Hi everyone, I have a question and I am concerned for my tortoises health because the shell looks like it’s pyramiding, and it drags it’s back legs a little but still uses them to walk. It’s about a 2 year old sulcata tortoise that I took in from a friend that didn’t really want him anymore. I’ve been giving him calcium powder on top of lettuce, mazuri tortoise diet, diet pellets but he seems a little small for his age being about 5 inches long. Can someone please help me figure this out????
Tortoise dragging back legs and shell has pyramiding and looks slanted not round. Help??!?
- Thread starter TortosieK
- Start date
SweetGreekTorts
Well-Known Member
Can you post some photos? We can help more if we're able to take a look at the tortoise and its enclosure.
Are you feeding it
any greens besides lettuce? Lettuce has next to no nutritional value. Here's a link to the diet diet sheet for your reading pleasure:
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/sulcata-diet-sheet.64290/
How much calcium are you feeding it? What kind of enclosure do you have it in? What are the temperature and humidity levels? For your further reading enjoyment, here is the sulcata care sheet:
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-sulcata-or-leopard-version-2-0.79895/
any greens besides lettuce? Lettuce has next to no nutritional value. Here's a link to the diet diet sheet for your reading pleasure:
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/sulcata-diet-sheet.64290/
How much calcium are you feeding it? What kind of enclosure do you have it in? What are the temperature and humidity levels? For your further reading enjoyment, here is the sulcata care sheet:
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-sulcata-or-leopard-version-2-0.79895/
This is his/her indoor enclosure, I’ve been feeding it lettuce with calcium sprinkled, diet pellets, grass, weeds, dandelions. I’ve also put a cuttlebone inside for extra calcium if needed. It has an outdoor enclosure as well but is kept inside when cold and at night. I’ve been soaking it 3 times a week.
This is his/her indoor enclosure, I’ve been feeding it lettuce with calcium sprinkled, diet pellets, grass, weeds, dandelions. I’ve also put a cuttlebone inside for extra calcium if needed. It has an outdoor enclosure as well but is kept inside when cold and at night. I’ve been soaking it 3 times a week. The temperature inside it’s indoor enclosure is about 90°, but I have nothing inside for humidity.
It looks like it's had a really bad start. It appears to have MBD the reason for its very flat shell, too dry cause the pyramiding. Get him off the substrate and into coconut coir or orchid bark or a mix of the two. The bulb in the picture doesn't seem to have any uvb which is fine if he can get outside daily. Use the calcium every other day as too much is bad also.
@Yvonne G can help further with the mbd.
@Yvonne G can help further with the mbd.
New
Thank you very much. I will try the orchid bark, can it be any bark like ones found a Home Depot for such? And will the mbd ever get better if properly taken care of?
Torta-geddon
Active Member
Is there a second tortoise in your enclosure? I can't see it very well but it looks like there is a smaller tortoise in the bottom right of your first picture
Yes, I just got that one two days ago because I wanted this guy to have a friend because after my friend gave him to me and he didn’t look too good, I wanted to try to give him some company so it’d maybe be encouraged to walk around and eat more. When I had gotten the larger one at first, my friend hadn’t really taken care of it too good as you could tell, so I got it a little friend to keep company.
Uh oh. Tortoises don't make friends and putting 2 of them together can cause problems. I would separate them immediately. The first problem is that if the new tort is sick it can infect the other. The next problem is that tortoises are territorial and aggressive to each other. You've put a new tortoise into your other torts space. This is very stressful to them both. Bullying will occur and it often looks different than you might expect. Following each other, sleeping near each other, sitting on or near food are signs of one tortoise trying to push the other out of its territory but there is nowhere to go so the bullying continues. It's very stressful and sometimes leads to a sick or dead tortoise. Sorry to break the bad news to you...
1. Start by reading our Beginner Mistakes thread.
https://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/
And then the How to raise a healthy Sulcata thread.
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-sulcata-or-leopard-version-2-0.79895/
These are written by a species expert working hard to correct the outdated information widely available on the internet and from pet stores and sadly from some breeders and vets too. Compare what they say with your setup.
2. Keeping two tortoises together is a big mistake. Sulcatas, in particular, are very territorial. They are not social and in the wild roam for miles, meet up to mate and move on. Another Sulcata is simply a rival for food and territory. They must be separated completely and permanently now before bullying leads to a fight or the decline into sickness of one of them. In any case you should never introduce a new animal without going through at least 6 months quarantine to ensure that neither makes the other sick.
3. UVB is essential in the prevention of MBD. How often does your tort get outside? If it doesn't get outside often, you MUST get a UVB lamp and it must be on for 14 hours a day. Don't buy the screw thread compact bulb type as they cause eye problems on tortoises. Get a fluorescent tube type lamp.
4. It must be 95-100F directly under the basking lamp. Use a Temperature Gun type thermometer to measure it accurately.
5. It must be completely dark at night, but temperatures must not drop below 80F. You will need a Ceramic Heat Emitter and a thermostat to achieve this.
