Urinating a lot causing gritty urates? Or something else?

laney

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My newest (8 monthish) but biggest tort has passed some gritty urates over the past couple of days. After searching other threads dehydration seems to come up a lot but she is urinating beyond belief. I know they pee when scared which she has done occasionally but she is doing it up to 3 times a day, usually a flood after eating and I mean a lot! Then at other times, I do put some watery foods (cress, romaine) in with her other food to make sure she's getting fluid so that's probably not helping.
I normally bathe her every 3 days, should I increase? Or would the stress make her pee more and urates worse? She does drink in her soak and quite likes being in the water (hence her name is River). When I got her I don't think she had been in water for a very long time she seemed to enjoy it so much, I was soaking everyday then every second now every third.
I noticed her hot spot was a bit hot (ranging up to 37oC) so I've raised the lamp slightly, although she rarely basks as she is still very shy.
One other thing that might be relevant is she chomps on her cuttle bone a lot, I'd say everyday, at a guess I would say she has eaten 2/3 of a small one in a month on top of her food being supplemented. I have increased foods with calcium to see if that helps but thought it could be linked.
How do I keep her hydrated if she keeps peeing it out?
 

wellington

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I'm not sure peeing too much would be a problem. I would not feed her any more calcium then what she is eating on her own. Too much is not good. May be the reason for gritty urates. I would up,the soaks as urates should not be gritty.
 

laney

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Oh btw she has water available 24/7


wellington said:
I'm. It sure peeing too much would be a problem. I would not feed her any more calcium then what she is eating on her own. Too much is not good. May be the reason for gritty urates. I would up,the soaks as urates should not be gritty.

Do you think no supplements just cuttle bone? I used to think they knew when they needed calcium and how much until I got her, maybe seems so much as my other two rarely touch their cuttle's. I caught her today going to check to see if her plate had been refilled with food and when it hadn't she went straight to eating the cuttle so I gave in and put more food in and she turned and ate it instead. She likes her food!!
 

ascott

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Is this a russian tort? If so and the tort likes to soak--- I would say to soak the tort every day....I also would not offer calcium supplement if the tort is consuming it from the cuttle bone...what type of uv rays does this tort have time with?

Is this a female tort? If yes, has the tort been enclosed with a male in the last 4 years or so?
 

laney

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ascott said:
Is this a russian tort? If so and the tort likes to soak--- I would say to soak the tort every day....I also would not offer calcium supplement if the tort is consuming it from the cuttle bone...what type of uv rays does this tort have time with?

Is this a female tort? If yes, has the tort been enclosed with a male in the last 4 years or so?

Thanks for replying.
Yes the Russian in my avatar, she is definitely female and was in an enclosure with one female and about 4males if I remember rightly. I have let her meet my male but he was too aggressive for my liking so my fingers were constantly between them lol no mounting he has found his manhood but confused what to do with it.
It's 3am so I can't check my book for her measurements atm but she is under 6inches, think she is 5inches but will double check tomorrow. That's too small to have eggs inside her though yes??


Sorry forgot...
I will go back to daily soaks and do you think I could control her calcium better if I take the cuttle out and continue with supplements or do you think she knows best what she needs??
she has a 10%UVB tube light but spends a lot of time under her log with only her head exposed so couldn't be absorbing much :( she was so shy, making slow progress but she still likes to hide!
One thing I do need to do is dump more water in her enclosure as its getting quite dry.


Warm weather has gone here so no predicted outside time now I'm afraid.
 

ascott

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I would not wet the entire enclosure...she is large enough to have a warm humid hide --this will allow her the ability to better regulate....

If she was in with males before---it does not actually matter is "she" is ready to mate---I would imagine that the males may have been...

I would let her regulate her own calcium consumption and leave the calcium block there....and I would also partner this with daily warm water soaks....

Is the uv bulb at or near 6 months old? If so it would be a good thing to replace...

Has this tort brumated before? Will you support brumation in the future? I ask this because I would keep this tort awake for the winter...with increased consumption of calcium and being female and being with males recently---I would keep her up and make sure she is not carrying any eggs....
 

laney

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ascott said:
I would not wet the entire enclosure...she is large enough to have a warm humid hide --this will allow her the ability to better regulate....

If she was in with males before---it does not actually matter is "she" is ready to mate---I would imagine that the males may have been...

I would let her regulate her own calcium consumption and leave the calcium block there....and I would also partner this with daily warm water soaks....

Is the uv bulb at or near 6 months old? If so it would be a good thing to replace...

Has this tort brumated before? Will you support brumation in the future? I ask this because I would keep this tort awake for the winter...with increased consumption of calcium and being female and being with males recently---I would keep her up and make sure she is not carrying any eggs....

Ok I will make her a humid hide, just ordered some moss to do one for my little one so no problem doing a big one.

Sorry I'm not good at explaining, I meant my boy is not fully ready but I thought if females were under 6inches (approx) that they couldn't carry (is that really stupid?) the other female in with her was huge so I would have expected it if it was her I took.

