What could I be doing wrong?

[bholmes88]

I recently purchased a emys emys from a reptile expo, apparently it came from a guy who bought it from Vic Morgan. The first few days it ate like a champ, but after day three or so it almost stopped eating completely. The only thing I changed was I added a 10.0 uvb tube bulb. I subsequently took away the light after he stopped eating. His enclosure is a twenty long with the hot side around 80-85 degrees and 70-75 or so on the cool side. I have tried raising and lowering the temps and neither worked. The humidity stays about 80%, enough that the sides will stay fogged for the majority of the day. I have tried putting food right outside the hide, even inside the hide a few times. The only times I have seen it eat is when I put it in a small container with the food. Even then it may only take a bite every couple days, of that. I have been doing baby food and bird vitamin soaks for a month or so, I have seen him take really large gulps of it which is probably why he is still alive. Lately he has stopped moving around as much and usually stays in one spot with his eyes closed. Today I couldn't even get him to open his eyes. I have offered, endive, escarole, red leaf, green leaf, mushrooms, romaine, bok choy, mazuri and a few other things. Obviously it is something I am doing wrong but I can not figure it out!

 

[wellington]

Hoping you good luck. Unfortunately, I can't help you with that species. Emysemys, is one to pm if she doesn't see this soon.

 

[tortadise]

This is sad to here such news. Could possibly the substrate be getting cold at all from the misting or spraying? Do you have a heating pad you put on the bottom of the enclosure. I would suggest trying to get his eyes open and try some fruit for him to eat. At this point we need to get this guy eating something, Everything you have tried is a good variety. Possibly some night crawlers as well. I dont think its something your doing wrong, the success of these guys can have a percentage of failure, and kinda a high one at that too. Definitely the 10.0 is way too much. How much area of hide does he have? When wee like he is they reallly love to hide. Do you handle him alot at all?

 

[EricIvins]

Eye problems are a sign of dehydration. At this point the animal may be past the point of saving. A few points though -

1 - Soaking a Tortoise constantly is going to do nothing but stress the animal out. Same goes with upping and lowering temperatures. A new arrival should be left alone with a minimum of a week to settle in, with consistant ambient conditions.

2 - Manoria do not take to change like other Tortoises. They need time to adjust. This leads back to stressing the animal out by too much interaction

3 - Protein. These animals need it, especially as hatchlings. Earthworms, Pinkies, or anything animal

4 - How are you measuring your ambient conditions?


Either find Terramycin or at least water based lubricant to help with the eyes. At this point, an eye infection could be a very real possibility, so you may want to take it to a Vet either way......

 

[bholmes88]

This is sad to here such news. Could possibly the substrate be getting cold at all from the misting or spraying? Do you have a heating pad you put on the bottom of the enclosure. I would suggest trying to get his eyes open and try some fruit for him to eat. At this point we need to get this guy eating something, Everything you have tried is a good variety. Possibly some night crawlers as well. I dont think its something your doing wrong, the success of these guys can have a percentage of failure, and kinda a high one at that too. Definitely the 10.0 is way too much. How much area of hide does he have? When wee like he is they reallly love to hide. Do you handle him alot at all?

I only have the light on 8 hours a day for two days, after he stopped eating I turned it off completely. The only uvb he gets is when I bring him outside every few days. I have tried bananas, raspberries and strawberrys but he never seemed interested. I have offered night crawlers three times and he never showed any interest in them either. Recently I added large fake leaves suspended six inches above the substrate which seemed to help some because he took a few bites that day, that was a week ago though. I only handle him when I carry him back and forth for his daily soak.

---

Eye problems are a sign of dehydration. At this point the animal may be past the point of saving. A few points though -

1 - Soaking a Tortoise constantly is going to do nothing but stress the animal out. Same goes with upping and lowering temperatures. A new arrival should be left alone with a minimum of a week to settle in, with consistant ambient conditions.

2 - Manoria do not take to change like other Tortoises. They need time to adjust. This leads back to stressing the animal out by too much interaction

3 - Protein. These animals need it, especially as hatchlings. Earthworms, Pinkies, or anything animal

4 - How are you measuring your ambient conditions?

Either find Terramycin or at least water based lubricant to help with the eyes. At this point, an eye infection could be a very real possibility, so you may want to take it to a Vet either way......

I believe I saw a really good Austin, TX vet in the vet list on here. I will set an appoitment tomorrow.
What is a good constant ambient temperature? 80-85? I soak him once a day, is that too much? I have a 8:1 infared heat gun and a digital humidity gage that stays in the enclosure.
Where could I find terramycin?
What can I do to help until the vet sees him?

 

[algoroth1]

Hi. The first thing to do is Stay calm. This will resolve or not but don't start the blame game. I had some problems with my mee hatchling and am still not 100% out of the woods. Vic tells me that less than.001% survive in the wild. Of course their odds are better in captivity but there is still so much unknown.

Here are three ideas:
1. What temp is the water you are soaking him in? Cold water is bad but too hot is also is bad. Slightly warm to the touch seems to get the best response.
2. Try an Alocasia leaf. Wash it if you are getting it from an unknown source. New growth is best. This is 68% of the mee diet in the wild.
3. Let him sit warm and quiet (keep temps in 85 range to 90) in the dark hide. In the morning mist the cage leave him food on a small plate at the hide opening and walk away.
4. Is there good air circulation? If not run a fan in the room (not blowing directly on the open enclosure) to keep the air moving. Humidity am heat witty circulation will kill a hatchling.

