Oh dear! (Raven)

[littleginsu]

I have seen the CD trick before, not sure if it works either! I know some people put fake owl statues in trees.. to scare something away... not sure if it is other birds or squirrels? Again, do not know if it actually works... so, in summation, I am of no help.

 

[erdavis]

Im not sure about the birds but I do know that a couple of people asked why we had shiny things in our trees, some people even told us that they thought it was some sort of witchery. So it may have scared someone off, even if it wasn't a bird!

 

[Tom]

RE: Oh dear!

I realize your the "expert" here.... But a wild raven will most certainly attack a person, and can give more than a pinch, have you ever been attacked by a bird? I have seen it with my own eyes. As well in the west wild life management destroys entire populations of ravens because they have learned to drop tortoises from heights to crack there shells and are a real threat to CDT's. Calling someone silly when expressing a legitimate concern is.not the way I would have went.

Well I don't know what does or doesn't make somebody an "expert" on raven behavior, but I have been handling, raising, rehabbing, and training ravens and crows of several species since 1994. Yes I have been attacked by them many times, in cages, or when directly handling them, but never outside by a wild one. The worst thing that has ever happened, I'm talking about a seriously mad bird on my hand going to town trying to kill me, is a pinch that only even bleeds a tiny bit if they get you just right and give it that special raven "twist". My safety equipment for these animals consists of a thin pair of gloves that I usually don't even bother with. Wild ravens are NOT a danger to people, and frankly it IS silly to go on a public forum and tell people that they could be hurt by one. You know a wood pecker could fly at your eye and poke it out too, but wouldn't you think me silly for telling people that was likely to happen? It is my job, every day to understand ravens and their behavior, along with just about every other animal. In fact I am currently bidding a raven flying job for a car commercial right here on this same computer as I switch back and forth from client emails to the tortoise forum on my browser. I'm using my work computer to type this out right now.

No doubt that some wild ravens are a serious threat to hatchlings desert tortoises, but I have been keeping 3-5" hatchling tortoises outside in serious raven country since the early 90's, and I've never, not once, had a problem. Mind you, I live in a very rural area and there are literally 1000s and 1000s of ravens around here. They are a daily part of life out here, and I enjoy observing them. Leave a bag of trash out with no lid on the can, and you will be picking it up from all over your yard and driveway.

I'm sorry if my level of tact, or way with words does not suit you. I am who I am. When someone says something that I know is ridiculous and far fetched, I am not shy about saying so. Likewise, I would not be offended if I said something outrageous and an "expert" in that field called me out on it and publicly corrected me. In fact, I'd try to make a learning opportunity out of it, so I didn't make the same mistake again. Erasing ignorance is a goal of mine. Both my ignorance, and anyone else's. I realize some people take offense at this sort of thing, but the world is full of all sorts of people and we all have to either tolerate each others idiosyncrasies, or go be a hermit and live alone somewhere.

How about you Tiffany? Are you upset at my choice of words?

 

[T33's Torts]

Re: RE: Oh dear!

How about you Tiffany? Are you upset at my choice of words?

I understand that you work with the species, and would definitely know about their behavior.
When i was about 8 (ish), I was in our yard playing with the baby pups from our dog's litter. A raven (I'm 100% positive it was a raven) swooped over, practically from no where, and grabbed a puppy. I don't remember exactly, but I think I tried to hit the bird and grab the dog. It flew across the yard (I was screaming and attempting to grab it) when it dropped the pup. Then, it came back and bit, pecked, or whatever birds do, the back of my neck. The laceration stretched from the base of my spine up about 6 inches. I got 11 stitches.

Now, this isnt supposed to be a sob story, I'm simply proving that it would be very easy for the OP, and the tortoise to get hurt.

 

[Maverick]

Re: RE: Oh dear!

I realize your the "expert" here.... But a wild raven will most certainly attack a person, and can give more than a pinch, have you ever been attacked by a bird? I have seen it with my own eyes. As well in the west wild life management destroys entire populations of ravens because they have learned to drop tortoises from heights to crack there shells and are a real threat to CDT's. Calling someone silly when expressing a legitimate concern is.not the way I would have went.

Well I don't know what does or doesn't make somebody an "expert" on raven behavior, but I have been handling, raising, rehabbing, and training ravens and crows of several species since 1994. Yes I have been attacked by them many times, in cages, or when directly handling them, but never outside by a wild one. The worst thing that has ever happened, I'm talking about a seriously mad bird on my hand going to town trying to kill me, is a pinch that only even bleeds a tiny bit if they get you just right and give it that special raven "twist". My safety equipment for these animals consists of a thin pair of gloves that I usually don't even bother with. Wild ravens are NOT a danger to people, and frankly it IS silly to go on a public forum and tell people that they could be hurt by one. You know a wood pecker could fly at your eye and poke it out too, but wouldn't you think me silly for telling people that was likely to happen? It is my job, every day to understand ravens and their behavior, along with just about every other animal. In fact I am currently bidding a raven flying job for a car commercial right here on this same computer as I switch back and forth from client emails to the tortoise forum on my browser. I'm using my work computer to type this out right now.

