Red foot isn’t acting right

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Thinking about it I don’t think the floodlight will be practical here, if it’s to go off at night that’ll possibly mess with our current night time temps, it’ll be so difficult at this point to fit another fitting with the viv in place, they’re both so heavy and difficult to move, so certainly wouldn’t be a job we could get done any time soon😣
I might consider it going in the 100(bulb b)thats in line with the 150, cause that does go off for long periods of time, so potentially the 150 with the other 100(bulb c) will be ok at night

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

If it's hard to implement - don't bother.
As of UVB lamp - remove the reflector. This will halve UVB output below the lamp. At cost of shooting UV everywhere, so you have to be careful when opening viv to not to stare at the lamp.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

If it's hard to implement - don't bother.
As of UVB lamp - remove the reflector. This will halve UVB output below the lamp. At cost of shooting UV everywhere, so you have to be careful when opening viv to not to stare at the lamp.

Yeah plus with the dimmer coming I’m curious if the lighting will be more to her liking.
Halving it sounds good whilst it’s still new, but shooting the uv everywhere sounds like it’d be uncomfortable for her? I’ll have to see if removing the reflector is an option too, it might be built into the fitting, I’m not sure

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

At distance of 18" UVB is strong, but it should not cause significant eye issues.
As of ambient LEDs - I remember that they don't output whopping lumens (comparing to Arcadia Jungle Dawn or midday sun), so should not be an issue.
The problem could be if at some position she looks directly at the lamp (that's why I suggested to turn the hide away).

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Yeah plus with the dimmer coming I’m curious if the lighting will be more to her liking.
Halving it sounds good whilst it’s still new, but shooting the uv everywhere sounds like it’d be uncomfortable for her? I’ll have to see if removing the reflector is an option too, it might be built into the fitting, I’m not sure

Arcadia fixtures have removable reflector.
For her removing the reflector won't cause any issues.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

At distance of 18" UVB is strong, but it should not cause significant eye issues.
As of ambient LEDs - I remember that they don't output whopping lumens (comparing to Arcadia Jungle Dawn or midday sun), so should not be an issue.
The problem could be if at some position she looks directly at the lamp (that's why I suggested to turn the hide away).

Yeah I thought that about the leds too, but if you look directly at them they are very bright, so I can see why they might be bothering her a bit, she’s not used to that kind of lighting, I looked at reviews and lots of people were saying the led did a great job because they were brighter than expected.
I moved the cave so she’s not staring at it where she sat

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Arcadia fixtures have removable reflector.
For her removing the reflector won't cause any issues.

Ah ok that’s good thx, maybe that’s something else I should try

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Yeah I thought that about the leds too, but if you look directly at them they are very bright, so I can see why they might be bothering her a bit, she’s not used to that kind of lighting, I looked at reviews and lots of people were saying the led did a great job because they were brighter than expected.
I moved the cave so she’s not staring at it where she sat

Don't stare at the LEDs They are point sources of very bright light which dissipates with distance. It's like staring at the sun (but a bit more safe).

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Don't stare at the LEDs They are point sources of very bright light which dissipates with distance. It's like staring at the sun (but a bit more safe).

I feel like where she’s been sat, she’s potentially been staring at them sometimes😕but yeah I don’t stare at them myself, I just think they’re potentially making the viv too bright for her, especially when the uv is on too, dimmer seemed worth a shot but I could be wrong, anything seemed worth a shot that I can hopefully hook up easier😣

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

I'm not good at physics, but LED strips give about 500 lux of visible light across the enclosure. Sun gives about 35-100K lux. Perceived brightness is maybe only 10 times brighter (but that's how our eyes and brain work). I doubt LEDs are issue there.

So with temperatures ramped up and, probably, some help from the vet Squirt will be fine.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

I'm not good at physics, but LED strips give about 500 lux of visible light across the enclosure. Sun gives about 35-100K lux. Perceived brightness is maybe only 10 times brighter (but that's how our eyes and brain work). I doubt LEDs are issue there.

