Leopard Tortoise Indoor Setup (oops! Hingeback!!)

[TortoiseLeopard]

Good Day Everyone I have a baby leopard tortoise he is approx 1 months old he is now 2,5 inches long and weighs 54 grams he is a wild caught tortoise which I got from some people that did not want to take care of it as it was too small and they were scared it will disappear in there garden. I am located in South Africa where these tortoises come from. Here is my main reason for starting a new thread i need to know if my indoor setup for my tortoise is correct I build him a tortoise table it is 1200mm long x 600mm wide x 250mm in height open top.
I currently have one compact florescent spiral bulb 5.0% 15w (with no bulb cover just the light) that is in the middel of the enclosure aprrox 25cm from the ground of the enclosure is this enough uvb light? .On the Basking end i have a 75w infrared basking light that is currently giving a basking temperature of 95 degrees Fahrenheit the cooler site of the enclosure is stable at 75 degrees Fahrenheit? My tortoise is very inactive and sleep the whole day he has never used the basking spot and always hides But he does seem to eat when I put him in front of his food he like hibiscus flowers and diffrent types of lettuces like a spring mix. My concerns are that he never walks around in his enclosure always hides never goes to his feeding spot to eat I always have to put him there otherwise he doesn't eat at all I have had him for 9 days and he has been in his new indoor enclosure 7 days and he gets soaked everyday for 15 min here are some pics maybe someone here can help with some advice? This is just temporarily setup I intend to build an outdoor enclosure as soon as he get like twice this size I have plenty of outdoor space for him but there are lots of birds that would eat him especially if he is this small ?

 

[Killerrookie]

Get rid of the coil bulb and the red night light because both irate the eyes and cause blindness. The sand also needs to go also. You need humidity in the enclosure to keep your leopard nice and smooth. Go check out are sulcata and leopard care sheet in the threads that's should give you an idea on what to do. @Tom or any other expert that can help you even more or better than I can will be here shortly. Bump up the cool area to the 80's also and I don't really recommend feeding the guy lettuce and spring mix much. You able to grow some grass or weeds or go outside and pick some? Make sure they are safe to eat before feeding him them.

 

[wellington]

Yes, please do not use the coil bulb. The red bulb does not cause eye problems, but you should turn it off at night. A CHE is good for night heat, no light to it and a MVB is good for uvb. If you can get it outside for natural sunlight, that is best. The humidity should be 80% with temps no lower then 80 basking 95+. The sand can cause impaction, use coconut coir, holds humidity well and will not mold. The baby will take some time to adjust, specially being wild caught. Check out Toms threads below in my post for proper housing. I would also put the basking rock flat and give a bigger wate r dish so he can soak himself and you should give him a warm water soak daily. Also feed on a flat rock or dish with very low sides.

 

[TortoiseLeopard]

Thanks for the reply that light is a uvb repti zoo 5.0 15w uvb light spiral type I will definitely change the sand and use some coconut coir.
I do switch off both lights at night and the temp stays around 70 Fahrenheit at night time it does not really get that cold where I live I also bought some seeds of dandelion, wild rocket, mustard greens, endive,collard greens, wheatgrass, Barley and arugula and different types of grass that I am growing I also take some grass from my lawn but he doesn't want to eat it at all.

 

[TortoiseLeopard]

I also have a slate tile that is flat for feeding him on will also look at getting a bigger and flatter water bowl but that was the best my pet shop had at the time.

 

[TortoiseLeopard]

I also take him outside when I can for about 2 hours or so in nice weather around 80 fahrenheit in direct sunlight.

 

[Yvonne G]

Hi, and welcome to the Forum!

I don't think that's a leopard tortoise. It might be a bowsprit?????? Let's ask @Will or @tortadise for their opinion.

 

[tortadise]

Welcome! you have a Kinixys species. What region or area of South Africa are you in? There's quite a few species of Kinxixys (Hingeback) in South Africa so region would be helpful. We don't see many kinixys Lobatsiana, Kinixys zombensis, kinixys natalensis offspring(although I'm ruling out natalensis as it does not have a tricuspid beak. A major identifying factor of natalensis) sand is most definitely not the most suitable substrate either for any of the South African hingebacks. You can leave the sand but mix a lot of soil in with it along with some plants. They're very reclusive during the day and often come out in the mornings/evenings. They enjoy spray downs as well, along with it being a crucial part of the young being reared up. Offer broad plant, worms, snails, and cactus blooms and cactus flesh. I would also get a tube UVB bulb for the little guy.


