Enclosure Progress & some questions 🐢

[sunny_27]

Been working on two enclosures for my soon-to-be son, a Russian Tort named Sunny 🌞

We still have to add a topper, substrate, and enrichment to the outdoor one. Plus add a frame for the cold box to sit on top of. We were thinking creeping thyme for some ground cover with stones in between (think shire vibes).

We will add a ramp to the indoor one as well as all the other enrichment goodies and substrate.

The rescue that I'm adopting Sunny from provided this link: https://reptifiles.com/russian-tortoise-care-sheet

I'm wondering about all the lights needed for the indoor enclosure and what you all recommended for us. Should we do exactly as the link above suggests? We live in Indianapolis, IN (in case that makes any difference climate-wise).

Also this is our first tort and just hope to give him a really good home after his last experience with humans.

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Hello and welcome!
You are doing great with these enclosures!

The care sheet lists some unnecessary equipment (like mister) and lightning setup can be simplified. But the basic elements are the same: basking lamp, UVB source, ambient light and ambient heat. If the room doesn't get below 60-65F at night you may skip ambient heat and if you want to hibernate (brumate) him in winter, then UVB maybe skipped too (he might get some natural sun from April till October).

In the indoors enclosure you can put something like a pond liner or quality shower curtain to protect wood in the bottom from rot.
If it's possible to extend an outdoors enclosure to have a partial shade from the fence and tree - that would be fine. And you don't need to add substrate there, natural ground is fine.

Escape-proofing the enclosures is important - Russian tortoises are great climbers and escape artists.

Here you can find detailed lightning breakdown and Russian tortoises care sheet (at the end):

Info For New People. Please Read This First.

Hello and welcome to tortoiseforum.org! We are all glad you are here! There is no other forum like this anywhere. We have tens of thousands of members from all over the world ranging from kids with their first tortoise to people who have been breeding and keeping high end tortoises since the...

tortoiseforum.org

Please, ask more questions and we'll try to sort everything out.

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

Russian tortoises are great climbers and escape artists.

And great diggers may I add. Some people dig the outdoor enclosure walls deep enough, some people make a net "floor" underground to prevent escaping.

 

[_The_Beast_]

This looks like it's coming along great! For the outdoor enclosure, how high are the barriers and will there be a lid? In addition to digging down (especially if they will be outside unsupervised) and creating an underground barrier, you may need to make the above-ground barrier taller. Russians like to climb and are very stubbornly determined when they decide they want to go somewhere (like under or over a barrier). If you're able to provide measurements folks will have a better idea of how high you may want to make it (though if it has a lid that securely closes then it likely won't be an issue).

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

This looks like it's coming along great! For the outdoor enclosure, how high are the barriers and will there be a lid? In addition to digging down (especially if they will be outside unsupervised) and creating an underground barrier, you may need to make the above-ground barrier taller. Russians like to climb and are very stubbornly determined when they decide they want to go somewhere (like under or over a barrier). If you're able to provide measurements folks will have a better idea of how high you may want to make it (though if it has a lid that securely closes then it likely won't be an issue).

Or a long enough lip on top of the barriers

 

[sunny_27]

And great diggers may I add. Some people dig the outdoor enclosure walls deep enough, some people make a net "floor" underground to prevent escaping.

Oh yes! Before we built anything I read a lot of the posts on here and consulted the rescue. We dug about 4 inches down and then added hardware mesh. We put the dig up ground back on top.

 

[sunny_27]

Hello and welcome!
You are doing great with these enclosures!

The care sheet lists some unnecessary equipment (like mister) and lightning setup can be simplified. But the basic elements are the same: basking lamp, UVB source, ambient light and ambient heat. If the room doesn't get below 60-65F at night you may skip ambient heat and if you want to hibernate (brumate) him in winter, then UVB maybe skipped too (he might get some natural sun from April till October).

In the indoors enclosure you can put something like a pond liner or quality shower curtain to protect wood in the bottom from rot.
If it's possible to extend an outdoors enclosure to have a partial shade from the fence and tree - that would be fine. And you don't need to add substrate there, natural ground is fine.

Escape-proofing the enclosures is important - Russian tortoises are great climbers and escape artists.

Here you can find detailed lightning breakdown and Russian tortoises care sheet (at the end):

Info For New People. Please Read This First.

Hello and welcome to tortoiseforum.org! We are all glad you are here! There is no other forum like this anywhere. We have tens of thousands of members from all over the world ranging from kids with their first tortoise to people who have been breeding and keeping high end tortoises since the...

tortoiseforum.org

Please, ask more questions and we'll try to sort everything out.

This is so helpful! Thank you, Alex

We don't plan to brumate him because the process seems a bit overwhelming after reading through the brumation threads. Thank you for your simplified explanation of the lighting. That is very helpful. On the list the rescue provided, they recommend two lighting dimmers. Do you mind explaining a little more about that? (Although that may already be answered in the link you shared, which I'll check out shortly!).