So with temperatures ramped up and, probably, some help from the vet Squirt will be fine.

It’s probably not but I’m clutching at straws😕
I’m hoping we can avoid stressing her with a vet visit, it’s not a short journey and I’m worried about temps when travelling, I know there’s stuff we can do to help but it’ll still be a lot for her😣obviously we’ll have no choice if she keeps getting worse😞

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Okay, I understand and keep fingers crossed.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Okay, I understand and keep fingers crossed.

Fingers crossed, for what it’s worth I’m trying to remind myself she’s been in worse shape going back and got through it.
I just want her to thrive now though, not get by😞

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

I’m pleased to say squirt has seemed ever so slightly better today, not a major difference but I’ve caught her out more, she decided to finish off all the spider plants today🥲and pretty much cleared her feed plate, they’re happy continuing with daily feeds moving forward. Both her eyes are still runny but I haven’t personally seen bubbles today. I haven’t spotted her yawning, though I haven’t been able to sit watching her today so can’t say for sure that’s gone just yet.

I also decided to place the box hide where the cave was, but so the entrance is facing away from the UV, it’s actually created a big shaded area the one side, so I don’t think that dimmer will be needed now but nevermind😣it’s also created a really good visual barrier with the position it’s in so that’s an added bonus, it doesn’t look as good in the middle but definitely more practical for squirt which is what matters most, she’s decided to tuck herself in there for the night, so I don’t think the cave was necessarily her comfort after all lol, I think she just genuinely likes the temp in that spot which is fine, I do hope in time though she’ll come out into the open more, I definitely want her more active, she’s had diarrhoea during her soak again unfortunately, but I’m hopeful once she’s over what ever is going on, it’ll clear up.

All in all not a huge change, but baby steps in the right direction I think.. I feel a little less worried about her today because ultimately she’s not in the worst condition I’ve seen her, clearly still has a good appetite which I’m pleased about.
I go back home in a few days but I’ll continue to monitor her whilst I’m here, and I’ve told her owner to do the same, temps are nice and up so hopefully over this next week she’ll improve🤞🏻

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Happy to know she's getting well! Keep us updated!

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Happy to know she's getting well! Keep us updated!

Will do🙂

 

[JTH]

My experience with RFTs suggests that "orchid bark" is often too dusty and doesn't hold moisture very well, leading to an overly dry environment. I switched to a fairly fine coconut husk soil, which holds humidity well and seems to prevent mold and is not dusty if properly sprayed or soaked daily. No further problems with respiratory issues, and no problems with shell infections. Room temperature is kept at 77°F and hot spot is a 60 watt spot at surface temp of 85°F. Good appetites, mostly greens, dandelions, violets (leaves and flowers) and once per week mix of pureed winter squash and Mazuri small tortoise chow.

 

[ND135]

Hi guys, I’m gutted to have to be writing this thread, things had been going so well with our red foots upgrade, but there’s a number of things now concerning me with her that I desperately need advice on before we take her to a vet😞

First off I’ll describe in detail exactly how she was kept vs how we are keeping her now, and I’ll include some pics of the current set up.
Her previous viv size was too small for the age and size she is, her owner can’t remember her exact age, he estimated about 16 before, but then that went to 10, but now they think she’s around 12/13, she was being kept in a 4x2, and as per the outdated advice from the pet shop she was from, she had a ‘warmer end’ and a ‘cooler end’ she had a 60watt floodlight and a 100w CHE, the che was on at all times and the floodlight on a timer, though tbh the floodlight was mostly redundant with the CHE, she was about 85 on the warmer end, 80 in the middle and 77/75 on the cooler end, where she had a large cave hide, she would wonder between both ends but 9/10 would sleep under the bulb, I can’t remember the exact UV she had, though I believe is was some sort of exo terra T8 bulb that had definitely ran its course in the last few months she was in there.

Shes being kept on orchid bark in both set ups.

