Manouria emys phayrei?

[Tiger Cowboy]

Hey all, I've been trying to decide on a next tortoise species and the Burmese Black just sound so very cool. Does anyone here keep them? Any tips, advice, any info at all. I know they get big and are really only recommended for the southern states, I live in Alabama and plan on staying here so that's not so much an issue. I currently have to small redfoots (more experienced with other reptile species).

Any and all perspectives and comments welcome.
Thanks!

 

[harris]

RE: Manouria emys pheyerei?

Excellent choice!! However I'm biased as the Manouria are my all time favorite species. Personally I have a collection of browns, but they are very similar to the blacks, but smaller. You'll hear from the Mep folks soon I'm sure. Good luck, and you won't be dissapointed!

 

[exoticsdr]

RE: Manouria emys pheyerei?

Tons of personality! You will fall in love with them.

 

[Baoh]

I have several. I was going to start a breeding project in that vein, but am reconsidering. Will still keep my largest female Mep as a pet, though, for sure. She is in my top five out of all of my current tortoises in terms of favorite individuals. She originally preferred broad-leafed weeds, fruits, flowers, and yard animals (even managed to get a messed up sparrow once) for food, but has come to focus more on the Zoysia I have been slowly replacing the lawn with than anything else. My Sulcatas seem to prefer the Zoysia to the other grass varieties I have available to them, too.

More "expressive" eyes than many tortoises. From what I can tell, their vision at a distance may be superior to that of my Sulcatas and most of the other tortoise species that I currently keep, too. Mine love mud wallows and sprinklers.

 

[Kristina]

I have Manouria emys emys, which are similar in all regards to the Mep with the exception of size. DEFINITELY the coolest tortoise I own! Mine are yearlings (I have 4) and the attention they pay to the humans in my family blows my mind. A little story - one day I was planting a hosta in their outdoor enclosure, and they were all grouped around me in a semi-circle watching what I was doing, as usual. My husband went to get something out of his truck in the driveway, and when he slammed the door, all 4 of the little buggers went literally RUNNING over to that side of the enclosure, straining to reach up and see over the barrier at what was going on in the driveway.

The way they tilt their little heads and look up with their keen eyes is too cool.

 

[harris]

Great shot! That photo says it all....

 

[Tiger Cowboy]

I was told that they need a larger area with lots of stuff in it to keep them occupied, and it helps to keep a group. Is this true? I'd love a group and setting up that area sounds like fun, but that a lot of tortoise eventually and thats a lot of work to try and make it jungly but still attractive (and still be able to see the things). Again any more suggestions, any information is welcome!

 

[Kristina]

If you think that size is going to be an issue, then I would go with the Mee versus the Mep. They are EXTREMELY active and curious, and also VERY social, more so than any tortoise I have seen. They literally "talk" to each other, and there is a lot of head bobbing and other social displays as well.

I personally feel it would be flat out cruel to keep them long term in a group of less than 3.

 

[Tiger Cowboy]

Oh I'm willing to put in the work, and more than willing to deal with size (after I move!). But I will do some more looking at the Mee's as well. This thread is making these things a must have in my book.

 

[Yvonne G]

My rain forest is appx. 50' x 40' (doing it from memory and not from actual looking at it). Over all, I have a 40' purple empress tree, a huge mullberry tree that covers more than half of it, 4 young appx. 15' rose of sharon trees, two 25' wax leaf privet (these are toxic, so I'm not recommending anyone with other types of tortoise plant them). That makes up the canopy. Then under that I have two fig trees only about 5' tall, a 4' pony tail palm, a purple sage bush, two heavenly bamboo (another toxic one, but it grows in their home world), a beautiful malva bush, a butterfly bush, a climbing rose bush and I used to have some banana trees, but the tortoises ate them roots and all. No ground cover will grow on the dirt because I keep it very moist and the tortoises are heavy with big feet. It is very shady in the rain forest. Occasionally I'll see a tortoise on the outer edge, sunning, but mainly they stay out of the sun. I have lost one in the past to heat stroke. They can't take the sun. They have two big waterers that they sit in sometimes all night.

