In over my head

EllieMay

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My dream dog has always been an English bulldog.. so when my Yorke passed last year, I finally went and got me one. I had done lots of research and considered myself aware of health conditions they could be prone to. My baby Cinder will be 6 months old tomorrow and she is everything I had hoped and more... last week I noticed her giving to one of her back legs.. I immediately took her to the vet fearing hip dysplasia or worse.. she was diagnosed with a luxating patella.. ( dislocating knee cap) . Vet put her on some anti inflammatories and said it’s possible it can heal on it’s own . If it’s not better in a week, probable surgery. He did say that her x rays including her hips looked good. Anyway, I’m not always very trusting of vets so naturally I came straight home and started educating myself. I ordered her a brace to help stabilize, joint supplements, and special food to support the healing process. I have also been doing water therapy with her... I would really like to avoid surgery as she is still so young... on the flip side, I want to do what’s best for her and I am second guessing myself... how long should I give her to try healing on her own.? She is still very active and full throttle and it’s hard to keep her calm and still. Her leg does not seem to be improving yet but she is also not that bothered by it... I can feel the knee cap still luxating at times but she doesn’t mind me massaging or exercising her... does anyone have any input for this situation?
 

Blackdog1714

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That is exactly why I have health insurance for my dogs! Poor baby the water therapy is really gonna help. Does Cinder do any stairs- I put a ramp in years ago and am very glad I did it. Good luck you deserve it!
 

EllieMay

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That is exactly why I have health insurance for my dogs! Poor baby the water therapy is really gonna help. Does Cinder do any stairs- I put a ramp in years ago and am very glad I did it. Good luck you deserve it!
I do have a couple doggy stairs for her but she has not been allowed to use them since this started... I am going to take her x-Ray films and see a specialist next week... it’s just that I think vets around here have become so busy that they all want to jump to the first common conclusion instead of evaluating the individual patient...it sucks because I’m the first to admit that I’m not smarter than them or trained in their field.... yeti often find myself doing a better job of helping my animals at home... and I have been thinking about the health insurance for Cinder. Who do you use?
 

Blackdog1714

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Nationwide. Sadly you are very true that Vets are becoming like real doctors-booking more appointments than they have time for per hour. It is like a smash and grab robbery at a jewelry store. I am fortunate that we have a surgeon here in town that is excellent all around. With the brace and therapy you may not need surgery. By increasing the strength in the surrounding muscles it should self correct. You have to be diligent and really limit her activity when not doing therapy. Good Luck!
 

wellington

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Years ago I had a dog with both knees. I never heard of it getting better but that they could be lived with. They didnt have the stuff back then that they have out now for joint care etc.
My dog did very well without surgery. However, with your dog being a bull dog, and only 6 months now, I wouldn't give much hope with it getting better if that's even possible or it not being bothersome. Do not let her get over weight. At 6 months she would fly thru the surgery better then when she gets older. Good luck in trying to ward off needing surgery. If you change your mind I would for sure seek out an orthopedic vet.
 

EllieMay

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Years ago I had a dog with both knees. I never heard of it getting better but that they could be lived with. They didnt have the stuff back then that they have out now for joint care etc.
My dog did very well without surgery. However, with your dog being a bull dog, and only 6 months now, I wouldn't give much hope with it getting better if that's even possible or it not being bothersome. Do not let her get over weight. At 6 months she would fly thru the surgery better then when she gets older. Good luck in trying to ward off needing surgery. If you change your mind I would for sure seek out an orthopedic vet.
Thank you.. I am considering that as well. She has recently been spayed and did very well with that but I am just Leary of her being put to sleep.. bulldogs are risky there too..
 

Bee62

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I am so sorry to hear that your lovely Cinder is sick and needs surgery. I`ve read that sooner is better ( when the dog is still young ) but I have no own experience. Sorry.
 

wellington

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Thank you.. I am considering that as well. She has recently been spayed and did very well with that but I am just Leary of her being put to sleep.. bulldogs are risky there too..
Yes, surgery is risky for them, more then long snout dogs. However, even more risky the older they get. It's a rock and a hard place. Being only 6 months, you could give it 6 months with supplements etc and see how it goes. At a year old if no improvements then I would do surgery. A year is still young. Just keep the weight at the low end of normal and try to get her not too jump.
Good luck and keep us posted.
 

mark1

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i've had a couple dogs with this issue , a poodle , the smaller kind , vet did the surgery , then another , then another , then we put the dog down ...... moral of that story , if you get it done , get it done by a veterinary orthopedic surgeon .. I also had a neapolitan mastiff with this problem , big dog , took her to an ortho guy , was early on in vets specializing in stuff , he was doing the orthopedic surgeries in most of ohio …... he told me if it didn't come out often , to wait on it , ......never did a surgery she lived to be 12yrs and died from cancer ......... it did stop happening........ if it goes back in easily and stays in ? i 'd wait , unless it was a serious problem , and you can't get it to stay in ..... i'd walk the dog a lot , uphill and up stairs ....... going upstairs , CONTROLLED , is a great low impact exercise for dogs with hind quarter problems , knees and hips ......... a 6 month old eb is still getting bone , the groove possibly may deepen enough to hold it , and the dogs strength will increase ....... i'd be skeptical of someone wanting to fix a dog this young unless it was a painful and debilitating condition ......... if you do do a surgery , a competent experienced ortho surgeon ......
 