Now her current new viv size is 7x4(I know that’s still too small for an adult red foot, it’s been a long journey and the original plan was a bigger viv upstairs, but with how the stairs are it’s impossible to get anything that big up there, when she was brought all those years ago, it wasn’t considered how much space she was going to need) I know it’s not ideal, but after trying to find a better new home, it was slim pickings and time was running out as her old viv was beginning to fail and rot at the bottom, we’ve had no choice but to provide the best we possibly can for her size wise right now with the 7x4.
So heating wise in this set up, we opted to ditch the floodlight and are using a led strip on a 12hr timer, her UV is aricadia 12% 39w, exactly 18 inches from substrate, I’d ideally like it raised an inch or two, but with everything where it is in the viv it’d be pretty much impossible to do that. Her owner initially wanted to mimic a slight night drop within the viv, so the way it’s set is, there is a 100w nearer on end on its own pluse thermostat, the probe being in the far corner at the back to make sure the whole viv is getting heated, then nearer the other end there’s a 150w on its own pluse thermostat, the probe is nearer the bulb on that one cause we’ve previously experienced the 150’s throwing out a bit too much heat for our liking, and in line with that 150 bulb there is a 100w on its own on/off thermostat, the reason for all the separate thermostats was because the original plan was to have the 150 shut off at night and the 100 in line with it take over, set at an ever so slightly lower temp, but having the 150 off simply caused the 100s to work harder throwing out hot spots and the side all along the glass dropped into the 70’s, with all 3 the heat seemed much better distributed, I wanted to respect her owners wishes for the drop but once I explained about the heat and red foots are ok without a drop he seemed ok having all 3 run 24/7. With those running the temps have been as follows, directly under both bulbs A&B reads about 86, though a lot of the time bulb B isn’t needing to be on, directly under bulb C has been fluctuating between 88-90. In the corner by the box hide nearer the glass side there is a 75-77 zone, not very big, but it’s there should she ever be feeling too warm. The rest of the viv is between 80-86, inside and under the stool hide is 80 and in the cave it fluctuates between 80-82.

All was going well for about the first week of her being in there, she was exploring and using the whole viv, though she was always retreating to the old cave I’ve put in there, but I didn’t think anything of it at the time as I figured it’s probably her comfort blanket and she’s adjusting to a bigger space, she was never chilling out in the open and hasn’t since being put in there, which is unusual for squirt, she was always out in the old one, but again I didn’t think too much of it at first.
Over the following weeks her owner informed me she was becoming far less active, pretty much staying in the cave the whole time, only coming out to eat. Again I put it down to her adjusting. I’ve been here visiting this past week, so took the opportunity to monitor her closely, where I have now flagged up some worrying symptoms, about 5 days ago I noticed one of her eyes was forming tears, squirt has always had slightly wet looking eyes, typical of a tropical tort, however her eye was definitely far wetter than usual, I then noticed she appears to be yawning quite a lot, I’d say about 3/5 times an hour throughout the day, though it’s difficult to say she’s continually doing that every hour as it’s impossible for me to watch her 24/7, but there’s been multiple times now where I’ve sat and watched her do 3 yawns in close succession during the day time, something I’ve not seen her do before, I’d never thought to look at if the inside of her mouth is too pale until a friend of the family who is training to be a vet asked, and to me, the inside of her mouth and tongue does appear quite pale😞the weeping from that one eye has continued and the last two days I’ve noticed it bubble at times😣again just the one eye not both, in case there is something irritating it, we have flushed it with saline yesterday, but it doesn’t seemed to have helped yet. She does appear to breath quick at times, but tbh for the most part her breathing doesn’t seem out of the ordinary, least from what I can see.

Appetite wise I’m pleased to say she’s still eating pretty much everything offered which is encouraging, I’ll include a list of the foods she gets with the rough timings in which she gets them, and two examples of what a typical weeks feed looks like.
Squirt had struggled with diarrhoea for quite some time going back, she definitely hadn’t been digesting properly, we put it down to lack of movement in the small viv, we did however start adding a dried grass mix every now n then to up her fiber, which seemed to work great for a while, they were much more formed, however over this past week her bowel movements seems to be regressing back, some is formed, however it’s been followed by diarrhoea and chunks of food, showing me she’s not digesting properly again, now I know that can be down to other things not just lack of movement, like low temps, too high water content, parasites etc.. temps can’t be the issue here as both methods of measuring are showing me similar results(combometers and temp gun)and all her levels look to be fine in that regard, I’m reducing fruit intake to about 20% over the coming days, hoping that the more greens will bind things back up. But due to her not moving a lot at all I wouldn’t be surprised if that’s causing her digestive issues right now.