The only two species of kinixys with prefrontal scales in your area is kinixys zombensis(southeastern hingeback) and kinixys lobatsiana which are more northern towards Mozambique and most densely populations in Botswana.

 

[wellington]

Good call Yvonne. I thought it looked a little funny for being a leopard, but then again, I have never seen a hatchling from the wilds.
Please keep us posted on his progress, as Tortadise said, we don't see many.

 

[TortoiseLeopard]

Welcome! you have a Kinixys species. What region or area of South Africa are you in? There's quite a few species of Kinxixys (Hingeback) in South Africa so region would be helpful. We don't see many kinixys Lobatsiana, Kinixys zombensis, kinixys natalensis offspring(although I'm ruling out natalensis as it does not have a tricuspid beak. A major identifying factor of natalensis) sand is most definitely not the most suitable substrate either for any of the South African hingebacks. You can leave the sand but mix a lot of soil in with it along with some plants. They're very reclusive during the day and often come out in the mornings/evenings. They enjoy spray downs as well, along with it being a crucial part of the young being reared up. Offer broad plant, worms, snails, and cactus blooms and cactus flesh. I would also get a tube UVB bulb for the little guy.


The only two species of kinixys with prefrontal scales in your area is kinixys zombensis(southeastern hingeback) and kinixys lobatsiana which are more northern towards Mozambique and most densely populations in Botswana.

Hi there thanks for your help I am really thought it was a leopard I am located in Kwa Zulu Natal South Africa maybe you will be able to pin point the species with my region?

 

[TortoiseLeopard]

Good call Yvonne. I thought it looked a little funny for being a leopard, but then again, I have never seen a hatchling from the wilds.
Please keep us posted on his progress, as Tortadise said, we don't see many.

Hi will do thanks

 

[TortoiseLeopard]

Good call Yvonne. I thought it looked a little funny for being a leopard, but then again, I have never seen a hatchling from the wilds.
Please keep us posted on his progress, as Tortadise said, we don't see many.

Hi Yvonne looks like you might be right I am new to tortoises so any help will be much appreciated thanks

 

[Kapidolo Farms]

I agree with @tortadise you have a hingeback.

Your thread may get sidetracked regarding the spiral bulb, so no matter its future, best to take it out of the conversation. The red bulb is now also suspect with a variety of problems with tortoises and their optimal outcome as captives.

You might also get a whirlwind of points of view about it being a wild tortoise, put it back in the wild blah blah blah. Odds are high that placed back in the wild it wouldn't survive to adult hood and reproduce, you effectively play the role of a predator by taking it out of the wild population, but instead of eating it you are having it as a pet. That said it is no doubt illegal in RSA/your province to keep it, so discretion is wise.

Now further, you might reconsider your housing from much earlier in your interest. If it is indeed a local species, it would be most easy to enclose a large-ish area outside, secured from predators and augmented with your nurturing, to have it outside all the time resolved 90%(some high percent, no need to get stuck on the digits) of captive husbandry issues.

By going to http://sarca.adu.org.za/ and looking around you can see where you live and where various reptile species live to sort out how well your area fits where the tortoise might live, in a gross sense. Then you have all the temps, and lighting solved, automatically. Next is the micro climate of your enclosure, dense planting of edible things a few open spots, a shallow water basin that ALWAYS has water and an area where you will consistently place food would work.

Many people are here on TFO who are doing this with tortoises in southern Africa. Some share many images and narratives. There is also a FaceBook page called 'cape tortoises' and in that group are others with hingebacks etc from many parts of southern Africa, but also many people who will lament a 'wild' tortoise in captivity, even though they do it.

Small tortoises do hide much, they know they are vulnerable to predation, and your current enclosure is so open that it might find itself exposed, they are not hiding from your enclosure, but from predators they think might be there.

