Health /illness section

[Neal]

I understand what you're saying. I just think there's a chance that someone inexperienced might fill out the form as they would at a veterinarians office and with that mindset consider whatever our response is to be an official diagnosis. I guess that problem exists anyway so if anything comes to fruition on this topic I'm sure you moderators will figure out the best way to go about it.

 

[exoticsdr]

Just my 2 cents on the subject.

First, there should be a "pop-up" disclaimer before entering the forum...."This section is not a replacement for proper Veterinary Care and Regular Veterinary Visits. The information in this section IS for information purposes only...blah, blah, blah and this forum is no way condoning .....blah blah blah....and then they have to to push the old "I have read and agree" button to enter. Something to that effect. Don't know how much trouble that would be or if that in itself would sink this ship, but..

I believe the "Illness" section is a great idea as long as nobody makes a specific diagnosis and recommends a specific treatment...these actions would fit the definition of "practicing without a liscense"....even for myself, if doing so for anyone other than someone living in the State of Texas.....each state is different in their definition.

That said, if it looks like a duck, saying so is not a violation (i.e. "that looks like septicemia"...get it to a vet., and describing the cause and pathology of disease would be acceptable as long as you do not recommend a specific treatment regimen)

Now, if you have seen a vet already, recommending further testing (i.e. tracheal wash, bloodwork, etc) would be fine but taking the results and making an online diagnosis would be a big red flag...though again, "it looks like kidney failure or liver failure, did your vet mention it?" would keep you safe and of course money changing hands is always a disqualifier.

As for recommending medication, that would definitely be a no-no. I see no problem telling what other vets prescribed in similarly diagnosed situations so the meds can be researched and presented to their veterinarian as a possible alternative...sadly we don't know everything and sometimes get "tunnel vision" and too used to using a specific treatment protocol...it's nice to shake things up from time to time and learn something new.

Again, just my 2 cents, there are probably some holes in it.

doc

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I think any info on illness and treatment would be helpful,not so people can treat there own animals so much as being better equiped too find a vet that is good for their animal,my experience with vets in my area is that they will claim too have more experience with reptiles than they actually do,your animal is actually providing their experience,it actually took me awhile too find a good one.having a place too help identify what symptoms may mean and the possible treatments would be great.add a disclaimer,saying the forum is not a vet ,people are already asking questions and getting answers no blame yet,but i agree it will probably happen.

Squamata is right, it is hard to find vets that have lots of reptile experience, that mostly because most veterinarians get about zero information while attending school. Those interested spend time in preceptor programs, internships (if available) etc OR we read everything we can get our hands on about the subject. That said, if you have a limited veterinary pool to choose from, is it better to let your animal suffer because you can't find someone you feel is qualified enough, or do you take your pet to a vet that is willing to see it and willing to learn about it, lot's of vets are unwilling to reptiles at all? I learn things from my clients on a daily basis. By culturing a good relationship with your vet and providing as much of if not more info than your receive you will eventually have a top notch reptile vet on your hands...after all, I had never done a tuburculosis test on an elephant until one showed up at my front door one morning, but I had read about it and it went fine.

 

[mango matto]

Seems like a good idea as long as it is very structured. Google " what's wrong with my dog?" for a few examples of a royal mess.

 

[John]

I feel if the info is presented properly it can help,if a person knows his animals symptoms look like rns, and the usual treatment is baytril but also understands the risks and side effects of the drug,if they are faced with a vet who is not well versed on torts two heads are better than one.again in my area there are several that will see reptiles but only one i will use,turns out he's from arizona and he's $40.00 more than the others,I think alot of newbies will pick the cheaper guy and not relize he's kinda guessing at least if the info was available people will be better equipped too know what their situation is with their choice of vet,just my opinion. don't get me wrong im a big beleiver in a little knowledge can be dangerous,but im talking about people who are somewhat intelligent and have common sense,let's face it there are animals out there that don't stand a chance no matter what,the majority of those tort owners won't be on this forum anyway.

 

[Maggie Cummings]

I don't mean to be difficult, but isn't the whole forum about illness and us telling some newbie to soak in Terramycin powder and baby food...or squeeze terramycin ointment into their eyes already? Isn't that most of what we do? We all have been spending time diagnosing and giving advice... I think that another special section or more stickies is just adding to the confusion. I personally think we are getting too big and spreading out too much. Somebody with a sick Sulcata goes to the Sulcata section or thread to ask their questions already, isn't that good enough? We can't/shouldn't try to be the be all end all.

 

[Neal]

It may be a significant part of what we do here, but certainly not everything. No book, forum, or caresheet should attempt to be the be all end all. But like you said, most of what we do is "diagnosing" and giving advice to the people who post questions. There are a lot of people that come on here and just look around and with so much traffic coming here, why not have a section dedicated to health and illness? I'm not seeing the confusion on the sight, I think we are pretty straight forward. We have specific forums for housing and feeding, I think health is just as important as those things.