Now originally when seeing her eye running I thought maybe the temps were slightly too high for her liking and she was trying to cool down, so as an experiment I lowered the viv by a few degrees, while I did seem to catch her coming out a little more, the difference was marginal and didn’t last long, so I have gone ahead and upped the temps back in the event she is indeed poorly, I’m hoping the warmer temps will help. Humidity wise, is holding into the 90’s, which I don’t know if maybe that’s been a bit too much for her, we struggled with her humidity in the old one so perhaps she not taking the increase well, the old one maintained about 75-80, where as this one has stayed in the 90’s for days.

I’m sorry this has been such a long one but I’ve wanted to be as detailed as possible here. If you click on my content and go onto ‘squirts upgrade’ thread, I’d say the last 2-3 pages are where I’ve noted my concerns this past week, which might give a little more context time wise for anyone willing to advise, everything in that thread mentions all the materials used too, I was so careful researching in that regard so I’d be surprised if there’s anything not appropriate.

Ultimately I’m at an absolute loss for what could have caused her potential sickness aside from perhaps the stress of a big move, but even if that’s the case, everything appears correct in her set up so idk why her symptoms seems to be getting worse, she’s definitely getting less active and that bubbling is so concerning coupled with the yawns😞idk what else to do to help her aside from everything I’m already doing😣I don’t want her to get to the stage of going off her food before having to resort to a exotic vet, which in itself makes me so nervous knowing how outdated some of their treatments can be😞

Any help here would be SO appreciated! Any questions or anything I may have missed with my info please ask away.. I’m so worried about her and feeling incredibly guilty that’s it’s something I’ve possibly done, I pushed so hard for this upgrade but now I’m scared I’ve made her sick somehow😔it’s heartbreaking that all the knowledge I’ve gained isn’t giving the desired results when applied, I’m feeling very frustrated and defeated after such a long journey of getting her right, I was convinced every was spot on, but evidently her behaviour is telling me otherwise😭I’ve also added a few pics of her watery eye😔

My Redfoot is not an adult, so some of this post may not apply or help your situation. My Redfoot (Lightning) is between 2-3 years old.

1. I would definitely recommend a veterinarian visit. When receiving any new pet, it is always good to get them looked over and assessed. It did me a world of good...got me to this forum! So, it really does not hurt - the vet will also test for any parasites, so have a fecal sample ready. I hope the watery eye is not a respiratory infection, but best to know now than later. The vet will be able to recommend the best course of treatment.

2. My vet had recommended UV 5.0 HO TV UVB lamp 15-18" above the shell level. I use ceramic heat emitters for the rest of the enclosure to keep temps level. I just got a thermostat for these items, so this will help control and balance heat levels. I live in the USA (East Coast) so we are approaching summer and I usually don't need the heat emitters if I keep the AC in his room off. When we have to run it, I have the heat emitters on.
3. I was instructed to still feed daily. Redfoots are opportunistic eaters and munch along the way. So even if mine does not eat all at once, I keep the food there and a walking distance from the hide so he has to go out and get it. I let him out in the home for about an hour or so and put a few leaves/veggies around his roam area just to keep him interested.