Ok I will let her regulate her own calcium and do the daily soaks again.

Her UVB is nearing replacement so I will go and see if pets at home has had their delivery yet, went in 3days ago and they were out but expecting a delivery, if not I will just order online.

I don't know if she has brumated before but not since she has been with me. She was poorly in the first few months of having her so definitely won't be brumating this year and to be honest I don't have the confidence to do them this year. If their health is good hopefully next year but it terrifies me to be honest.

So is there any way to check incase she does have eggs? Or only X-ray? I assume if she were carrying she couldn't lay due to her size?
Thanks for helping by the way :)
 

ascott

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While under 6 inches is not the run of the mill...it absolutely can happen....especially if she has shared space with a humpy male :D

Not saying this is what the issue is....but certainly the first thing that came to mind....and you are sure that this is a female right?

Xrays are the only way that I know of confirming eggs or not...well, waiting and giving some time also will work....:D If she is eating and basking and appears to be acting normal and the only thing is her increased appetite for calcium then I would not worry just yet...I would offer more food and do so until you find an appropriate amount she eats with vigor...and I would then adjust your offering to that amount..this species of tort seems to be a piggy as their evolutionary clock tells them to chow down all in sight in preparation for there being none during the months they would naturally rest....

Yes, you are the one that will ultimately decide if brumation is in the future for the tort or not :D
 

laney

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Yep definitely female.

When I got her the vet called her FAT!! She was riddled with worms, so many that her poop was just balls of worms, she stopped eating as soon as she got panacur for about two months, then she would only eat one thing and then suddenly she had an appetite and wants seconds and thirds!!
I'm trying to slowly reduce the food as she is over weight but its so hard, I'm trying to limit it to 1.5 times her size at the moment and then will try just her shell size worth of food, I don't know where the months have gone I'm still just so pleased when I see her eat after her hunger strike in the beginning.

Ok so back to daily soaks and no supps just cuttle. Is there anything else recommended by anyone?
I'm guessing excessive urination isn't a sign of any illnesses?
 

laney

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So I've been doing daily soaks and not supplementing her food for 10+ days now and she is urinating slightly less which is good but her urates are grittier than ever although seems to be not as much of them.
Should I be worried?
Could she have stones or anything?
Does she just need more time with what we've been doing?
 

ascott

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So I've been doing daily soaks and not supplementing her food for 10+ days now and she is urinating slightly less which is good but her urates are grittier than ever although seems to be not as much of them.
Should I be worried?
Could she have stones or anything?
Does she just need more time with what we've been doing?

Are you deciding to brumate her this year as you said you have not offered her supplemental food? Urinating slightly less is not desirable if you are trying to clear /loosen the passing of urates....

If you are going to keep her awake this winter then I would be doing business as usual---adding the daily long warm water soaks and when you do offer her supplemental foods you can spray them with water to add to hydration...if the urates are getting less in quantity then that is not necessarily a bad thing....yes, I would keep an eye on her and continue the soaks....it can take a few weeks to really aid the passing of gritty urates as well as continue the soaks for the purpose of hydrating her...

Also, you said she was riddled with worms at one time.. Are you satisfied that issue was resolved? Did you do any probiotics after that treatment to help her get a good balance back in your gut?
 

laney

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ascott said:
So I've been doing daily soaks and not supplementing her food for 10+ days now and she is urinating slightly less which is good but her urates are grittier than ever although seems to be not as much of them.
Should I be worried?
Could she have stones or anything?
Does she just need more time with what we've been doing?

Are you deciding to brumate her this year as you said you have not offered her supplemental food? Urinating slightly less is not desirable if you are trying to clear /loosen the passing of urates....

If you are going to keep her awake this winter then I would be doing business as usual---adding the daily long warm water soaks and when you do offer her supplemental foods you can spray them with water to add to hydration...if the urates are getting less in quantity then that is not necessarily a bad thing....yes, I would keep an eye on her and continue the soaks....it can take a few weeks to really aid the passing of gritty urates as well as continue the soaks for the purpose of hydrating her...

Also, you said she was riddled with worms at one time.. Are you satisfied that issue was resolved? Did you do any probiotics after that treatment to help her get a good balance back in your gut?

No not brumating this year, sorry I meant not supplementing her food with calcium powder and nutrabol just giving her a cuttle bone to nibble if she chooses.
She is still urinating a lot maybe 1-2 times a day rather than 2-3 times so I'm hoping she is keeping some fluids inside now whilst enough to pass any urates :)
She had a very bad load of worms, it took several doses of panacur to get rid of them and she lost her appetite for months during and after treatment, I got her poo tested and she was finally given the all clear. I didn't offer any probiotics, what sort of thing should I have offered for future reference?
I will continue with the suggested and see how it goes. Her urates were really gritty yesterday in her soak but today when she urinated they were much better :)
 
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