Such a great tip about the liner for the indoor enclosures! We will definitely be adding that because it would be awful to end up with rotted wood!

We did put two hidey holes which I covered in the same ground to make them like hobbit holes. (If you zoom in on the picture you might be able to see one but they camouflage with the rest of the ground). Would he need more than the hidey holes for shade? If so, we were thinking of adding some plants to help with that.

We will build a top with hinges for the outdoor and probably for the indoor one too since we have cats.

Thanks for the welcome and advice! So grateful for this forum 🌞🐢

 

[jaizei]

Looks great

2 things come to mind immediately. You should make the corners so they can't climb them. Either a piece of wood on top (cap) or a vertical piece of wood in the corner to eliminate the right angle. Consider the water that will be coming off the roof during rain and how it will impact the enclosure now instead of the first time it rains.

 

[Yvonne G]

Looks great

2 things come to mind immediately. You should make the corners so they can't climb them. Either a piece of wood on top (cap) or a vertical piece of wood in the corner to eliminate the right angle. Consider the water that will be coming off the roof during rain and how it will impact the enclosure now instead of the first time it rains.

That roof/water thing was an excellent catch. You might consider a gutter along the drip edge of the roof

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

We did put two hidey holes which I covered in the same ground to make them like hobbit holes. (If you zoom in on the picture you might be able to see one but they camouflage with the rest of the ground). Would he need more than the hidey holes for shade? If so, we were thinking of adding some plants to help with that.

I think Alex meant more like sight barriers, so the tortoise won't feel like it is seen by predators. The tortoise will feel more secure and stress free in a more natural enviroment, that has diffrent kinds of shade. They like to have a choice whether to bask fully or be partially covered by plants and such.

 

[sunny_27]

This looks like it's coming along great! For the outdoor enclosure, how high are the barriers and will there be a lid? In addition to digging down (especially if they will be outside unsupervised) and creating an underground barrier, you may need to make the above-ground barrier taller. Russians like to climb and are very stubbornly determined when they decide they want to go somewhere (like under or over a barrier). If you're able to provide measurements folks will have a better idea of how high you may want to make it (though if it has a lid that securely closes then it likely won't be an issue).

Hi!!

Thanks so much 🐢🌞

The barrier walls are about 10 inches from the ground that we replaced after digging and we will build a top with hinges. The top will have a wooden frame and chicken wire so he still gets sunshine. We did put hardware mesh on the bottom of the enclosure too.

The corners have metal brackets that we used to attach the sides. Would he be able to climb them?

 

[sunny_27]

This looks like it's coming along great! For the outdoor enclosure, how high are the barriers and will there be a lid? In addition to digging down (especially if they will be outside unsupervised) and creating an underground barrier, you may need to make the above-ground barrier taller. Russians like to climb and are very stubbornly determined when they decide they want to go somewhere (like under or over a barrier). If you're able to provide measurements folks will have a better idea of how high you may want to make it (though if it has a lid that securely closes then it likely won't be an issue).

Hi!!

Thanks so much 🐢🌞

The barrier walls are about 10 inches from the ground that we replaced after digging and we will build a top with hinges. The top will have a wooden frame and chicken wire so he still gets sunshine. We did put hardware mesh on the bottom of the enclosure too.View attachment 369790

Or a long enough lip on top of the barriers

Ohh that makes sense. Will the lip still be needed even with the top/lid we will construct?

The corners have metal brackets that we used to attach the sides. Would he be able to climb them?View attachment 369789

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

Hi!!

Thanks so much 🐢🌞

The barrier walls are about 10 inches from the ground that we replaced after digging and we will build a top with hinges. The top will have a wooden frame and chicken wire so he still gets sunshine. We did put hardware mesh on the bottom of the enclosure too.View attachment 369790

The corners have metal brackets that we used to attach the sides. Would he be able to climb them?View attachment 369789

If he has a lid, he wouldn't be able to escape no matter the brackets and he won't be needing the lip.

 

[sunny_27]

Looks great

2 things come to mind immediately. You should make the corners so they can't climb them. Either a piece of wood on top (cap) or a vertical piece of wood in the corner to eliminate the right angle. Consider the water that will be coming off the roof during rain and how it will impact the enclosure now instead of the first time it rains.

This is was the corners look like. We used these metal brackets to secure the corners of the lumber. Do you think he will still be able to climb them?

Also excellent catch with the rain! We will need to look into adding gutters or hiring someone. We do a lot of DIY but I'm not sure how easy or difficult that would be for us. Thanks for much for the recommendation!!

 

[sunny_27]

I think Alex meant more like sight barriers, so the tortoise won't feel like it is seen by predators. The tortoise will feel more secure and stress free in a more natural enviroment, that has diffrent kinds of shade. They like to have a choice whether to bask fully or be partially covered by plants and such.

Oh gotcha! That makes sense! As far as adding plants - we wanted to get something from the store but from what I have read, it seems that most suggest growing from seed since a lot of stores use chemicals and pesticides. What should we use in the meantime to provide shade while the seeds grow?

