Help with Sexing "Jimmy" anybody?

[johnhutch2000]

Hi Guys,

This forums been so helpful to me recently I thought I'd see if anyone here can sex my friends Tortoise. "he" is a hermanns and is about 7-9 years old and about the sized of a smaller dinner plate but larger than the little plates you get starters on.

I read a lot of threads and things about sexing but I still cannot work out what sex he is. Can anybody help from these picture of his plastron and rear end

Thanks Guys + gals.

 

[Meg90]

There is something drastically wrong with this tortoise. His legs and feet look very deformed, as well as the ENTIRE tail and cloaca.

My guess for the poor animal is female. But I am guessing you couldn't tell because of the deformity. It needs a Veterinarian ASAP.

The tail and cloaca looks SWOLLEN, and PURPLE, and I do not even know what those white dots are. She is in HORRIBLE shape. Her shell looks deformed as well.

Please post more pictures.

 

[egyptiandan]

It looks like a female to me too

Danny

 

[johnhutch2000]

Hi Guys, Thanks for the feedback, I had noticed Jimmy doesn't look the same as the pictures in books either. But to put Meg90 at a little rest the white dots are actually sand particles that are stuck to him and brush off the second you touch him or let him crawl on the carpet. I shall try and post more pictures, but I can't take any more than I have because he is not mine. I'll post them tommorow when I have more time. I shall tell my friend to get him to a vet asap, but just out of curiosity what could a vet do about deformation, Surely it is not reversible? (at least over night, maybe over time). To put your minds at rest a bit, he does seem happy, he eats his food and crawls around happily enough. He's just always looked a bit funny, I just thought that was the way he was.
Spk to you's tommorow- J

 

[Yvonne G]

I was thinking that at one time, quite a while ago, she was chewed by a dog. One of the anal scutes has been chewed away, but is totally healed now. Also, the left rear leg looks like maybe the knee was broken at one time, but is now healed. The legs look like they scrape the shell when she walks, causing all the skin to be scuffed up. The shell can be ground down a bit to relieve this situation.

Sorry about us all jumping on you like that. Here you come to get a little sex information and we all climb all over you! I know you or your friend aren't abusing this tortoise. I think whatever happened was done quite a while ago, maybe even when it was a hatchling.

Yvonne

 

[johnhutch2000]

Thanks Yvonne, its no problem, but I was a bit shocked. I knew he wasn't 100% the way he is meant to be but the reaction was quite alarming.

It is possible that when he was a hatchling (or somewhere under 2 years old) he could have been attacked. The person she got him off was a rescuer / breeder calld Tony from Market Rasen, (anyone heard or know of him?) so he could well have been rescued, I'm not 100% sure. Below are some more pictures of him. He also has always had a lop sided lip, it doesn't affect his ability to eat as his jaw does close on the other side, it just has this extra part on his right side that sticks out, a vet has seen his jaw before and not pointed it out as anything to worry about. Like I said he/she always seems happy and responds to you putting your hand in and eats like a little pig. He's what inspired me to get my own baby hermanns.

 

[Yvonne G]

I have a tortoise with that scissor-beak too. You have to keep filing down the lower beak so it doesn't grow too long. I only have to do it once a year, and it lasts that long. She's a mighty pretty tortoise, even with all her flaws. Oh...to be perfect!!!

Yvonne

 

[Crazy1]

johnhutch2000, I have to commend your friend for taking an imperfect tort, some people would not have. And you for not reacting negatively to being jumped upon and hopefully understanding it is just some of us are so very passionate that it takes over the gentle approach sometimes. He looks very sweet. I do however suggest he be placed on a different substrate. He looks like he is on calci sand and that and pure sand is really not good for them as it can cause impactions, and pet stores love to sell it to us. Plain clean dirt, cypress mulch, orchid bark or coco coir (Bed a beast) and play sand mixed 70%coir/30%sand) would all work well for him.

 

[johnhutch2000]

Hi Crazy1, thanks for the + points . I understand, I'm passionate about animals too, I just want to help them feel at home. I will get her to put "Jimmy" on a different substrate of Soil / sand, as I think you may be right about the current substrate (it is a sort of larger grain sand style sub.) You say this can cause "impactions" what exactly are these? and are they reversible.

Emysemys thanks for the info, if you file down the beak would it hurt Jim? I wouldn't like to leave him in pain even for a short while. I have a Dremel electric file that could file down his beak, but I wonder what the use would be as it doesn't affect his eating so is there any point? Unless it could be causing discomfort or pain. If not I'll just let him be a bit wonky, kind of adds to his charm.

In a similar query, someone mentioned his shell is catching on his legs and maybe I should file that down too, but surely they can feel their shells and this would hurt? Like I said I am reluctant to do anything that could potentially inflict pain for even a short time unless it would cause less potential suffering in the future.

Sorry that was a mouthful! Anyway anybody have any Ideas about this "scissor jaw"? Any help much appreciated.

 

[Yvonne G]

Filing the beak or the shell could cause pain if done incorrectly. But if done right, its no different than clipping your fingernails.

Yvonne

 

[egyptiandan]

I don't think Jimmy was ever attacked by anything. All Jimmy's missing bits and crossed beak are all genetic problems. These seem to crop up more in Hermanns tortoises as they have been bred in this country for a while and are starting to get a bit inbred.
The growth of the shell though has been due to not having the best diet. The leg and tail problems are most likely caused by the substrate. It's hard to walk on so Jimmy is dragging and/or walking on her knees. With a change in substrate, that should get better over time.
The beak should be trimmed by a vet that knows what they are doing. That way they can show you what to do and you can do it the next time it needs to be done.

Danny

 

[johnhutch2000]

Thankyou all so much! I wondered the mis-shapen-nes could be genetic and it seems that is a likely cause. I shall get her to change the substrate to a soil sand mix so it's easier to walk on. I've said she needs to take "Jimmy" to a vet to take a closer look at her Vent area, that way if its infected they can give Jim something to reduce it. I won't be able to go to the vet with her because I live in a city 80 miles away but when I get my little baby hermanns booked in for a checkup I'll ask them about details then, not that they will be able to show me how because my little Turbo is all good at the moment.
Again thanks to everyone here the help received has been invaluable. Cheers

 

[Crazy1]

Hi Crazy1, thanks for the + points . I understand, I'm passionate about animals too, I just want to help them feel at home. I will get her to put "Jimmy" on a different substrate of Soil / sand, as I think you may be right about the current substrate (it is a sort of larger grain sand style sub.) You say this can cause "impactions" what exactly are these? and are they reversible.

I think the sand and soil substrate will help with the crawling on the knees and she will stand up straight and that will help her legs. But it will take time.

An impactions is where a tort ingests something, like sand and it causes a blockage in their intestines, which can cause pain, decrease or lack of appetite and death. That is why it is so important to not have them on just sand and Calci Sand is the worst, IMHO, as it smells like calcium to the torts and if they need calcium they will eat it readily. I really wish the manufactures would place warning labels on these. You can place a cuttle bone (yep like for birds) in the enclosure and if they need additional calcium over what you supplement them with, or what they get in the food you feed them, they will eat it.