Snake kills children ?! D:

[ra94131]

When a poorly cared for pit bull kills a child, how many responsible beagle owners are chastised?

I have had numerous people use this story to imply that I am being irresponsible simply by having snakes. One even implied that my wife and I must get rid of our snakes if we ever plan on having children... it drives me crazy.

Not only is my situation in no way comparable to this one, but 99% of the people I know pursue more dangerouse hobbies/activities than snake husbandry. Boating, hunting, recreational driving, gun collecting, rock climbing, marathon running, even casual alcohol consumption... the list goes on. And I don't want to imply that I disagree with these activities; I believe people should feel free to pursue their passions responsibly.

But if I've even mentioned that I own a python to someone, this story seems to signify that I'm some sort of miscreant with little regard for public or personal safety.

Some people's irrational fear and ignorance of snakes just really gets under my skin. Things like this should not reflect poorly on me.

Sorry to rant and/or stray from this very unfortunate topic, but it's been building and I needed to vent.

At least nobody worries about my tortoise... although I personally think once he's adult size, he'll be the most hazardous animal I own. [WINKING FACE]

 

[Jd3]

When a poorly cared for pit bull kills a child, how many responsible beagle owners are chastised?

I have had numerous people use this story to imply that I am being irresponsible simply by having snakes. One even implied that my wife and I must get rid of our snakes if we ever plan on having children... it drives me crazy.

Not only is my situation in no way comparable to this one, but 99% of the people I know pursue more dangerouse hobbies/activities than snake husbandry. Boating, hunting, recreational driving, gun collecting, rock climbing, marathon running, even casual alcohol consumption... the list goes on. And I don't want to imply that I disagree with these activities; I believe people should feel free to pursue their passions responsibly.

But if I've even mentioned that I own a python to someone, this story seems to signify that I'm some sort of miscreant with little regard for public or personal safety.

Some people's irrational fear and ignorance of snakes just really gets under my skin. Things like this should not reflect poorly on me.

Sorry to rant and/or stray from this very unfortunate topic, but it's been building and I needed to vent.

At least nobody worries about my tortoise... although I personally think once he's adult size, he'll be the most hazardous animal I own. [WINKING FACE]

Calmly use logic and experience to educate them.

 

[ra94131]

Calmly use logic and experience to educate them.

That would be the goal. (And also normally my favorite part of owning snakes.)

Some days (and some people) are just more frustrating than others.

 

[StudentoftheReptile]

I'm about as biased towards snakes as anyone, but it is looking more and more as if the snake is mostly responsible. Whether it tried to eat them, coil around them for warmth and inadvertently smothered them, or attacked them out of defense from a stressful predicament, nothing can change the fact that the snake was kept in a poorly-designed enclosure. Personally, I think it is a freak accident that ultimately led to a horrible tragedy. Preventable? Possibly, but I don't think the owner should be completely hung out to dry.

That said, as much as I am an advocate for the "privilege" to keep reptiles (snakes or otherwise), I think huge snakes and venomous are entirely too easy to acquire in many parts of the world. Should they be completely banned? I don't feel so. But some regulation is needed. I did not used to feel that way, but I am slowly changing my stance on it.

 

[ra94131]

I'm about as biased towards snakes as anyone, but it is looking more and more as if the snake is mostly responsible. Whether it tried to eat them, coil around them for warmth and inadvertently smothered them, or attacked them out of defense from a stressful predicament, nothing can change the fact that the snake was kept in a poorly-designed enclosure. Personally, I think it is a freak accident that ultimately led to a horrible tragedy. Preventable? Possibly, but I don't think the owner should be completely hung out to dry.

That said, as much as I am an advocate for the "privilege" to keep reptiles (snakes or otherwise), I think huge snakes and venomous are entirely too easy to acquire in many parts of the world. Should they be completely banned? I don't feel so. But some regulation is needed. I did not used to feel that way, but I am slowly changing my stance on it.

I could not agree more with just about this whole post.

 

[Baoh]

I am awaiting the autopsy before making any potentially premature judgments. I think I read that it will be performed on Tuesday.

 

[Jd3]

It was already performed. The preliminary results show death by asphyxiation. The full report may or may not be released, in part related to how they proceed with criminal filings.

 

[Baoh]

Compressive or other? Asphyxiation is a little broad.