 

[PeanutbuttER]

Maybe I'm crazy but I thought we'd have a subforum not for diagnosing, but rather where we have more-or-less articles about different diseases. Ie, there's a thread for shell rot already that talks about what it is, why it happens, what it looks like, and if applicable how to treat it/the common treatments you should see a vet about. It would be great in my mind if the first post was a more in depth write up and subsequent posts were about members experiences with that illness. That way the information is right there at first and then they can read the experiences of others.

With enough pictures then people can see for themselves if what they are seeing in their tort is something they should see a vet about or if it's nothing to worry about. A lot of people come on here thinking that their tort is "just a little sick" but it turns out that it's actually very very sick and needs to see a vet. This would let them come, learn a little about what is wrong with their tort, and come to that conclusion on their own.

So in my mind, we're not actively diagnosing, rather we're creating a subforum where we can deposit what we know about tortoise illness and our experiences with those illnesses for the education of others.

 

[Yvonne G]

See, this is what I thought would be good too. And maybe then after we get the articles all written and posted, the section would be closed. If anyone wanted to talk about it they could post on a different thread.

It would be like a research section. And then web searches would find it and it would help in their research.

 

[exoticsdr]

Maybe I'm crazy but I thought we'd have a subforum not for diagnosing, but rather where we have more-or-less articles about different diseases. Ie, there's a thread for shell rot already that talks about what it is, why it happens, what it looks like, and if applicable how to treat it/the common treatments you should see a vet about. It would be great in my mind if the first post was a more in depth write up and subsequent posts were about members experiences with that illness. That way the information is right there at first and then they can read the experiences of others.

With enough pictures then people can see for themselves if what they are seeing in their tort is something they should see a vet about or if it's nothing to worry about. A lot of people come on here thinking that their tort is "just a little sick" but it turns out that it's actually very very sick and needs to see a vet. This would let them come, learn a little about what is wrong with their tort, and come to that conclusion on their own.

So in my mind, we're not actively diagnosing, rather we're creating a subforum where we can deposit what we know about tortoise illness and our experiences with those illnesses for the education of others.

See, this is what I thought would be good too. And maybe then after we get the articles all written and posted, the section would be closed. If anyone wanted to talk about it they could post on a different thread.

It would be like a research section. And then web searches would find it and it would help in their research.

These are much better ideas, a library of information rather than an ongoing discussion of different cases, also takes away any legal responsibility. Submit your article to a moderator and they post it if it's approved.

 

[LeaCrystal]

I personally think this is a great idea even though i am the cause of this anyway

 

[Maggie Cummings]

LeaCrystal, don't be so egotistical. There's over 5000 members and lots with sick animals, and lots of dying or dead animals. This is something that has been thought about and talked about for a couple of years.

Neal, I like the way it's been described as written articles and then a closed thread, a research section and it makes sense to me put that way. I think I might even be willing to contribute to it I'm on board...

 

[John]

there are other places too find alot of info on the web i.e tortoise trust,but these sites don't talk back thats what makes this forum unique,most books or sites leave questions unanswered.there's an idea why don't the top experienced people on the forum get together and publish a book,thats what tortoise's need,the most up too date one i know of was published by r. fife 10 years ago.

 

[Jerseynox]

my 2 cents its a good idea, its already happening here just in different sections (chevy thread comes to mind) put it in 1 section it will be easier to find, you can view past illness post and sticky the info as it comes in, i think filling out a form will make it easier to understand & help. absolutely need a disclaimer, every reply should start with something like , we are not vets only skilled keepers ,and maybe add some sort of list of known/used reptile vets in different states/citys. its a good STARTING point for people with sick pets
some who may run to the vet for every little thing may not need to and those that dont think a vet is necessary may decide they are
this could be part of that too, what things you should always have on hand for a tort/turtle emergency ,syptic powder, neosporin (non pain relief formula) ex.

theres alot of skilled keepers here with more knowledge & experience than some vets out there

 

[John]

don't let this thread die its a great idea,any mods out there considering it?

 

[Yvonne G]

In the end, its up to Josh, the site owner. We're talking about it on the mod's thread.

 

[PeanutbuttER]

I hope you guys can all figure out a way to make it work. It has a lot of potential to become a fantastic resource.

 

[John]

when my tort was sick people here made suggestions and sent me links too trust sites i also did some surfing on my own.we went too a vet but at least i new what i was dealing with.too be honest i probably would have tried too treat him myself had it not been for the forum.i think if nothing else an easier way too find the info thats out there would be great.i'd be willing too help in anyway i can.i'm an excellent typist.lol

 

[robjan]

100% agree with you, Really nice idea and very nice thinking as well.
I am very impressive from this post.