phebe121
Well-Known Member
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- Sep 4, 2014
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I did my first coconut oil on the shell a few days ago how often do i apply and it on the skin doesnt hurt the uvb from gettin to there skin cuz id apply it to there dry little heads
Coconut Oil
- Thread starter glitch4200
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M
Maggie Cummings
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I found it for $11 at Safeway...
If your tortoise is weathered and really dry I would suggest 2 times a week after bathtime. It does serve a potent sunblock at abkut 90 percent efficency but with appropriate uvb lighting and only applying it once or twice a week makes me feel that your little guy will still be able to absorb the rays efficiently. Although if you have poor lighting I would not advice putting it on the skin since they are already not receiving the appropriate lighting and blocking uvb is probably not in the best interest of the tortoise at that point. currently I am alternating 2xs a week one week and then 1x a week another week. I want to see the difference week by week and see which seems better for him. He's in pretty good shape so, I am not as worried. I have noticed a huge difference in his shell. I don't see any dryness anymore like I did.. Exps When He Is Under That Uvb Light , I Used to see those dry lines appear after a day of baking under those lights, now I don't see them anymore.
Super cheap and last forever! And it smells so Damm good
I am interested in hearing from the veterans of this forum. How do you feel about what I say?
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Anecdotal evidence is not science. Gathering evidence and making observations are not the same. Without a control subject, drawing conclusions is difficult. With tortoises, it can take decades before any conclusion can be drawn. All you can say for now is that the shell looks pretty & doesn't get dirty. It is not possible to draw further conclusions at this time.
I find this entire set up troubling. I see a focus on counteracting the effects of MV lights, drying effects that are not established as causal. I see an insistence on indoor care. I see touted benefits that are generally not an issue in tortoise care. (Anti fungal , etc.) I know humans absorb uv rays through the skin, but I'd like to see the research on Chelonia.
Is coconut oil a good safe moisturizer? Maybe. How often is it necessary? How often is it desirable? One danger in overuse is that it masks the effect of ill health and bad environment. Another is that it may soften the keratin layer over time.
Would I try coconut oil to counteract a problem? Maybe. As a prophylactic measure? No. I wouldn't use any topical ointment on a regular basis more than once or twice a year on my animals, and more likely not at all.
I find this entire set up troubling. I see a focus on counteracting the effects of MV lights, drying effects that are not established as causal. I see an insistence on indoor care. I see touted benefits that are generally not an issue in tortoise care. (Anti fungal , etc.) I know humans absorb uv rays through the skin, but I'd like to see the research on Chelonia.
Is coconut oil a good safe moisturizer? Maybe. How often is it necessary? How often is it desirable? One danger in overuse is that it masks the effect of ill health and bad environment. Another is that it may soften the keratin layer over time.
Would I try coconut oil to counteract a problem? Maybe. As a prophylactic measure? No. I wouldn't use any topical ointment on a regular basis more than once or twice a year on my animals, and more likely not at all.
CindyWho4
New Member
My biggest concern using it on mine is that it's getting to the time of year where I can't get him outside. I worry about blocking any bit of UV rays he can get
I might use it on a Q-tip and only paint the new growth areas, not the whole shell. I sometimes notice the new growth to be pretty hard and dry, and I THINK it's supposed to be more pliable and softer. So that would be the only application I would use it for.
But I'm interested in watching your study. I love it when members share their ideas with us. And I try to have an open mind.
But I'm interested in watching your study. I love it when members share their ideas with us. And I try to have an open mind.
The drying effects of the MVB, was found after reading a study on here with actual data I believe from Tom outlining the effects the mercury vapor bulb pulling the moisture deep from within the skin and shell of the tortoise, since usually there is layers of water vapor between our atmosphere that absorbs the harmful rays and doesn't wick away the moisture but with the bulbs being so close there is nothing to prevent that moisture from being taken from our little guys. I can't seem to find the thread I know someone has to know what I am talking about I read it multiple times here . It was a study done about the mvb and it's effects on the moisture. There was a lot of data gathered, that showed this effect. Turning the mvb on and instantly seeing the humidity drop. If anyone knows the thread I am speaking of could link it ?
I understand the hesitation and concern. Knowing the proper husbandry is ultimately the first step in taking care of the tortoise. But proper husbandry aside , I also know that my conclusions are all hear say without much scientific approach to it. The Benefits for humans is undeniable in my opinion. With much research done to back it up.
Does everyone need to worry about fungus, not necessarily, but it's good to know that it can effectively combat. I trust natural products way more then I trust pharmaceuticals. Any day. If fungus was present I would DEFINITELY want try the ointment before giving him drugs that could harm him.
My insistence on indoor care is strictly for those people who can not attain a safe outdoor enclosure for whatever reason and cannot get them outside as much as they should. Otherwise it is well known on here from reading so much the best habitat is a natural outdoor one with as much space is possible.
