Another Egg thread...

[theguy67]

For some odd reason, incubating lizard eggs seems far more straight forward than tortoise eggs. I've searched (and found) for other, similar, threads, but I am still curious and hope you can add more to this puzzle.

6 eggs were laid by my female redfoot. One was found cracked after a few weeks, so I removed it.
I am not sure when the eggs were laid, but I dug them up on May 13th. Almost 2 months later, I would have expected to see some more drastic changes, although I am incubating at ~82F, so I assume things will (if they do at all) happen slower.


I only took 3 photos, as its difficult to get a good representation of all the eggs while candling. The above 2 look similar to the others, with the exception for the bottom right egg which is pictured below.


To me, this egg (bottom right in first image) appears to be a dud, as it is very dark inside, no red/orange coloring. I realize when the embryo grows the inside will darken, but I would still expect to see some color?

THE PLAN: I'm going to keep them in the incubator for now, and see what happens. What I am looking for is any advice, or explanation of what is going on and what to look for. So the purpose of this thread is merely to learn about the whole process based on what I am seeing. I can't seem to find anything super detailed besides the common advice to "leave them and wait". I'm not saying anything is wrong with this, infarct, its probably best for anxious newbies such as myself, but I would like to take this time to learn as much as I can.

Any thoughts? Part of me thinks they are all infertile, but it may be a poor tactic to compare them to other animals (lizards, birds) I've worked with.

 

[Anyfoot]

For some odd reason, incubating lizard eggs seems far more straight forward than tortoise eggs. I've searched (and found) for other, similar, threads, but I am still curious and hope you can add more to this puzzle.

6 eggs were laid by my female redfoot. One was found cracked after a few weeks, so I removed it.
I am not sure when the eggs were laid, but I dug them up on May 13th. Almost 2 months later, I would have expected to see some more drastic changes, although I am incubating at ~82F, so I assume things will (if they do at all) happen slower.

View attachment 182804 View attachment 182805 View attachment 182806 View attachment 182807
I only took 3 photos, as its difficult to get a good representation of all the eggs while candling. The above 2 look similar to the others, with the exception for the bottom right egg which is pictured below.

View attachment 182808
To me, this egg (bottom right in first image) appears to be a dud, as it is very dark inside, no red/orange coloring. I realize when the embryo grows the inside will darken, but I would still expect to see some color?

THE PLAN: I'm going to keep them in the incubator for now, and see what happens. What I am looking for is any advice, or explanation of what is going on and what to look for. So the purpose of this thread is merely to learn about the whole process based on what I am seeing. I can't seem to find anything super detailed besides the common advice to "leave them and wait". I'm not saying anything is wrong with this, infarct, its probably best for anxious newbies such as myself, but I would like to take this time to learn as much as I can.

Any thoughts? Part of me thinks they are all infertile, but it may be a poor tactic to compare them to other animals (lizards, birds) I've worked with.

I have very little experience in this so please don't do anything drastic on my input. I've just broke open 14 eggs, I braved it as they were nearing 200days. All 14 were infertile. What they all had in common was, what looked like dark clouds and an air pocket. It was an air pocket and the dark clouds were the yolk and albumen rotting. I think the albumen was decaying where it joins the yolk. Also I had some early doors that were very light in weight, when candled it just lit the entire egg up like a light bulb. When i opened them there was nothing in at all(no yolk). These adults are still very young(8yrs+ maybe). Hope that helps in some way.

 

[wellington]

This thread may be of some help.
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/fertile-and-infertile-eggs.144902/#post-1362067

 

[theguy67]

This thread may be of some help.
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/fertile-and-infertile-eggs.144902/#post-1362067

Thanks. I've seen that thread. It may seem obvious. To me it actually is until I look at mine then I'm left scratching my head. I guess I won't really know until I see a fertile egg for myself, or one hatches.

I will say that there are 2 females that are known to be laying and have only been doing so for 2 years, and their first year they ditches their clutches (only 1 egg per clutch). Last year 3 hatchlings were found in the pen. 2 in November, and 1 in December, so we know someone is capable of laying fertile clutches.

 

[Tom]

Like you, I spun my wheels and ran around like crazy trying to figure this all out. You've read all the info about chalking, veins, orange hues, etc...

After several years and several hundred eggs, I've finally just stopped worrying about it. Do everything right, put them in the incubator and don't worry about it. If they rot and get stinky, pull them. If not, let 'em cook.

I candled a bunch the other day and concluded they didn't look fertile. Babies started emerging from them a week later... Sometimes I can see signs, and other times I just can't. I just incubate them all and whatever happens happens.

 

[Tom]

I also noticed you are incubating on soil with perlite. When they pip they are going to eat some of their substrate. I would not want them on perlite when that happens. I bought a bunch of babies from a guy who incubated on perlite. About a third of them died or failed to thrive. Necropsy revealed broken down perlite lining their entire GI tract.

I incubate on vermiculite and I remove the babies to a brooder box as soon as they exit their egg. I still get tiny bits of vermiculite in their first few poops, but it passes right through with no problem.

 

[theguy67]

I also noticed you are incubating on soil with perlite. When they pip they are going to eat some of their substrate. I would not want them on perlite when that happens. I bought a bunch of babies from a guy who incubated on perlite. About a third of them died or failed to thrive. Necropsy revealed broken down perlite lining their entire GI tract.

I incubate on vermiculite and I remove the babies to a brooder box as soon as they exit their egg. I still get tiny bits of vermiculite in their first few poops, but it passes right through with no problem.

Thanks for the replies.

That's a good point. I've used vermiculite before, just had this mix at the time and tried it, but I'll swap it out to avoid impaction. I guess it'll have to be something I experience for myself before I can fully understand it.

Years ago I bred leopard geckos to the point that it became quite predictable. Every 2 weeks I would get eggs, and even from day one you could tell if it was fertile. After 1-2 weeks there was obvious growth inside. Bearded dragons were similar, just took more time, and chickens were even easier than the other two. I suppose what has me anxious is expecting tortoises to be the same, and then not seeing the same "stuff", so it feels like something is off or I am doing something wrong. I'll just wait, and try not to think about it for now.