Concerns about hibernation

[Articuno]

Hi fellow tortoise keepers,

In spring we adopted a HERMANNI BOETTGERI, about 10 years old, who had been living in an artificial enclosure in summer, and indoors in winter her entire life already with her previous owner (born in captivity).

The integration with our other tortoises (all European species) went smoothly, and after a week she was accepted as a part of the group already (normalized interaction with the other tortoises). All our tortoises are allowed to roam the entire garden freely the whole year round (a habitat of about 100 meters squared), which consists of a terrace, various foliage from which many nutritious to tortoises, trees, bushes as well as 15 meters squared of grass. Under the trees, a significant layer of natural substances such as coconut pulp is present.

Since temperatures are dropping in Belgium, and the weather is deteriorating every day (heavy rain, strong wind, almost no sun), all tortoises are actively preparing for hibernation, except the newly adopted Hermanni Boettgeri. She does not seem to notice that the other tortoises are digging / have dug caverns to hibernate in, and most of the time she's now wandering around the garden alone...

As winters can be very long and cold in Belgium, she would definitely not survive three months of freezing temperatures and a thick layer of snow covering the entire garden without any preparation.

We already repeatedly moved her to a perfect spot to dig a cavern (under the trees, extensive pile of coconut pulp available) but she doesn't seem to be interested at all. We're hoping her instinct would take over when she sees the other tortoises prepare for hibernation, but apparently that does not have any effect.

Are we worrying for no reason? What do you guys think about the situation? What are our best options?

All tips or comments are more than welcome!

Thank you in advance,

Yannick

 

[Orpexo]

Do you know how the tortoise was kept by its preceding owner?
Maybe she never had to dig and is not used to that. Boettgeris are quite tough, maybe she'll still happy with the temps for one or two weeks.

 

[Articuno]

Thank you for the reply, Orpexo!

When I went to the previous owner to arrange adoption, I saw her in her pen in spring which was a few square meters in size and had a little house and some limited foliage in it. The soil looked quite hard, so I don't think she practiced digging a lot. I assume that either she hibernated in the little house, or she was taken inside during the winter months. I did not ask, since I never expected that it would be a problem.

From October on, the weather gets quite hostile to tortoises with daily rain, little or no sun, and temperatures below 50° F. Do you think she'll still start digging her own hideout for winter? And what if she doesn't? How can I encourage her? Would it be advisable to take her indoors in case of emergency (when temps go below 30° F and she's still not dug in for example), and let her hibernate in a box in the basement or something like that?

Thank you in advance for your help!

 

[egyptiandan]

From the way she is acting I would say she was never hibernated. I think if you want to hibernate her this year your going to have do it yourself. She needs to get used to hibernating and it would seem digging also. Hibernating her yourself will get her used to hibernating and another season outside next year will help her get used to digging.

Danny

 

[Terry Allan Hall]

Hi fellow tortoise keepers,

In spring we adopted a HERMANNI BOETTGERI, about 10 years old, who had been living in an artificial enclosure in summer, and indoors in winter her entire life already with her previous owner (born in captivity).

The integration with our other tortoises (all European species) went smoothly, and after a week she was accepted as a part of the group already (normalized interaction with the other tortoises). All our tortoises are allowed to roam the entire garden freely the whole year round (a habitat of about 100 meters squared), which consists of a terrace, various foliage from which many nutritious to tortoises, trees, bushes as well as 15 meters squared of grass. Under the trees, a significant layer of natural substances such as coconut pulp is present.

Since temperatures are dropping in Belgium, and the weather is deteriorating every day (heavy rain, strong wind, almost no sun), all tortoises are actively preparing for hibernation, except the newly adopted Hermanni Boettgeri. She does not seem to notice that the other tortoises are digging / have dug caverns to hibernate in, and most of the time she's now wandering around the garden alone...

As winters can be very long and cold in Belgium, she would definitely not survive three months of freezing temperatures and a thick layer of snow covering the entire garden without any preparation.

We already repeatedly moved her to a perfect spot to dig a cavern (under the trees, extensive pile of coconut pulp available) but she doesn't seem to be interested at all. We're hoping her instinct would take over when she sees the other tortoises prepare for hibernation, but apparently that does not have any effect.

Are we worrying for no reason? What do you guys think about the situation? What are our best options?

All tips or comments are more than welcome!

Thank you in advance,

Yannick

I'd bring her in for the winter, put her out again when your other torts are up and active, and see if she picks up on what the others are doing next year. Not reason to risk her.

My 1st Hermann's, previously my Grandfather's pet, lived in captivity for 46 years, the last 19 with me, and she never hibernated...hibernation's definitely not needful for a tortoise to remain in good health.

 

[Ozric]

Hi there Yannick! As the weather gets worse this tortoise is bound to slow down so a decision will be needed on your part quite soon. I'm not clear if you have indoor facilities for keeping this tortoise up all winter. If you usually hibernate your animals naturally outdoors then you might not have the things needed to create a mediterranean summer in your house for this Boetgeri.