 

[Kapidolo Farms]

Here is a more local source of info http://www.carecentre.org.za/

 

[TortoiseLeopard]

I agree with @tortadise you have a hingeback.

Your thread may get sidetracked regarding the spiral bulb, so no matter its future, best to take it out of the conversation. The red bulb is now also suspect with a variety of problems with tortoises and their optimal outcome as captives.

You might also get a whirlwind of points of view about it being a wild tortoise, put it back in the wild blah blah blah. Odds are high that placed back in the wild it wouldn't survive to adult hood and reproduce, you effectively play the role of a predator by taking it out of the wild population, but instead of eating it you are having it as a pet. That said it is no doubt illegal in RSA/your province to keep it, so discretion is wise.

Now further, you might reconsider your housing from much earlier in your interest. If it is indeed a local species, it would be most easy to enclose a large-ish area outside, secured from predators and augmented with your nurturing, to have it outside all the time resolved 90%(some high percent, no need to get stuck on the digits) of captive husbandry issues.

By going to http://sarca.adu.org.za/ and looking around you can see where you live and where various reptile species live to sort out how well your area fits where the tortoise might live, in a gross sense. Then you have all the temps, and lighting solved, automatically. Next is the micro climate of your enclosure, dense planting of edible things a few open spots, a shallow water basin that ALWAYS has water and an area where you will consistently place food would work.

Many people are here on TFO who are doing this with tortoises in southern Africa. Some share many images and narratives. There is also a FaceBook page called 'cape tortoises' and in that group are others with hingebacks etc from many parts of southern Africa, but also many people who will lament a 'wild' tortoise in captivity, even though they do it.

Small tortoises do hide much, they know they are vulnerable to predation, and your current enclosure is so open that it might find itself exposed, they are not hiding from your enclosure, but from predators they think might be there.

Hi Will Thanks for your input I know that is illegal to have a tortoise as a pet in RSA but what choice do I have I couldn't let it die so I thought I might try to save it from these people that said I have thought about putting it back in the wild but I don't think he will survive very long. So thats why I am asking for help to try and get as much information as possible form this forum to give the little guy a chance

 

[TortoiseLeopard]

Here is a more local source of info http://www.carecentre.org.za/

Thanks will get in touch with them

 

[tortadise]

Well that rules out Lobatsiana. Again I've never seen many of those species as offspring. Perhaps they develop the tricuspid pronounced black as they mature. This must be a natalensis then given your territory and further looking at the photos. Natalensis are the smallest of the kinixys so I'd speculate this being 2.5 this animal is a year or more in age. Follow the links that Will provided. Lots of great info and keepers there. For sure though the substrate would be best with lots of dirt and mulch mixed in.

 

[TortoiseLeopard]

Well that rules out Lobatsiana. Again I've never seen many of those species as offspring. Perhaps they develop the tricuspid pronounced black as they mature. This must be a natalensis then given your territory and further looking at the photos. Natalensis are the smallest of the kinixys so I'd speculate this being 2.5 this animal is a year or more in age. Follow the links that Will provided. Lots of great info and keepers there. For sure though the substrate would be best with lots of dirt and mulch mixed in.

I also had a look at the natalensis hinge back tortoise and the more I look at my tortoise I see the resemblance I am busy doing plenty of research about this species hoping to learn what to they eat and what they require

 

[tortadise]

I also had a look at the natalensis hinge back tortoise and the more I look at my tortoise I see the resemblance I am busy doing plenty of research about this species hoping to learn what to they eat and what they require

Yeah it's looking more and more like it. Was so against saying it was in the beginning because their have the beak as a main identifier. But your location is only represented of natals especially that appearance. Spekkii don't venture that far down and zombensis are much much different looking. Such an awesome very rare species except where your from.

 

[Kapidolo Farms]

It's exciting to see the images, now that Kelly has further determined the species. With that in mind, it may never outgrow avian predators. So an outdoor enclosure with a screen top, somewhat like a chicken coop (for lack of a better description) might be a best case. I don't recall where on TFO i have seen the images but Arizona Tortoise Compound breeder, Andrew, has built this kind of enclosure, if I remember correctly.