6. Calcium can be overdosed. A tiny pinch sprinkled on food sparsely three times a week is sufficient. Your tortoise cannot absorb the calcium without UVB light from a lamp or the sun which it uses to make its own Vitamin D; dietary Vitamin D doesn't help.
7. You need an earthy substrate which you mix with water until all of it is damp right to the bottom and into the corners. This combined with the heat raises humidity. Coco coir or fine grade orchid bark are great for this job. They're cheaper from a garden store or Amazon. Avoid any substrate with additives like calcium pieces (you don't want the tort eating the substrate), sand, fertilisers and perlite.
https://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/
And then the How to raise a healthy Sulcata thread.
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-sulcata-or-leopard-version-2-0.79895/
These are written by a species expert working hard to correct the outdated information widely available on the internet and from pet stores and sadly from some breeders and vets too. Compare what they say with your setup.
2. Keeping two tortoises together is a big mistake. Sulcatas, in particular, are very territorial. They are not social and in the wild roam for miles, meet up to mate and move on. Another Sulcata is simply a rival for food and territory. They must be separated completely and permanently now before bullying leads to a fight or the decline into sickness of one of them. In any case you should never introduce a new animal without going through at least 6 months quarantine to ensure that neither makes the other sick.
3. UVB is essential in the prevention of MBD. How often does your tort get outside? If it doesn't get outside often, you MUST get a UVB lamp and it must be on for 14 hours a day. Don't buy the screw thread compact bulb type as they cause eye problems on tortoises. Get a fluorescent tube type lamp.
4. It must be 95-100F directly under the basking lamp. Use a Temperature Gun type thermometer to measure it accurately.
5. It must be completely dark at night, but temperatures must not drop below 80F. You will need a Ceramic Heat Emitter and a thermostat to achieve this.
6. Calcium can be overdosed. A tiny pinch sprinkled on food sparsely three times a week is sufficient. Your tortoise cannot absorb the calcium without UVB light from a lamp or the sun which it uses to make its own Vitamin D; dietary Vitamin D doesn't help.
7. You need an earthy substrate which you mix with water until all of it is damp right to the bottom and into the corners. This combined with the heat raises humidity. Coco coir or fine grade orchid bark are great for this job. They're cheaper from a garden store or Amazon. Avoid any substrate with additives like calcium pieces (you don't want the tort eating the substrate), sand, fertilisers and perlite.
Ok thank you, I will take these precautions. Thank you for your help.
Thanks for the info. I have seen them sleeping together but mostly the larger ones will lay down and the little guy will come around and sleep right next to it. I’ve seen them both eat together and i haven’t really seen any problems so far, could this mean otherwise?
It only takes once for disaster to happen. Best to err on the side of caution.
No, they definitely need to be separated. Especially with one in this condition.
That tortoise has a pretty severe case of metabolic bone disease. He's probably in a lot of pain. His bones have collapsed and there's nothing holding his shell up. He's flat instead of domed.
This tortoise needs immediate calcium/UVB help. The light you show in your picture doesn't provide UVB. You need one like either one of these:
Mercury Vapor Bulb (100 watt is usually good enough)
or
Tube type fluorescent UVB bulb. You can find these at lightyourreptiles.com
Without UVB, either from the sun or from a GOOD light, the calcium he eats just goes right through and out without doing any good for the bones and shell. And that's obviously what's been happening to this poor tortoise for most of its life. This isn't something you can ignore. He's going to die unless you address the UVB/calcium problem right away.
Change the substrate
set him up by himself
get a good UVB light immediately
feed calcium-rich foods
when he starts showing signs of improvement (no leg dragging) set him up in a larger enclosure.
This tortoise needs immediate calcium/UVB help. The light you show in your picture doesn't provide UVB. You need one like either one of these:
Mercury Vapor Bulb (100 watt is usually good enough)
or
Tube type fluorescent UVB bulb. You can find these at lightyourreptiles.com
Without UVB, either from the sun or from a GOOD light, the calcium he eats just goes right through and out without doing any good for the bones and shell. And that's obviously what's been happening to this poor tortoise for most of its life. This isn't something you can ignore. He's going to die unless you address the UVB/calcium problem right away.
Change the substrate
set him up by himself
get a good UVB light immediately
feed calcium-rich foods
when he starts showing signs of improvement (no leg dragging) set him up in a larger enclosure.
Ok thank you, I will go and but these products as soon as possible because I want the best for these little guys. Thank you very much.
I'm not a lighting expert, maybe @Markw84 can answer your question. I found this on the 'net:
http://www.exo-terra.com/en/products/linear_fluorescent_bulbs.php
http://www.exo-terra.com/en/products/linear_fluorescent_bulbs.php
Ok thank you, I found this while reading because that’s the one I'm thinking about getting.
