a good option because they let out UV as well as heat and light.

MVBs are delicate, temperamental, cut themselves off randomly, must be used in the correct type of fixture, often burn out prematurely, often stop producing UV after 3 months, and worst fo all, they generate high levels of UV A, which causes pyramiding.

 

[addyson123]

MVBs are delicate, temperamental, cut themselves off randomly, must be used in the correct type of fixture, often burn out prematurely, often stop producing UV after 3 months, and worst fo all, they generate high levels of UV A, which causes pyramiding.

Okay i’ll definitely do more research then. Thank you.

 

[Tom]

Okay i’ll definitely do more research then. Thank you.

Research? What are you going to read?

Most of the stuff written for tortoise care is old and wrong. Its the same stuff that has been parroted for years.

 

[addyson123]

Research? What are you going to read?

Most of the stuff written for tortoise care is old and wrong. Its the same stuff that has been parroted for years.

I meant as in where to find the bulbs you were talking about locally. I’m going to order some things tomorrow.

 

[Yvonne G]

I may be way off base here, but for a full grown Russian tortoise, like yours, I think the MVB is ok. Just be sure to hang it high enough that it doesn't burn the tortoise's shell. I used them for years and the only problem I had with them was with baby tortoises, young, growing tortoises, which yours is not.

Provide a big enough enclosure with plenty of shade-making objects in it. For example plants, whether real or fake, decorations, etc. Give him a couple hiding places to choose from.

The problem with keeping a Russian tortoise indoors is it's hard to give them a big enough enclosure. Russian tortoises are hard wired to wander great distances looking for food. When contained in an indoor enclosure that's not big enough they dig at the corners, pace the walls, try to climb out. The very best place for a full grown Russian tortoise is in a save and secure outdoor pen/yard.