No doubt that some wild ravens are a serious threat to hatchlings desert tortoises, but I have been keeping 3-5" hatchling tortoises outside in serious raven country since the early 90's, and I've never, not once, had a problem. Mind you, I live in a very rural area and there are literally 1000s and 1000s of ravens around here. They are a daily part of life out here, and I enjoy observing them. Leave a bag of trash out with no lid on the can, and you will be picking it up from all over your yard and driveway.

I'm sorry if my level of tact, or way with words does not suit you. I am who I am. When someone says something that I know is ridiculous and far fetched, I am not shy about saying so. Likewise, I would not be offended if I said something outrageous and an "expert" in that field called me out on it and publicly corrected me. In fact, I'd try to make a learning opportunity out of it, so I didn't make the same mistake again. Erasing ignorance is a goal of mine. Both my ignorance, and anyone else's. I realize some people take offense at this sort of thing, but the world is full of all sorts of people and we all have to either tolerate each others idiosyncrasies, or go be a hermit and live alone somewhere.

How about you Tiffany? Are you upset at my choice of words?

Lol..... This is exactly the response l expected, again....no one was doubting your qualifications. No need to list them....again. Are your experiences the only ones that matter to you, probably. YOU think ravens are not a danger that's YOUR opinion. I'm not saying every "woodpecker" is out to kill someone. So let's not take it to extremes to try to invalidate my opinion. But if a bird is acting aggressive you would be a fool to tell someone to stay around It will never hurt you. A quick google search can show videos of ravens being aggressive toward people.
I really like the veiled "ignorance" comments, I don't feel "called out", or corrected. No need to call on the "good old boys" club that exists here to back you up. I think perhaps you might take your own advise " I realize some people take offense at this sort of thing, but the world is full of all sorts of people and we all have to either tolerate each others idiosyncrasies, or go be a hermit and live alone somewhere."
I won't respond anymore to this thread. It would serve no purpose.

 

[caits1300]

This is adorable!

 

[Yvonne G]

Please - let's don't allow this thread to get into a pissing match.

Tom: I started out with desert tortoises, and that's all I was interested in. So from way back in the '70's I heard horror stories of ravens killing desert tortoises, and not just baby tortoises. I don't know how close a wild raven will get to a human, but they are becoming more used to humans as they forage in the garbage left by humans. From the very beginning I was taught to cover my baby habitats so birds couldn't get to them.

In my opinion, it is better to be safe than sorry. ...and, yes...I have seen birds dive-bombing humans, but it was usually because a baby bird had fledged in the area, not because I was close to the bird's meal. But, just because I haven't seen it doesn't mean it can't happen.

So move on, now, and if you have something new to add to the thread, please do so.

 

[Dorrie Siu]

RE: Oh dear!

What concerns me more is your tortoise running around loose without the boundaries of an enclosure. Now THAT is a dangerous practice. Your new set up solves that problem, but that kiddie pool is much too small for a tortoise that size. If you go to Home Depot or Lowes, they will rip a 4x8' sheet of plywood into 4 12" x 8' long strips. Attach this along the bottom of your dog kennel and you can use the entire space. This will last a while, but your tortoise will soon outgrow this too.

Hi Tom,

I am with Dorrie the entire time when she and I go for walks. I like to let her get out onto the concrete so her claws can be worn down and not over grown. When we are out, I hover over her, to the point where she walks next to my foot that I place near her (I am not walking next to her, I step slowly LOL). I have been using my foot as a guide for her so that she does not go onto my neighbor's landscaping. While I do that, I am telling her "No Dorrie, turn right" or "turn left". She's starting to know where NOT to go. When the Raven swooped down at her, she and I had walked onto my lawn to head back into the house. The bird came from over my roof and swooped down, then glided up into the tree in front of my house.

I saw this video about ravens and the California Desert tortoise, which is much larger than Dorrie.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQPK8ZT3uWw

The kiddie pool is not a permanent enclosure for her, it's what I call her playground, a place where she can be when I go to meditate. I can spend quite a bit of time doing that, and I want her to be there with me for she represents how I should slow things down and be calm and at peace within.

I appreciate your tips about making the caged structure a larger area for her, that was indeed going to be my original plan once she gets bigger. Thank you for caring.