Found Tortoise Issues

[tercam]

Hello,

I found a tortoise the other day and posted about him in a few groups. I had a few people reach out but it turned out not to be their pet. Then I had a person reach out and as soon as I saw the photos of the missing guy, I didn't think they were a match. I kept pointing out differences in the photos but she kept saying she was positive it was hers. The one I found looks smaller also. I allowed them to come over to look because I believed once they looked at it, they would obviously see they were not a match. That did not happen. She keeps contacting me and I am not sure what to do. I believe she feels bad because this was the 2nd time their child let the tortoise get lost and it was over a year ago. We are in Western PA so I'm not sure if it could have survived the winter outside. It's a male Russian. I have tried calling vets and have left messages with animal control and animal rescue organizations. I don't have time now to actually find the right owners with this extra work.

I guess I'm just looking for suggestions on what to do and see if there is a good way to actually identify if this is the same tortoise. I took a picture of my Hermann tortoise now and compared it to when she was a baby. She has all of the same marks but they are just bigger or longer. I compared the tortoise I found to the pictures sent to me and there are no similar marks. The tortoise in the photos has a really long yellow line going around it while the one I found does not. Is this the correct way of even trying to identify it? If I post the pictures here, would you guys be able to offer some opinions? The woman keeps telling me the shells change a lot but from what I have read and seen with my own, this isn't true.

I feel bad for the family but by the way they are behaving, I'm really hesitant. She gets very defensive when I ask questions to help me figure out if they are the same.

Thank you for your help!

 

[Maggie3fan]

post those photos...

 

[tercam]

Here they are. The first two are of the one I found. The last two are of the missing tortoise. I'm just trying to do what is right. The big yellow band and different black markings just really doesn't seem like it is a match. Plus it seems bigger to me for some reason. I am not an expert though. Any help is greatly appreciated.

 

[tercam]

 

[RandyTortoise]

Here they are. The first two are of the one I found. The last two are of the missing tortoise. I'm just trying to do what is right. The big yellow band and different black markings just really doesn't seem like it is a match. Plus it seems bigger to me for some reason. I am not an expert though. Any help is greatly appreciated.

It is really hard to tell. I think they are different tortoises, I wonder if she has a photo of the tortoise underside so we could see if they are the same sex.

But for me, others can correct me if I am off, that tortoise has a very slim chance of finding the right burrow before winter to survive outside for a year. I find it hard to believe it lived outside for over a year. I know they brumate in the winter so it is entirely possible but coming from a captive stable environment I just wonder if it was able to acclimate immediately to have nature kick in early enough for it to dig a burrow to avoid the winter.

I don’t know, it is a tough call to be honest. Looks different to me. But if they have lost tortoises in the past they may be just trying to pick up another free one. Who knows. The photo she sent isn’t so clear

 

[Sarah2020]

Hello, I had a good look and initially felt it was different but now thinking a possible match.

My view.....
1. Use the center spine scutes to compare and from what I see both lost and found have a crab like body and claw designs scute 2 and 3 and tail scute is also crab like facing wrong way.
There is damage on the found tort which is not on the lost tort.
Please recheck physically against the lost picture.

2. Next to validate is the species are they the same.

3. Was it found in the locality of the claimant?

It is a difficult situation are there authorities you could engage for mediation. You could also check with a vet and see if it is chipped for identification?

 

[COmtnLady]

Here they are. The first two are of the one I found. The last two are of the missing tortoise. I'm just trying to do what is right. The big yellow band and different black markings just really doesn't seem like it is a match. Plus it seems bigger to me for some reason. I am not an expert though. Any help is greatly appreciated.

It looks to me like two different torts. Looking at the lower row of scutes on both right sides - I see the second to the front-most as being square-ish and blocky on the one you found, but tall and thin, sort of squished between two others, in the pics she sent. It doesn't seem they would change that much in the year she claims hers has been gone.

I think the one you found is NOT her tort.

 

[wellington]

Doesn't look to me as the same tortoise.

 

[Yvonne G]

It's not the same tortoise. Yes, it IS a Russian, but to me it"s quite obvious it's not HER Russian.

 

[Tom]

Here they are. The first two are of the one I found. The last two are of the missing tortoise. I'm just trying to do what is right. The big yellow band and different black markings just really doesn't seem like it is a match. Plus it seems bigger to me for some reason. I am not an expert though. Any help is greatly appreciated.

I've zoomed in and studied the pics looking for similarities and differences, and here are my thoughts:
1. The yellow band is from rapid indoor growth in a favorable environment. That fades with time, and fades even quicker when they are outside, so it is totally plausible that its the same tortoise after a year outside.
2. The part of the world where this species comes from is much harsher than PA and the tortoise could absolutely survive winter there with no problem at all.
3. I looked for similarities in the black marks on each scute and any sort of scute anomalies, and there are hints of similarity, and some indications that they are not so similar. The pattern does change over time, and going from indoors to spending a year outdoors would certainly bring about such changes, so it is hard to tell. I'm 50/50 on this one. It very well could be the same tortoise, but it might not be.
4. You need to get rid of it, that lady wants it and has the facilities to care for it, so why not let her have it, assuming a lesson has been learned about proper containment? If it was found within a few miles of where she lost hers, it might be hers anyway.
5. Did anyone reverse google search the photos she sent you to see if she pulled them off the internet, or if they were really her original photos?

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

Did anyone reverse google search the photos she sent you to see if she pulled them off the internet, or if they were really her original photos?

Good idea!

 

[tercam]

My hesitation is because one street over from where I found it is a completely different school district that wouldn't have had access to the Facebook post. I didn't have time to look into notifying people in this area. It was coming from that direction. There are also apartments. I don't need to get rid of it and don't want to give it to her just because she is being a bully. I don't feel like she really looked at him and even lied about taking him to a vet. She was really shady about the vet info and I called the potential vet and they said he hadn't practiced there in 10 years. They lost their tortoise twice outside. I've returned many missing pets to owners and something is saying this is odd. We are only about 3 miles apart but are separated by busy roads.
I might take time to notify people in this other area. If I don't get any hits, I can give it to her.

 

[tercam]

Thank you everyone for your help. I ended up surrendering him to Animal Control after discussing the situation with them. They were extremely helpful and kind. I sent the photos the woman provided and they agreed it was two different tortoises. I also sent the photos to a reptile rescue facility and they agreed. He is getting the medical treatment he needs and will have a happy, safe life. Plus now I don't have the stress of dealing with the person. I told them if they could't find the owner and needed anyone to take him, I would be happy to. They said it would be easy to find him a good home if needed since they work with so many people who love reptiles.