Concerned new grandma

[Christinab]

You know when you have a new born and you are constantly wondering if they are ok?… well that is what I feel like I’m doing with my sons new Russian. He’s an older tortoise we just got and we are still leaning about him. We are leaning about food and the proper enclosure / temps. But what exactly is a normal behavior for him throughout the day? I guess what I’m looking for is confirmation that him sleeping through the day and just kinda like laying his head down closing his eyes with legs all spread out is ok? I’m sorry if I sound crazy.

 

[TammyJ]

Hi and welcome. You don't sound crazy, just a concerned new keeper. Please post some pictures of the tortoise and enclosure, and details of the temperatures, lighting, humidity, substrate and diet, so we can help from what you tell us. Thanks!

 

[Maggie3fan]

Hi and welcome...He is stressed at the move probably. When he's sleeping or just laying all spread out that puts most of his skin out in the hopefully warm air... he's warming up. I always find it interesting that no matter what the species, no matter what the sex, all tortoises everywhere in the world, 600 pounds or 1 pound, they all bask in the same positions... But it's hard to tell how he is without the info Tammy said you need to post.

 

[Christinab]

I found out from a previous post his enclosure is too small, so we are working on that. But here is how he’s laying, and here’s the temp and humidity at this moment

 

[wellington]

Yes it is too small. No glass aquarium is big enough unless special ordered. He needs a 4x8 foot minimum.
That gauge is no good either. They are not accurate. Get a digital and put it at tortoise height
Seeing you didn't give all the answers we need, I will just tell you. He needs a tube florescent for uvb. A incandescent flood bulb for basking that reaches temps of 95-100F. Ceramic heat emitter for added day heat if needed as the temps in the rest of the enclosure should range 75-80. It should be brightly lit so he does not want to brumate/hibernate, they usually do in winter. Night temps no lower than 70

 

[Christinab]

Yes it is too small. No glass aquarium is big enough unless special ordered. He needs a 4x8 foot minimum.
That gauge is no good either. They are not accurate. Get a digital and put it at tortoise height
Seeing you didn't give all the answers we need, I will just tell you. He needs a tube florescent for uvb. A incandescent flood bulb for basking that reaches temps of 95-100F. Ceramic heat emitter for added day heat if needed as the temps in the rest of the enclosure should range 75-80. It should be brightly lit so he does not want to brumate/hibernate, they usually do in winter. Night temps no lower than 70

Thank you for this info on correcting the enclosure. Is this normal behavior? Or am I to assume he is too hot? Or something else is wrong due to the temps ?

 

[Tom]

Thank you for this info on correcting the enclosure. Is this normal behavior? Or am I to assume he is too hot? Or something else is wrong due to the temps ?

It could be normal behavior, but its hard for us to guess without more info. We need to know the four temperatures; Warm side, cool side, basking area directly under the bulb and the over night low.

What heating and lighting equipment are you using? What type of UV bulb. Not the brand of bulb, but the type of bulb?

We can see that your substrate is okay. We know the enclosure is too small, but seeing the whole thing in relation to the tortoise helps us assess things and give better answers. Sometimes we see problems that could cause lethargy. Other times we don't see problems, and then we might opine that everything is on track and the new guy is simply adjusting to his new housing situation. We might see that lighting and temperatures are inadequate and conclude that this guy is trying to brumate for winter.

 

[Christinab]

basking is 95-97, warm stayed around 90, cool temp is 82, over night temp 75-76

 

[wellington]

basking is 95-97, warm stayed around 90, cool temp is 82, over night temp 75-76

If you could answer all the questions at once, we could answer your question quicker and give advice on what needs changing quicker.

 

[wellington]

Warm side of 90 is too high. All around should be a span of 75-80. Basking temp is fine. Night temps too warm.

 

[Christinab]

It could be normal behavior, but its hard for us to guess without more info. We need to know the four temperatures; Warm side, cool side, basking area directly under the bulb and the over night low.

What heating and lighting equipment are you using? What type of UV bulb. Not the brand of bulb, but the type of bulb?

We can see that your substrate is okay. We know the enclosure is too small, but seeing the whole thing in relation to the tortoise helps us assess things and give better answers. Sometimes we see problems that could cause lethargy. Other times we don't see problems, and then we might opine that everything is on track and the new guy is simply adjusting to his new housing situation. We might see that lighting and temperatures are inadequate and conclude that this guy is trying to brumate for winter.

this is the heating we were told to get. Obviously I am now learning the pet store doesn’t give the best advice.

