Subspecies Sizes

The-Great-Stash

Active Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Jun 26, 2014
Messages
110
Just curious, I have a female ornate box, and I wanted to ask a couple questions pertaining to size, particularly in females since males I know are slightly smaller:

1. What is the smallest American box turtle? (I was told ornate by a random source)

2. And what is the smallest of the Eastern subspecies? I heard it was three toed boxies but I could be wrong. (I know that Gulf Coasts are the largest of Easterns and the largest in general)

Thank you.

This is my little girl Neko btw. She measures around 4" (shell length).
20170316_143008.jpg
 

Rachael403

Active Member
Joined
Mar 16, 2017
Messages
211
Location (City and/or State)
NE, USA
Ornates are the smallest of the box turtle species. Your ornate looks healthy.

I am not sure on the subspecies question, I have never owned anything but ornates.
 

cmacusa3

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Oct 23, 2014
Messages
3,191
Location (City and/or State)
Bixby
I'm not sure how big EBT get but just last night I was talking to few members and I have 3 female 3 toed that are huge, and weight in grams 724, 710 and 643.
 

lisa127

Well-Known Member
10 Year Member!
Joined
Feb 11, 2012
Messages
4,336
Location (City and/or State)
NE Ohio
I'm not sure how big EBT get but just last night I was talking to few members and I have 3 female 3 toed that are huge, and weight in grams 724, 710 and 643.
I have a female that is 710 grams. I figured it was because her parents were 3 toed mixed with gulf Coast. But judging by the size of yours, maybe it's not the gulf Coast genes!
 

cmacusa3

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Oct 23, 2014
Messages
3,191
Location (City and/or State)
Bixby
I have a female that is 710 grams. I figured it was because her parents were 3 toed mixed with gulf Coast. But judging by the size of yours, maybe it's not the gulf Coast genes!
I just added some GC and these 3 toed are just as big, and I also didn't realize that GC had more of a slider shaped shell. All of them dwarf my full grown Ornates. My largest Ornate is around 400 grams
 

lisa127

Well-Known Member
10 Year Member!
Joined
Feb 11, 2012
Messages
4,336
Location (City and/or State)
NE Ohio
I just added some GC and these 3 toed are just as big, and I also didn't realize that GC had more of a slider shaped shell.
Yeah, they do. I'm thinking maybe because they live in more swampy areas. My favorites are the large black ones from the Florida pan handle.
 

Eric Phillips

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Jul 19, 2014
Messages
1,094
Location (City and/or State)
Ohio
Just curious, I have a female ornate box, and I wanted to ask a couple questions pertaining to size, particularly in females since males I know are slightly smaller:

1. What is the smallest American box turtle? (I was told ornate by a random source)

2. And what is the smallest of the Eastern subspecies? I heard it was three toed boxies but I could be wrong. (I know that Gulf Coasts are the largest of Easterns and the largest in general)

Thank you.

This is my little girl Neko btw. She measures around 4" (shell length).
View attachment 206162

I've seen some EBTs comparable to gulf coasts exceeding the 7 inch size and over 700 grams. A animal rehab facility not far from where I live, has some monster Eastern Box Turtles! Nice looking Ornate by the way!
 

The-Great-Stash

Active Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Jun 26, 2014
Messages
110
I've seen some EBTs comparable to gulf coasts exceeding the 7 inch size and over 700 grams. A animal rehab facility not far from where I live, has some monster Eastern Box Turtles! Nice looking Ornate by the way!
Thanks.

And I was considering the nominate EBTs to own to breed (Im from Texas, and, by law, Easterns can be kept in unrestricted numbers. Just not the other box subspecies).
 

The-Great-Stash

Active Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Jun 26, 2014
Messages
110
the Wild EBT i met was larger than my 3-toeds but smaller then the Gulf coast. His shell was higher than the gulf coast.
That so? Interesting. Was he a pure species or a possible hybrid? Sometimes it can be hard to tell. Then again, genetic variation can be a good thing.
 

lisa127

Well-Known Member
10 Year Member!
Joined
Feb 11, 2012
Messages
4,336
Location (City and/or State)
NE Ohio
That so? Interesting. Was he a pure species or a possible hybrid? Sometimes it can be hard to tell. Then again, genetic variation can be a good thing.
An EBT usually is a bit bigger than a 3 toed and smaller and more domed than gulf Coast. Why would it be an integrade?

She's Iin PA anyway. Only eastern are native.
 

ColleenT

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 19, 2016
Messages
1,293
Location (City and/or State)
Lehigh Valley Pa
That so? Interesting. Was he a pure species or a possible hybrid? Sometimes it can be hard to tell. Then again, genetic variation can be a good thing.

He was pure. he was gorgeous. and his front parts had red markings. I loved him. He lives in the State park where i ride my horses, and he had been seen by other people who took pictures of him, also.

here he is but he would not come back out of his shell.

easternboxturtmale_zps7bdeitn2.jpg
 

The-Great-Stash

Active Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Jun 26, 2014
Messages
110
He was pure. he was gorgeous. and his front parts had red markings. I loved him. He lives in the State park where i ride my horses, and he had been seen by other people who took pictures of him, also.

here he is but he would not come back out of his shell.

easternboxturtmale_zps7bdeitn2.jpg
He's beautiful!
 

The-Great-Stash

Active Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Jun 26, 2014
Messages
110
I thought it was ornate too... thats why we were are here to learn. Sorry I misled you :)
No worries. Nice to know that my ornate species is the smallest known. The only regret I have is rehoming my female Eastern years ago. I miss having Easterns so much.
 
Top