Not sure? (How old or what size are they mature?)

bonsai tortoise said:

Yes they have. In rare instances. With proper care, constant vigilance, and luck. But it’s something I would never recommend to a new tortoise owner especially with testudos. Even redfoot pairs that are generally peaceful are a bad idea. The male likely won’t directly hurt the female (usually) but will harass her to death. But to definitively say it’s impossible is not accurate. I have a Greek pair together now for the last 3 years. Zero issues. I kept a sulcata pair together and they always ignored each other. I gave them to a friend when they got to about 20” because of space issues and they’re now part of a larger group but in the years I had them they did great. Tortoises aren’t machines and if we study them close enough we find that all of them have different dispositions and personalities. Matching those dispositions to their general needs is key to proper keeping. The goal should be a group with proper sex ratios depending on species or separate enclosures. Even then it’s not an exact science. How many of us have had the “perfect” ratio only to find one female in that group was the harasser? That’s certainly not the norm but it happens. Point is, there are tons of ways of doing this and not all of them are wrong or just opinions. I think it’s great folks come here to seek advice. Seeking a variety of opinions and doing thorough research makes the world go round.

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Meesh said:

I do know the signs of aggression in torts, such as head bobbing, sitting on the food dish, ramming, posture..

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Yossarian said:

Your keeping two juvenile hermans tortoises in a hamster cage. . . smh, lets not act like youve got it all figured out. And frankly, to Bonsai, it took one post to prove my point thank you.

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Yossarian said:

Your keeping two juvenile hermans tortoises in a hamster cage. . . smh, lets not act like youve got it all figured out. And frankly, to Bonsai, it took one post to prove my point thank you.

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Tom said:

This is what we try so hard to get across and keepers both new and old fail to realize. What you are talking about are all overt obvious signs of aggression. There is a lot more subtlety going on that the vast majority of tortoise keepers miss. The long term chronic stress caused by these subtle signs take a toll. Some survive it, some eventually don't. Because some of them survive it, doesn't mean everything was fine and they got along well.

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Yossarian said:

Ive been pretty blunt in my responses in this thread and I stand by my position in them but I will apologise to @Meesh if I have offended, my initial post was not intended to belittle, or even to call you a novice, though there is no shame in that status, we all started at the beginning. I am however, also mindful that these threads get viewed by many more people than the person asking the question and it is the presentation of needless contradictory information to those people that is frustrating. Nevertheless, it was not my intention to make you feel bad so im sorry if I have.

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Tom said:

No they haven't. No one has gotten pairs to "coexist extremely well". Some people some of the time keep them in pairs, and they didn't get sick or die during that time. Doesn't mean it was a good situation.

Because you fail to recognize the signs, and because your pair survived, does not make this a good practice. One of them will be dominant and the other submissive. This is true of all life forms, and as Will once pointed out, this is even true of flatworms. Pair dynamics are full of problems. Because two tortoises living together are still alive does not mean these problems weren't there. I agree that all torts have differing personalities. Some are more tolerant that others, but this does not make it okay to keep them in pairs, or tell other people that you think its sometimes okay to keep them in pairs. It isn't.

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Meesh said:

Thank you, I apologise for snapping back at you. Im not here for arguing with anyone, i love my torts to the moon & am just here to learn. Thanks again to everyone.. P.s They are no longer together.

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