 

[Christinab]

Here the lighting from under

 

[Tom]

Here the lighting from under

If this is all you have then the lethargy might be due to incorrect living conditions.

Here is a breakdown of the four heating and lighting essentials:

1. Basking bulb. I use 65 watt incandescent floods from the hardware store. Some people will need bigger, or smaller wattage bulbs. Let your thermometer be your guide. I run them on a timer for about 12 hours and adjust the height to get the correct basking temp under them. I also like to use a flat rock of some sort directly under the bulb. You need to check the temp with a thermometer directly under the bulb and get it to around 95-100F (36-37C).
2. Ambient heat maintenance. I use ceramic heating elements or radiant heat panels set on thermostats to maintain ambient above 80 degrees day and night for tropical species. In most cases you'd only need day heat for a temperate species like Testudo or DT, as long as your house stays above 60F (15-16C) at night. Some people in colder climates or with larger enclosures will need multiple CHEs or RHPs to spread out enough heat.
3. Ambient light. I use LEDs for this purpose. Something in the 5000-6500K color range will look the best. Most bulbs at the store are in the 2500K range and they look yellowish. Strip or screw-in LED bulb types are both fine.
4. UV. If you can get your tortoise outside for an hour 2 or 3 times a week, you won't need indoor UV. In colder climates, get one of the newer HO type fluorescent tubes. Which type will depend on mounting height. 5.0 bulbs make almost no UV. I like the 12% HO bulbs from Arcadia. You need a meter to check this: https://www.solarmeter.com/model65.html A good UV bulb only needs to run for 2-3 hours mid day. You need the basking bulb and the ambient lighting to be on at least 12 hours a day.

More here:

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[Christinab]

Ok went and think I got the right uv. Can you confirm?

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Ok went and think I got the right uv. Can you confirm?

It's not exactly the recommended type (T5 HO) but very close.
1. This lamp is T8 type (it is an older standard with a larger tube diameter).
2. They have less light output, and UV and especially visible light. So they need to be mounted lower than T5 lamps to be effective.
3. This lamp is targeted for the forest species and have less UVB output, than needed for Russian tortoises.
4. The manufacturer (Zilla) is not very reliable, unfortunately. Both fixtures and lamps are of lower quality than ZooMed or Arcadia.
5. Considering p. 2-4 the lifespan for this lamp can be very short (3-6 months) before it stops giving out noticeable UV output.

My advice is to return this lamp, if possible.

This is more suitable:
https://www.chewy.com/zoo-med-reptisun-t5-ho-high-output/dp/257663 (it comes bundled with 5% which might work, depending on enclosure height or should be replaced with this lamp: https://www.chewy.com/zoo-med-reptisun-100-uvb-t5-ho/dp/257675)
And this is Arcadia ProT5 Desert 12%, which is harder to find in US, but perhaps has the best quality/price ratio:

Arcadia PRO t5 Fixture 12% Bulb 22.5" SALE NOW ONLY 69.99

LightYourReptiles.com was founded on one simple idea: To bring the best in full spectrum lighting products to the herpetological community.

www.lightyourreptiles.com

If this lamp and fixture can't be returned, we can, of course, try to fit it in.

 

[zovick]

I found out from a previous post his enclosure is too small, so we are working on that. But here is how he’s laying, and here’s the temp and humidity at this moment

To answer your initial question, the position in which the tortoise is shown in your photo is a very normal "relaxing" position. Most tortoises rest in that same position. Many times one or both of their back legs will also be extended out from their shells.

The position doesn't appear abnormal in any way to me.

Good luck bringing your husbandry up to speed. You have come to the right place, just don't be discouraged by learning the mistakes you may have made. At least 90% of the new people who come here have made the same errors and have gradually made the necessary corrections. The other roughly 10% argue and try to validate their errors before leaving in disgust to the detriment of their animals' health and welfare.

 

[Ada89]

I found out from a previous post his enclosure is too small, so we are working on that. But here is how he’s laying, and here’s the temp and humidity at this moment

That position he's laying in seems OK to me. He will be more docile if he's not getting the right UVB/heat.