I hope this helps. All the best,
Ron

---

That should have read "humidity and heat without circulation will kill a hatchling".

 

[bholmes88]

Hi. The first thing to do is Stay calm. This will resolve or not but don't start the blame game. I had some problems with my mee hatchling and am still not 100% out of the woods. Vic tells me that less than.001% survive in the wild. Of course their odds are better in captivity but there is still so much unknown.

Here are three ideas:
1. What temp is the water you are soaking him in? Cold water is bad but too hot is also is bad. Slightly warm to the touch seems to get the best response.
2. Try an Alocasia leaf. Wash it if you are getting it from an unknown source. New growth is best. This is 68% of the mee diet in the wild.
3. Let him sit warm and quiet (keep temps in 85 range to 90) in the dark hide. In the morning mist the cage leave him food on a small plate at the hide opening and walk away.
4. Is there good air circulation? If not run a fan in the room (not blowing directly on the open enclosure) to keep the air moving. Humidity am heat witty circulation will kill a hatchling.

I hope this helps. All the best,
Ron

---

That should have read "humidity and heat without circulation will kill a hatchling".

---

Latelly I have been soaking him once a day in warm water and every other day in diluted baby food or bird vitamin water.

Can I find aloecasia leafs at regular nurseries?

I read somewhere about them needing air circulation so in the mornings while I am getting ready for class I half take off the top and let the air fully circulate. There is a ceiling fan constantly going in my reptile room to help with that.

The morning after I created this thread I added a larger heat mat which bumped up the temperature. I also attached one of my mist king nozzles that are set to mist once in the morning and again in the evening.
What is great is yesterday morning he had his eyes open and is more energetic that I have seen him in two weeks! I have not seen any evidence of him eating yet but I am starting to be more hopeful. Should I continue the baby food soaks?
Also how should I offer earth worms?
Thank you everyone, it really helps talking things through.

 

[tortadise]

Alocasia might be down at your nursery places. its a strain of elephant ear, coloclasia as well, they are dark purple, more than likely out of season but its worth a try. I would still do the soaks yes. Just put a worm on a flat source for him to eat it. Or place it in front of him see if he does anything. You could also try some canned snails form petsmart just to see if he goes for it.

 

[bholmes88]

Alocasia might be down at your nursery places. its a strain of elephant ear, coloclasia as well, they are dark purple, more than likely out of season but its worth a try. I would still do the soaks yes. Just put a worm on a flat source for him to eat it. Or place it in front of him see if he does anything. You could also try some canned snails form petsmart just to see if he goes for it.

Are all alocasia plants edible? I googled it and there seems to be a lot of different ones.

 

[tortadise]

Thats correct. All of em are ok.

 

[algoroth1]

Sounds good! I have to tell you that I don't offer my mee any insects or worms.Not to say there's anything wrong with it.Just that Vic Morgan who is my mee guru doesn't and he has now produced second generation captive bred mees (I have one) and meps very successfully.
I've found that ours loves watercress along with mushrooms, Alocasia, grated green and yellow squash and cantaloupe.
I also soak Mazuri in warm water and he find that irresistible. I just came back from a few days away (don't worry, he had plenty of food and water) and put some wet Mazuri on his food dish for the morning and found him already out at 10PM chomping it down. I had misted the enclosure so that might have awakened him.
Anyway, I hope your little guy keeps on keeping on and you can share more good news.
Ron

 

[emysbreeder]

Hi, That emys might have been born at my place.(vic morgan) even if not please e mail me about this matter. Its not you or the diet. We will figger it out or get you a better one. I just dont like hearing about this. Vic [email protected].

 

[Yvonne G]

Just a note to keepers of other types of tortoise: Alocasia and Colocasia are plants that are native to the rain forests where the Manouria tortoises come from. I wouldn't offer this type of plant to desert or steppe dwelling tortoises.

 

[tortadise]

Just a note to keepers of other types of tortoise: Alocasia and Colocasia are plants that are native to the rain forests where the Manouria tortoises come from. I wouldn't offer this type of plant to desert or steppe dwelling tortoises.

Good point yvonne. This is a toxic species of plant to all others except Elongated, Manouria, Travancore, and Forstens. Dont want people feeding these to other species.

 

[algoroth1]

Agreed! Alocasia is for rainforest tortoises only. I think they may also be poisonous to cats!

 

[emysbreeder]

I recently purchased a emys emys from a reptile expo, apparently it came from a guy who bought it from Vic Morgan. The first few days it ate like a champ, but after day three or so it almost stopped eating completely. The only thing I changed was I added a 10.0 uvb tube bulb. I subsequently took away the light after he stopped eating. His enclosure is a twenty long with the hot side around 80-85 degrees and 70-75 or so on the cool side. I have tried raising and lowering the temps and neither worked. The humidity stays about 80%, enough that the sides will stay fogged for the majority of the day. I have tried putting food right outside the hide, even inside the hide a few times. The only times I have seen it eat is when I put it in a small container with the food. Even then it may only take a bite every couple days, of that. I have been doing baby food and bird vitamin soaks for a month or so, I have seen him take really large gulps of it which is probably why he is still alive. Lately he has stopped moving around as much and usually stays in one spot with his eyes closed. Today I couldn't even get him to open his eyes. I have offered, endive, escarole, red leaf, green leaf, mushrooms, romaine, bok choy, mazuri and a few other things. Obviously it is something I am doing wrong but I can not figure it out!

Please send me a message about your ee. Vic Morgan