No grocery store?

[Tim Ball]

So I have a yard and my sulcata munches on it all day. I was giving him romaine lettuce because he loves it and I felt like it was ok because he certainly doesn't depend on it...

Then I started trying all the other leafy greens I could find. I found this mix of Kale, Spinch, Chard, then I added romaine and green cabbage...chop it all up and give him a handful every day now...he eats it all up, and is still mowing the lawn.

So the question is, I get all this stuff at Walmart or Frys (Kroger)...what is the big deal about getting it at the grocery store? I just keep seeing post after post demonizing the "grocery store"...what if the package says it's organic? What if I go to Sprouts? What about a farmers market? I just feel like I am a better owner than I was by expanding beyond romaine lettuce, but now I am wondering if I am cluelessly killing him by buying veggies at Walmart?

Thoughts?

 

[daniellenc]

I think it's the calcium to phosphorus ratios of most grocery store greens and possible fertilizers/pesticides used. Spinach and kale should be fed in moderation and romaine is basically water. Endive, escarole, frisée, and other organic store bought greens are fine mixed with spring mix and yard grass/weeds. I think the thing is variety. Mustard and collard greens, turnip and radish greens are also good. If you're mixing it up and have a yard to munch on you're probably fine.

 

[Tom]

There are four main issues with grocery store greens:

• They tend to lack calcium
• They tend to have a poor calcium to phosphorous ratio
• They tend to be low in fiber
• Many contain high level of goitrogens.

I use this analogy: Grocery store greens is kind of like fast food. Its easy and convenient, but its not the best thing to be eating every day. Now if a person eats well-balanced healthy meals most of the time and then has Mickey D's or Taco Bell a couple of times a week, it will do no harm, and the person will likely remain healthy. Start eating fast food for lunch and dinner every day, and problems are likely to surface over time.

Simply, there are other far better foods for our tortoises, and as a tremendous bonus, those foods are free. Here is a list of those foods:
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/for-those-who-have-a-young-sulcata.76744/

 

[Kapidolo Farms]

It's not a problem. It's just a matter of why do that if your yard will sustain the tortoise?

The C: P ratio is easy enough to balance with calcium supplements - as easy as cuttle bone or other grocery greens that do have a favorable C: P ratio.

There is only one speculative account of goiter in tortoises that the author has publicly claimed was not his best work and he wishes it was never published. The current research seeking to tie goiter into the enlarged neck in giant tortoises is indicating it's is not goiter.

Another consideration is pesticide residue, there is almost always going to be pesticide residue, organic is not guaranteed solution to that issue, nor is it impossible to prevent all wind drift from home use, so it'a all a bit of a push there.

I have excellent results with grocery greens, see the 'tortoise chef' thread. But I would go all backyard harvest if I could.

You can see the nutritional analysis of grocery greens here https://ndb.nal.usda.gov/ndb/search...list&qt=&ds=Standard+Reference&qlookup=&manu=

I like to look at the 'per 100 grams' as then you can read % if the units otherwise match up i.e. grams to grams.

 

[wellington]

I look at it like this. In the winter where I live I have to depend on grocery greens for most of the winter, once my stored stash of grass and leaves have run out. In the summer time, when they are grazing on the grasses, weeds, leaves and flowers, why would I want to add the foods that are not so great. If you have to use them, like a lot of us do, when then there is no question, use them. If you don't need to, don't.

 

[Tim Ball]

Nice, thank you guys! I appreciate the detailed info. I screen shotted the foods in that link, Tom thank you.

To the I guess I give it to him in the same spirit I give my cat a can of tuna every now and then, or my dog a chunk of steak. Meaning they eat their dog and cat food, but they really seem to love a delicious treat. But that makes sense I am not giving out steak and tuna on the daily.

I guess I also thought giving him more than grass was a good thing by giving him variety. Aaaand l know I need more hobbies, but quite frankly I like to just sit there and watch him eat...exciting.

So just straight up 100% grass diet is all good, in fact it's recommended? I mean I have no other leaves (orange and lemon leaves which he doesn't touch), no flowers...and really no weeds except in the spring.

 

[daniellenc]

Get growing your climate sounds perfect!!

 

[Jtort1]

I buy my torts food from the grocery store. I do my best to buy organic greens and no fruit! I bought organic clover sprouts for her yesterday and she loves them! I agree, variety is key!

 

[Alaskamike]

Interesting read. Nutrition is one of my interests. I often think if I only paid as much attention to my own diet as I do for my pets ...well ...
it'd be a good thing

One thing I'm aware of in tortoises is the variety they eat in nature. Different plants tend to sprout & flourish at different times of the year. Drought & rainy season also provides variety. Gallops even eat birds when they need to. Aldabra & Sulcata eat carrion at times. They will eat ground bird eggs if the stumble upon them.

My Sulcata free grazes ( so does my Leopard & Aldabra) , however I still give him leftover store bought stuff when I have it : Bell Peppers, Spring Mix, collard Greens, fresh spinich ( don't yell at me , a bit of squash or a chunk of watermelon now & then. I also put out a bowl of soaked Mazuri about once a week.

Sure he could live on grass & weeds alone. But .. though none of the other stuff I might throw in the yard is " natural " to him , neither really is the exact nutrient composition of grass in Florida compared to savannah grass in his country of origin.

Kinda like the same reason we might take a multivitamin once a day - just in case - I give a bit of variety to him too - + sprinkle calcium powder on his treat at times.

Does it help ? Not sure.
Does it hurt him - I don't believe so , or I wouldn't do it.