 

[jaizei]

This shows how they climb; if they can touch the two sides and push against both, they can probably climb it. like a kid climbing in a doorway or in a hall. This shows a block or paver overhanging to prevent escape but wood works also.

Cap those corners!!

Hello! I wanted to share some photos I took while out feeding and watering our pens yesterday. One of our Herman's Tortoises was caught climbing the corner wall of her pen. As you can see she wedged herself and began to "walk" up the wall! Fortunately I when I built the pen I covered the...

tortoiseforum.org

The 4th/5th pictures in this thread show the vertical method/eliminating the right angle.

Hello from sunny Arizona!!

Hello everybody!! My name is Doug, and I'm located just Southeast of the Phoenix Metro area. I have been cruising the site a lot lately as a guest, looking for sulcata information quickly at hand, and let me tell you, I believe TFO to be a great asset to any tortoise enthusiast. Granted, I...

tortoiseforum.org

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

This is so helpful! Thank you, Alex

We don't plan to brumate him because the process seems a bit overwhelming after reading through the brumation threads. Thank you for your simplified explanation of the lighting. That is very helpful. On the list the rescue provided, they recommend two lighting dimmers. Do you mind explaining a little more about that? (Although that may already be answered in the link you shared, which I'll check out shortly!).

Such a great tip about the liner for the indoor enclosures! We will definitely be adding that because it would be awful to end up with rotted wood!

We did put two hidey holes which I covered in the same ground to make them like hobbit holes. (If you zoom in on the picture you might be able to see one but they camouflage with the rest of the ground). Would he need more than the hidey holes for shade? If so, we were thinking of adding some plants to help with that.

We will build a top with hinges for the outdoor and probably for the indoor one too since we have cats.

Thanks for the welcome and advice! So grateful for this forum 🌞🐢

In the list they recommend two halogen bulb for basking zones and two dimmers. Dimmers are needed to regulate basking zone temperature by dimming the lamp. But adjusting lamp height is a better way to do that (use dimmers as a last resort).

You might want to check your "shopping basket" with us. Lights and heating can be a confusing topic and it's rather expensive.

And on the topic of shade and "hobbit holes" (brilliant!) - I just meant that enclosure needs bright sun area and some shaded area to hide from the sun and cool down. Burrows work for the same purpose if they are deep enough. Sight barriers such as plants, branches, ramps and hills are always welcomed

 

[sunny_27]

In the list they recommend two halogen bulb for basking zones and two dimmers. Dimmers are needed to regulate basking zone temperature by dimming the lamp. But adjusting lamp height is a better way to do that (use dimmers as a last resort).

You might want to check your "shopping basket" with us. Lights and heating can be a confusing topic and it's rather expensive.

And on the topic of shade and "hobbit holes" (brilliant!) - I just meant that enclosure needs bright sun area and some shaded area to hide from the sun and cool down. Burrows work for the same purpose if they are deep enough. Sight barriers such as plants, branches, ramps and hills are always welcomed

Hello again Alex!

Here is the shopping list we put together:
https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/3MRK6VZWVZN46?ref_=wl_share

What do you all think? Any other recommendations for indoor and outdoor?

TIA for all the support 🐢💚

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Hello again Alex!

Here is the shopping list we put together:
https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/3MRK6VZWVZN46?ref_=wl_share

What do you all think? Any other recommendations for indoor and outdoor?

TIA for all the support 🐢💚

Hello!
I've checked the list (nice idea to use Amazon wish lists for that!) and have some questions/suggestions. Unfortunately, I don't have enough time to write them all down, but I will do in the morning (yes, it's the late evening for me now )
But for the start:
1. Where do you plan to make a basking zone? And how do you plan to hang the lights?
2. What is the height between second and first levels?
3. Why did you choose succulent seeds for planting, is it because of soil and climate? Is anything from this seed mix: https://www.tortoisesupply.com/TestudoMix can be grown in your area? (I'm bad at gardening, yes )

 

[sunny_27]

Hello!
I've checked the list (nice idea to use Amazon wish lists for that!) and have some questions/suggestions. Unfortunately, I don't have enough time to write them all down, but I will do in the morning (yes, it's the late evening for me now )
But for the start:
1. Where do you plan to make a basking zone? And how do you plan to hang the lights?
2. What is the height between second and first levels?
3. Why did you choose succulent seeds for planting, is it because of soil and climate? Is anything from this seed mix: https://www.tortoisesupply.com/TestudoMix can be grown in your area? (I'm bad at gardening, yes )

Thanks for looking over my list! I appreciate your help

The "mezzanine" level will be the basking zone. We didn't think about how to hang the lights, so I'm glad you asked! For the tube light we will use command strips to attach it to the bookshelf above the enclosure. For the dual heat lamp, I've added an adjustable stand to the wish list.

Honestly I chose the succulents because they look nice lol but also because they were on the list of edibles plants from Tortoise Table, but I just ordered the seed mix you shared!