4. How is the water supply? Is there a soaking dish or two ? How are you maintaining humidity?

The set up pics are really nice - maybe add a natural plant or two like a spider plant or Boston fern? These help maintain humidity and provide attractive hiding places for them.
Keep us posted. Your tort is precious and you are making a lot of good changes/decisions for her.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

My experience with RFTs suggests that "orchid bark" is often too dusty and doesn't hold moisture very well, leading to an overly dry environment. I switched to a fairly fine coconut husk soil, which holds humidity well and seems to prevent mold and is not dusty if properly sprayed or soaked daily. No further problems with respiratory issues, and no problems with shell infections. Room temperature is kept at 77°F and hot spot is a 60 watt spot at surface temp of 85°F. Good appetites, mostly greens, dandelions, violets (leaves and flowers) and once per week mix of pureed winter squash and Mazuri small tortoise chow.

Thanks for the input! Much appreciated! We’ve personally found the orchid bark holds the moisture and humidity really well, but there has been times the top layer that stays mostly dry, has been a little bit dusty at times, so I wonder if maybe when it comes to the next deep clean it’s worth looking into something different for her, the only thing that puts us off the coconut husk is I’ve heard it can get in their eyes are stick to their skin and if it gets stuck in their armpits it’s causes irritation😕I don’t doubt it works great for most, but knowing our luck she’d be the one getting it in her eyes😂
I’m definitely looking into getting her some mazuri pellets cause I’m hoping it’ll help with the diarrhoea she gets, thanks again!

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

My Redfoot is not an adult, so some of this post may not apply or help your situation. My Redfoot (Lightning) is between 2-3 years old.

1. I would definitely recommend a veterinarian visit. When receiving any new pet, it is always good to get them looked over and assessed. It did me a world of good...got me to this forum! So, it really does not hurt - the vet will also test for any parasites, so have a fecal sample ready. I hope the watery eye is not a respiratory infection, but best to know now than later. The vet will be able to recommend the best course of treatment.

2. My vet had recommended UV 5.0 HO TV UVB lamp 15-18" above the shell level. I use ceramic heat emitters for the rest of the enclosure to keep temps level. I just got a thermostat for these items, so this will help control and balance heat levels. I live in the USA (East Coast) so we are approaching summer and I usually don't need the heat emitters if I keep the AC in his room off. When we have to run it, I have the heat emitters on.
3. I was instructed to still feed daily. Redfoots are opportunistic eaters and munch along the way. So even if mine does not eat all at once, I keep the food there and a walking distance from the hide so he has to go out and get it. I let him out in the home for about an hour or so and put a few leaves/veggies around his roam area just to keep him interested.

4. How is the water supply? Is there a soaking dish or two ? How are you maintaining humidity?

The set up pics are really nice - maybe add a natural plant or two like a spider plant or Boston fern? These help maintain humidity and provide attractive hiding places for them.
Keep us posted. Your tort is precious and you are making a lot of good changes/decisions for her.

Thanks for your reply! Squirt has been with her owner for over 10 years now but hasn’t had a check up so I do think it’s worth taking her too personally, it’s a tricky situation because she doesn’t technically belong to me so I don’t get the finale say on everything, I just advise as best I can along to way, her care has come along leaps and bounds though😊we also just rely on the CHE’s for heat, they seem to be doing a good job, I definitely agree with the daily feedings too and they’re all on board with it, she’ll be getting daily from now on, got some more slate servers today to split the feed up and place it in different spots, hopefully get her mooching more🤞🏻
She has two water dishes, one corner one and one terracotta, to maintain the humidity we pour warm water into the viv corners at the beginning of the week, its holds for ages and keeps the under layer nice and damp, if we notice it go to the 70’s we’ll give a little top up mist with a spray bottle, there’s always condensation on the glass and the combos read well so it’s doing good.
Aw thanks you! Funny you should say that, it’s been my next mission but got a bit delayed with her being a bit off, was focusing on making the odd adjustment to see if it helped, I put a bunch of spider plants in a few days ago, but she decided to munch the whole lot🤣so I currently have my eye on a Boston fern, pilea, a prayer plant, some carax grass and an air plant for fun lol, I’m hoping she doesn’t destroy them quite so quickly🥲

Ill keep everyone updated on her progress, she’s still inactive but her appetite is still good, if she doesn’t start improving though I’m going to try push for a vet visit, thank you so much, I just want the absolute best for her❤️