They have a shed about 10'x8'x5.5' that is very well insulated, but divided to house Mee and Mep. The rain forest described up above is only for the Mep. Inside the shed I've built a little tort table on a shelf for very young Mep, but its only for the winter time. My tortoises all have access to outside 24/7/365, and they DO make use of it, even on the coldest days. The shed doorway is covered with vinyl strips.

The Mep forage for food 4 or 5 days a week, and I feed them different veggies, fruits and eggs on other days.

My Manouria don't seem to see as well as has been described in other posts. I have described them as seeing in frames, kind of like blink, blink, blink. And its very easy to get out of their sight just by jumping away from them. They look around with a dumb expression like, "Where did she go?" and I'm standing right behind them.

If you can keep them in a humid environment with plenty of shade and lots of plants, keep them warm during the winter, then either of the Manouria would make a great addition to your tortoise family. I love mine. They follow me around like puppies (because I'm food...not the food goddess, but they actually think I'm the food).

 

[GeoTerraTestudo]

A gregarious tortoise? That would be fascinating if it's true! But what if all that head-bobbing is their way of telling each other to stay out of each other's way? Are they social in the wild? I guess that would tell us whether they like living in groups or not.

 

[Kristina]

They have one of the most distinct social structures of any tortoise. They grunt, squeal, and wheeze at each other, and probably the most amazing feature to their behavior is the fact that they actually defend their nests.

Head bobbing is a greeting, preemptive to combat, and also preemptive to mating.

 

[GeoTerraTestudo]

They have one of the most distinct social structures of any tortoise. They grunt, squeal, and wheeze at each other, and probably the most amazing feature to their behavior is the fact that they actually defend their nests.

Head bobbing is a greeting, preemptive to combat, and also preemptive to mating.

Yeah, considering the fact that they guard their nest (a VERY rare trait among reptiles, shared only with crocodilians), then maybe they have big enough brains for complex social interactions, too. They are really cool torts!

 

[Tiger Cowboy]

I might be jumping the gun a little bit, but I have an excellent chance at a job in South Alabama (the county borders Florida, and this is the final round interview best I can tell). If I get it these go on the short list. I would assume the area would suitable for what they need most of the year, though I would still have to provide heating in the winter.

So Mee are very social it sounds like, are the meps as social or less so. The mee's sound cool but the mep's are more impressive in my eyes I guess.

 

[Kristina]

Everything I understand says they are identical in everything except size.

 

[GeoTerraTestudo]

What amazes me about Manouria, is that they are supposed to be the most basal (primitive) genus of tortoises. And yet they have all these complex behaviors for a tortoise. Maybe that means that, although their morphology hasn't changed much in the past 50 million years, their behavior has.

 

[Tiger Cowboy]

The trick with evolution is that just because a taxa shows more primitive features does not mean they stop evolving and changing, and in this case possibly becoming more complex socially than other species. It just means that the many characteristics were conserved. Thats why when you look at a (correctly drawn) evolutionary tree branches don't stop going until that group is definitely extinct.

 

[jaizei]

Now I want one too.

or maybe 8.

 

[81SHOVELHEAD]

Now i want to expand my collection & this sounds like the perfect tort to raise here in Galveston County .
Going to reptile show today & probably will come home with a couple of the MEE'S
Do i really need to buy 3 or 4 or will 2 be OK?
Kristina & Yvonne thanks for helping choose my next tortoise's to add to my redfoot collection .
Will post pictures if i find a couple of healthy looking Babies
Mike D.

 

[Yvonne G]

I keep mine in groups. I have 1.1.2 Mee with two 2.0 intergrades (so that's 3 males), and 1.2 Mep with two 2.0 intergrades. I have NEVER seen any aggression in the Mee pen, however the 65lbs female Mep is always head bobbing at the other tortoises in her group. She is definitely the top dog in her group. Occasionally there is pushing and shoving, and it really sounds like a terrible fight is going on in the shed. Usually its the 65lb'er who has the male pushed up against the wall and is trying to tip him over. All I have to do is move one of them out of the shed and it diffuses the situation. They seem to do well in groups, and I think two would probably work also.