 

[poison]

Is the species aggressive or defensive when "attacked"? Do they seek out trouble, or do they react aggressively when "trouble" finds them?

Biting would be a defensive, or even aggressive tactic. Coiling up and suffocating a live animal would only happen for prey. Coiling around a perceived attacker would not be a wise survival strategy for a snake.

I just wanna say that a snake will constrict its prey out of defense. For example. My tree boa gave a mouse a couple defensive bites then constricted it and dropped it and never whent back for it.

I do agree with you that these snakes do not go out to find trouble but in my opinion this could have very well been a defensive act.

 

[EchoTheLeoTort]

Reasons the story of the "snake killing two children in Canada" is B.S
1) when a snake constricts their prey, its about 80 psi, a childs bones will break around 5 psi. The kids had no broken anything.
2) before a snake coils, it bites the prey. There are no bite marks
3) if a snake fell from the ceiling onto these children, they'd scream their asses off and wake up whoever was in the house. They wouldn't just lay there and take it.
4) There would be severe bruising from a 100 pound snake constricting anything.
5) snakes don't randomly kill things and not attempt to eat it, they'd rather flee if they felt threatened. Again, there were no bite marks.
6) It's very unlikely (almost impossible) that a snake would decide to constrict two children at once, much less one
7) if the snake fell through the ceiling and messed up some ducting (which is sometimes associated with heating), it could of easily been carbon monoxide poisoning.
8) The "adult" would of heard a 100lb snake falling through a ceiling, and would of immediately gotten up to check on the noise and the children. You can't possibly NOT hear that kind of racket.
9) If it was a case of smothering. the body automatically wakes you up if you aren't breathing. Thats why people who stop breathing in their sleep jolt awake gasping for air. The body would of triggered the children to wake up to get air.
10) this guy has changed his story several times. From various sources, i've heard the kids were sleeping on the floor, they were on a bed, they were in a bedroom, they were in a living room, the snake was kept downstairs, the snake was kept upstairs. Which is it? None of this story adds up.
I am strongly doubting the snake did anything, it's just an animal getting blamed because the children ended up dead and it was the easiest thing to pin it on.

 

[Jd3]

Reasons the story of the "snake killing two children in Canada" is B.S
1) when a snake constricts their prey, its about 80 psi, a childs bones will break around 5 psi. The kids had no broken anything.
2) before a snake coils, it bites the prey. There are no bite marks
3) if a snake fell from the ceiling onto these children, they'd scream their asses off and wake up whoever was in the house. They wouldn't just lay there and take it.
4) There would be severe bruising from a 100 pound snake constricting anything.
5) snakes don't randomly kill things and not attempt to eat it, they'd rather flee if they felt threatened. Again, there were no bite marks.
6) It's very unlikely (almost impossible) that a snake would decide to constrict two children at once, much less one
7) if the snake fell through the ceiling and messed up some ducting (which is sometimes associated with heating), it could of easily been carbon monoxide poisoning.
8) The "adult" would of heard a 100lb snake falling through a ceiling, and would of immediately gotten up to check on the noise and the children. You can't possibly NOT hear that kind of racket.
9) If it was a case of smothering. the body automatically wakes you up if you aren't breathing. Thats why people who stop breathing in their sleep jolt awake gasping for air. The body would of triggered the children to wake up to get air.
10) this guy has changed his story several times. From various sources, i've heard the kids were sleeping on the floor, they were on a bed, they were in a bedroom, they were in a living room, the snake was kept downstairs, the snake was kept upstairs. Which is it? None of this story adds up.
I am strongly doubting the snake did anything, it's just an animal getting blamed because the children ended up dead and it was the easiest thing to pin it on.

Ummm the autopsy report hasn't been released. So you're entire argument is invalid.

Why are people trying to defend an animal. Why not focus on educating people on why not all animals keepers are bad people.

This is insane.

 

[poison]

1),2),4) the full autopsy reporsts have not been released so there is no way for you to know if there was any broken bones, bites or bruising.

3) the snake did not fall on the kids.

5) snakes also kill in defense again the full autopsy has not been released so we do not know if there were bite marks.

6) I don't see how it is unlikely (if it was out of defense)

7) That it very well could have been.