My biggest concern is the ability to block some of uvb light and preventing from proper metabolization. but again my deal here is preventing the moisture loss from these baking bulbs. Which I was really convinced after reading about murcury vapor bulbs and there absorption of moisture. The fact that my ambient humidity is over 60 percent when my lights are off and the second my lights get turned on it drops significantly to the low 30s, at which point I must introduce proper humidity.. that tells me something.. and the dry lines on his shell, look like a lot the moisture is been zapped.. the shell got very very rough and hard on his tabletop. Even with my making sure the humidity was at an appropriate level. I have been seeing little ridges appear before I started the coconut oil they, which they seem to be flatting out now after multiple applications.
I appreciate the response. I am going to continue doing this for my little guy. And until I see something or find something through my research of extra virgin coconut oil that tells me that it is not good for them I will stop. But he seems to LOVE it , observation wise I am starting to see differences between non application and light controlled application. I will be happy to continue to debate I am very opinionated but I also take others opinions seriously as well. It helps me learn ,
This picture was taken 1 month after I got him. I got him Oct 16th 2013. I found this forum in February 2014, when my husbandry techniques completely changed. You can clearly see dryness all around , he was very dehydrated. His shell looked dehydrated and if it was dry on top it was most likely dry underneath at the cellular level. I also saw like flaking on the top of the scutes, peeling more or less. Which to me also indicated dehydration. Dehydration causes a host of problems according to this forum. It is like the root of most of the issues on here it seems.. the next picture is taken as of right now. Compare it . Huge diffeence. And I know his current state of his health. I know from x-ray (no stones/ healthy bone growth) and every possibly analysis was done at the vet very recently came out clear.
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I know the application of moisturizers etc. to the tortoises shelf is a debatable topic. Like any other topic of this nature the only thing that's going to stop or affect the debate is a true scientific study. this has to include a control group and a situation where the only difference is the application of the oil. And there must be clear objective data gathered.this in and of itself is difficult and may take years. So I appreciate what you're doing and I think you're on the right track and please keep sharing your information. A few years from now there may be a decisive view on this topic.
exactly why I placed my post in the debatable topic section. I will continue to share my thoughts and views and personal experience with nibbles as long as yoy nice people allow me to post on here haha. And your absolutely right about not being able to draw definite conclusion without a true scientific study that's how the scientific world works to sway undeniable opinion. But i know that since he get at least 2-3 bath a week about 25 minute at a time and drinks from his water, he should be well hydrated. And these EVCO applications serve as to boost certain things I outlined in previous posts. I know not all agree but it's fun knowing how you all feel about my provoking opinions and actions. I swear I come with peace and love and only the best intentions haha
I found it ! This is the thread I am referring too. http://www.tortoiseforum.org/index.php?threads/84606/
This thread explains the phenomenon of water being taken out of the skin and shell from beloeved tortoises from our indoor lamps. It correlates with pyramiding in the article in its explaination. This is one of the benefits I feel EVCO could apply to this particular problem..
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Alaskamike
Well-Known Member
Fortunately since I'm in South Florida my torts are outside everyday in natural sunlight so I do not need UVB lights. I do think this attempt to experiment with a new product has merit for indoor torts. Especially for those raised in open top tables under UVB and basking lamps.
Enclosed chambers with elevated humidity levels , soaking, water always available, have been shown over time to improve the desiccating effects of artificially light. This has been done by hobbyists experimenting with their own herds. Not a scientific based study - we won't get one of those. The $, times, & effort to set up a proper double blind study is not available. Our data is antidotal and we have to make broad assumptions of causal effects. But this is still good info and valid. Certainly convinced me to change my husbandry. And I'm a sceptic
Having said that, I see no real downside to measured shell application. The OP has shown a definite shell improvement in his own tort. I don't believe application to the skin is a good idea however.
The UVB lights D3 benefits are absorbed through the skin, not the shell. EVCO has a UVB blockage effect. I see no upside to putting it on their skin
Enclosed chambers with elevated humidity levels , soaking, water always available, have been shown over time to improve the desiccating effects of artificially light. This has been done by hobbyists experimenting with their own herds. Not a scientific based study - we won't get one of those. The $, times, & effort to set up a proper double blind study is not available. Our data is antidotal and we have to make broad assumptions of causal effects. But this is still good info and valid. Certainly convinced me to change my husbandry. And I'm a sceptic
Having said that, I see no real downside to measured shell application. The OP has shown a definite shell improvement in his own tort. I don't believe application to the skin is a good idea however.
The UVB lights D3 benefits are absorbed through the skin, not the shell. EVCO has a UVB blockage effect. I see no upside to putting it on their skin