EllieMay

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i've had a couple dogs with this issue , a poodle , the smaller kind , vet did the surgery , then another , then another , then we put the dog down ...... moral of that story , if you get it done , get it done by a veterinary orthopedic surgeon .. I also had a neapolitan mastiff with this problem , big dog , took her to an ortho guy , was early on in vets specializing in stuff , he was doing the orthopedic surgeries in most of ohio …... he told me if it didn't come out often , to wait on it , ......never did a surgery she lived to be 12yrs and died from cancer ......... it did stop happening........ if it goes back in easily and stays in ? i 'd wait , unless it was a serious problem , and you can't get it to stay in ..... i'd walk the dog a lot , uphill and up stairs ....... going upstairs , CONTROLLED , is a great low impact exercise for dogs with hind quarter problems , knees and hips ......... a 6 month old eb is still getting bone , the groove possibly may deepen enough to hold it , and the dogs strength will increase ....... i'd be skeptical of someone wanting to fix a dog this young unless it was a painful and debilitating condition ......... if you do do a surgery , a competent experienced ortho surgeon ......
Thank you! Good information. I would most definitely be picky about a surgeon..
 

EllieMay

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Yes, surgery is risky for them, more then long snout dogs. However, even more risky the older they get. It's a rock and a hard place. Being only 6 months, you could give it 6 months with supplements etc and see how it goes. At a year old if no improvements then I would do surgery. A year is still young. Just keep the weight at the low end of normal and try to get her not too jump.
Good luck and keep us posted.
This is kind of what I was leaning towards as long as she didn’t seem to be in pain or loosing quality of life.... I really just want the best for her and if surgery is it, that’s fine too... I need to feel confident in it though.
 

EllieMay

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Suki has something like that. Her hips pop out of joint.
It's from inbreeding the teacup Chihuahua from what my vet says.
So far it hasn't been much of an issue. But it may require surgery in the future.
Is this a "boutique" dog thing?
I have read lots of info that points to genetic reasons but don’t think it’s always the case...it does seem that the higher demand breeds are a bit higher maintenance and I would bet it is from all the planned breeding to produce certain characteristics... people should leave that up to Mother Nature but that’s just my opinion of course..
 

Pistachio's Pamperer

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I feel the need to share some advice based on what I have seen growing up and used as a adult. (See my first ever post about my father and his shaman/Dr Doolittle type behavior. LOL)
Have you looked into the uses of colloidal silver? I add a few drops of it into any water made available to
any/all of my pets. It's something I would suggest to all pet owners not just ones having health issues.

I have a dog who has joint issues, he is a badly bred border collie with horrible genetics. We won't get into the vets surgical explanation, but to say the least I wasn't happy with the numbers. And I got multiple opinions.
I have him on colloidal silver, Nutramax Cosequin DS Plus with MSM Chewable Tablets which are most affordable at Sam's Club, and I also use PetHonesty Hemp Mobility Snacks Hip + Joint Support Soft Chews Dog Supplement which I get through CHEWY.
I find using these "made" products easier and quicker. I used to make my own remedy with fish oil, Turmeric, etc. And you could potentially build your own as well just have to do a lot of research.
I am also on the canned food is -bad- road, so I make my own "wet" foods. So I add a lot of joint healthy foods to that--which also helps keep his weight down I have noticed. And I only feed Purina brand dry food.
We also do some water exercise. And -no- slick floors in the part of the house where he spends the majority of his time.
We have been living this way for 4 years now. And I'm not gonna lie, he has some bad days where mommy has to lift him up on his couch. But he still has bladder/bathroom control. He still gets to run. I don't ever see anything that would lead me to believe he is in pain, just knows he has restrictions.
But being the chance of losing him, crippling him from the hips down, completely crippling him, causing him more pain and no benefit from the surgery/surgeries: I decided to go alternative medicine.

I will keep your little one in my healing thoughts.
-Meg
 

EllieMay

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I feel the need to share some advice based on what I have seen growing up and used as a adult. (See my first ever post about my father and his shaman/Dr Doolittle type behavior. LOL)
Have you looked into the uses of colloidal silver? I add a few drops of it into any water made available to
any/all of my pets. It's something I would suggest to all pet owners not just ones having health issues.

I have a dog who has joint issues, he is a badly bred border collie with horrible genetics. We won't get into the vets surgical explanation, but to say the least I wasn't happy with the numbers. And I got multiple opinions.
I have him on colloidal silver, Nutramax Cosequin DS Plus with MSM Chewable Tablets which are most affordable at Sam's Club, and I also use PetHonesty Hemp Mobility Snacks Hip + Joint Support Soft Chews Dog Supplement which I get through CHEWY.
I find using these "made" products easier and quicker. I used to make my own remedy with fish oil, Turmeric, etc. And you could potentially build your own as well just have to do a lot of research.
I am also on the canned food is -bad- road, so I make my own "wet" foods. So I add a lot of joint healthy foods to that--which also helps keep his weight down I have noticed. And I only feed Purina brand dry food.
We also do some water exercise. And -no- slick floors in the part of the house where he spends the majority of his time.
We have been living this way for 4 years now. And I'm not gonna lie, he has some bad days where mommy has to lift him up on his couch. But he still has bladder/bathroom control. He still gets to run. I don't ever see anything that would lead me to believe he is in pain, just knows he has restrictions.
But being the chance of losing him, crippling him from the hips down, completely crippling him, causing him more pain and no benefit from the surgery/surgeries: I decided to go alternative medicine.

I will keep your little one in my healing thoughts.
-Meg
Thank you Meg! I am actually on that track with you. I did order some hemp and turmeric chews. She is on the cosequin max and I switched her food to AvoDerm joint health... I took her off the vet meds a couple days ago because I had not seen any improvement and maybe even was a little worse since I had taken her in... I also bought a huge rug to put in the living room for her.... today she did bath exercises which she loves. And she got a good massage..l I could not feel her patella moving near as much... also, her limp was much improved today so something is happening!
 

Blackdog1714

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You are doing basically what us humans are required by our health insurance industry. PT first then maybe an MRI and surgery later
 
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