8) I doubt the whole snake fell out of the ceiling at once. Perhaps part of the ceiling collapsed and the snake climbed down.

9) I don't fully understand what you meant by "If it was a case of smothering"

10) Are you sure it was the guy changing the story or the media not having a clue on what they were talking about?

---

Ummm the autopsy report hasn't been released. So you're entire argument is invalid.

Why are people trying to defend an animal. Why not focus on educating people on why not all animals keepers are bad people.

This is insane.

Exactly!!!

 

[EchoTheLeoTort]

Funny how you both are so quick to say it was the snake. Do either of you own a snake? Were you there? Your entire arguement is also invalid considering nothings been released. There is nothing i hate more than people who act like they know everything about everything and quickly hop all over people who try and give reasons as to why it wouldnt be the snake. You both quickly take sides and are quick to shut down tom and everyone else who says maybe it wasnt the snake. I have no clue if the snake did it, neither do you. Don't shoot everyone down and don't kid yourself that snakes are satans minions. Many snakes have calm and relaxed demeanors. The fact of the matter is that if it were released that it was asphyxiation, and they wanted to prove it was the snake for sure theyd release the facts that there were bite marks and other damage. Have you fallowed murder cases on tv? Things get released quickly in the media. I dont think the story adds up and i think they should of waited to put the snake down. It was wrong to kill it based off a claim and not facts.

 

[poison]

Funny how you both are so quick to say it was the snake. Do either of you own a snake? Were you there? Your entire arguement is also invalid considering nothings been released. There is nothing i hate more than people who act like they know everything about everything and quickly hop all over people who try and give reasons as to why it wouldnt be the snake. You both quickly take sides and are quick to shut down tom and everyone else who says maybe it wasnt the snake. I have no clue if the snake did it, neither do you. Don't shoot everyone down and don't kid yourself that snakes are satans minions. Many snakes have calm and relaxed demeanors. The fact of the matter is that if it were released that it was asphyxiation, and they wanted to prove it was the snake for sure theyd release the facts that there were bite marks and other damage. Have you fallowed murder cases on tv? Things get released quickly in the media. I dont think the story adds up and i think they should of waited to put the snake down. It was wrong to kill it based off a claim and not facts.

Now you are just putting words in my mouth. I never once said "the snake did it". Do I own snakes? Yes I have kept snakes for 13 years now. But I don't see how that has to do with anything. A lot of "reptile enthusiast" are acting to nieve and don't wanna believe that the snake did it just because they are "reptile keepers". No there is not enough info out there to say the snake did it but there is also not enough info to say the snake didnt do it at this point. These large constrictors are very capable of doing things like this and it should be known.

Please tell me how my argument is invalid. It is my opinion and experiences.

 

[mike taylor]

Snakes don't kill by asphyxiation. The death is caused by cardiac arrest. Just saying there should be more evidence before judgements are out.


Sent from my C771 using TortForum mobile app

 

[poison]

asphyxiation: to cause to die or lose consciousness by impairing normal breathing, as by gas or other noxious agents; choke; suffocate; smother.

A snake CAN asphyxiate a person/ animal.

 

[mike taylor]

The squeeze of the snake has been scientifically proven to cause cardiac arrest way before asphyxiation.

Sent from my C771 using TortForum mobile app

 

[poison]

The squeeze of the snake has been scientifically proven to cause cardiac arrest way before asphyxiation.

Sent from my C771 using TortForum mobile app

Oh it has? Would love to see the scientific documents please

 

[jtrux]

The snake totally did it. African Rock Pythons are known for killing for fun, they do it all the time...look it up...Google it...the internet never lies.

 

[mike taylor]

Really where have you been . Look at the snake research from Dr. Brady Bar/ Steve Irwin / Jeff Corwin. Man the list of research from these guys is endless. You didn' follow these guy when you where a kid I sure did . These are the people that got me hooked on snakes besides the school teacher that gave me my first snake . The squeeze of the snake will make the blood vessel in the eyes explode. Stops blood flow to the heart therefore causing cardiac arrest . The breaking of bones . The bleeding from the noise the mouth eyes. The death from a snake is not a clean kill on a person . If it was just asphyxiation and someone was there to help get the snake of fast simple CPR would save the person from a sure death but this is not the case . The heart stops= cardiac arrest.


Sent from my C771 using TortForum mobile app