One option would be to have the tortoise slow down with the weather and then move it to a fridge for hibernation. Views about fridge hibernation vary a great deal and some European keepers would never consider doing it. Where I live the weather is too unpredictable for a tortoise to be boxed and left outdoors. Most of us have houses that are too cosy and warm for a tortoise to hibernate in a box even in our coldest room. A basement may be suitable but if it was me I would want to know what the temperatures are like in the basement over the course of a winter before I tried this.

But yes I think you are right to be concerned because this tortoise is not used to hibernating itself and will need help to make it through the winter.

Hope this helps a bit.

 

[Isa]

O have 2 Hermanns and I do not let them hibernate. They live indoor. I agree with Terry Allan Hall, no need to risk her. If I were you, I would make her a super nice and comfortable enclosure indoors and do not let her hibernate.

 

[Articuno]

Thanks for the replies everyone!

Summarized, I understand that this year I should take her indoors and not let her hibernate at all. This will be new for me, since I never hibernated one of my tortoises before... hence all tips are welcome. I don't have much space though, so I wonder how large such an indoor enclosure should be?

Also, I would prefer not to make it a habit to keep her indoors every winter, rather she should hibernate outside since all facilities (soft soil, trees and shrubs as protection against rain, wind and snow, plenty of coconut pulp) are available, and so far all my other tortoises survived the winter without problems. So my question would be, how do I "teach" her to hibernate outside? All my other tortoises have always done that instinctively, so I have no idea about this.

Thanks in advance guys!

 

[Terry Allan Hall]

Thanks for the replies everyone!

Summarized, I understand that this year I should take her indoors and not let her hibernate at all. This will be new for me, since I never hibernated one of my tortoises before... hence all tips are welcome. I don't have much space though, so I wonder how large such an indoor enclosure should be?

Also, I would prefer not to make it a habit to keep her indoors every winter, rather she should hibernate outside since all facilities (soft soil, trees and shrubs as protection against rain, wind and snow, plenty of coconut pulp) are available, and so far all my other tortoises survived the winter without problems. So my question would be, how do I "teach" her to hibernate outside? All my other tortoises have always done that instinctively, so I have no idea about this.

Thanks in advance guys!

I'm guessing that she'll learn (through imitation) from your other torts over the course of spring/summer/fall...torts are pretty smart animals, actually!

 

[Ozric]

Hi Yannick. I understand your wish to hibernate this tortoise in the future. Your tortoises have access to fantastic outdoor living which I personally believe to be very beneficial compared to a life indoors. I have to keep my Hermanns indoors for part of the year because, although I do hibernate them, the conditions outdoors are only good enough for them for about six months of the year. So for me there is always a gap because the cold part of the year is too long to be covered by hibernation alone.

Your question about space is an excellent one and there are many opinions. I provide as much space as I can but I've found my tortoises appear to adjust to being in a small space compared to what they get outside. Many Hermanns are less active in winter anyway when they are kept awake and the tortoise apparently still knows its winter, perhaps due to low light levels. You do need to provide a lot of bright light and heat indoors to keep the animal active enough.

I believe that hibernation behaviours are triggered by several factors including reducing daylength (measured by the pineal gland), temperature and light levels. This tortoise is not used to hibernating but if these three things are all falling then activity will eventually go down as well. But maybe this tortoise wouldn't dig itself down no matter what so you would have to attend to that side of it.

I may be mistaken but I suspect that in the US it is very common for people to think hibernation a rather dangerous and totally unnecessary thing. Whilst in Europe there seems to be a much stronger belief that hibernation is beneficial and many take this further and say its essential as well as natural.

 

[Articuno]

Thank you for sharing your opinion, Ozric.

I understand that hibernation isn't strictly necessary to keep the tortoises in good health, but I would like to give them living conditions as natural as possible in captivity. And since wild European tortoises do hibernate, that is definitely my preference. I am afraid of messing up the tortoises biological clock by taking her indoors and having her live in room temperature the whole winter... wouldn't she think it's summer due to artificial lighting conditions and constant warm temperature?

Also, what would an indoor exhibit look like? A fence on a stone floor covered with a layer of soil and some plants, rocks and an IR lamp, or something similar? What surface would a 15 cm Hermanni need? And what is the most ideal location (living room, basement, ...)?

Thanks for all the ideas friends!

 

[Juniper]

Thank you for sharing your opinion, Ozric.

I understand that hibernation isn't strictly necessary to keep the tortoises in good health, but I would like to give them living conditions as natural as possible in captivity. And since wild European tortoises do hibernate, that is definitely my preference. I am afraid of messing up the tortoises biological clock by taking her indoors and having her live in room temperature the whole winter... wouldn't she think it's summer due to artificial lighting conditions and constant warm temperature?

Also, what would an indoor exhibit look like? A fence on a stone floor covered with a layer of soil and some plants, rocks and an IR lamp, or something similar? What surface would a 15 cm Hermanni need? And what is the most ideal location (living room, basement, ...)?

Thanks for all the ideas friends!

I definitely agree that tortoises should be left to hibernate naturally. My five hermanni are already digging their way underground. Just think of it this way: if we, during the winter months, were obliged to sit under a UVA lamp, there being no hot sun, obliged to listen to recordings of waves kissing the beach ,the real sea being highly rough and grey, obliged to eat salads artificially grown. No. It's all wrong. Every season has its purpose. Mother Nature knows what she's doing!