URGENT Please help! Speedy is deteriorating.

[Speedy101]

One thing to note, on the X-ray, the vet did say speedy had gas bubbles in his stomach but it was not massively distended.

 

[Speedy101]

Rang vets no appointments until Tuesday, they gave speedy panacur.

 

[Speedy101]

Rang vets no appointments until Tuesday, they gave speedy panacur.

Tried to ring other reptile vets in the area, that mine recommended but no appointments anywhere, I think my best bet and only choice is to keep him comfortable, warm and hydrated until Tuesday.

 

[Maggie3fan]

Also in relation to the feeding tube, I agree but isn’t putting him under anaesthesia going to be a big risk while he’s in this state?

Tortoises have a really hard time with anesthesia. I lost a 17 yr old Sulcata to a huge bladder stone, but he wouldn't come out of the anesthesia and ultimately it was the anesthesia that killed him. I realize that possibly I am a little gun shy on the anesthesia topic. But me? I'd only do the feeding tube if he were in a life or death situation. Maybe Speedy is at that point. I 'thought' I read that he had last eaten on Nov 23rd but I can't find it. That's not hardly any time at all for a species that can go without eating for months. I didn't say Speedy should go that long without eating, I said can go without. Personally, if he did eat on Nov 23rd there's no way in hell I'd risk anesthesia at this point. A parasite load, antibiotics, or too cool temps may cause tortoises to lose it's appetite for a period of time. I'd do carrot soaks daily add Pedialite to the carrot soaks if you want. But plz at least think about what I have said. I am NOT a Vet, altho I do watch one on TV.

When I came home from being gone for 2 weeks, 3 of my box turtles, all in the same tort table, wouldn't eat, or move or couldn't open swollen eyes. My case is different than your's mine are turtles not tortoises but now for 3 weeks I've been doing the carrot soaks w/antibiotic powder in the carrot water daily, every day for 3 weeks, 2 now have open eye and are eating, not a lot, but still...Here's the one who's not eating yet, he still has ok weight but look at him carrot and antibiotic soaks daily, for 3 weeks along with sub Q fluids for 1 week yet he looks like he's just come out of the desert.

 

[Speedy101]

Tortoises have a really hard time with anesthesia. I lost a 17 yr old Sulcata to a huge bladder stone, but he wouldn't come out of the anesthesia and ultimately it was the anesthesia that killed him. I realize that possibly I am a little gun shy on the anesthesia topic. But me? I'd only do the feeding tube if he were in a life or death situation. Maybe Speedy is at that point. I 'thought' I read that he had last eaten on Nov 23rd but I can't find it. That's not hardly any time at all for a species that can go without eating for months. I didn't say Speedy should go that long without eating, I said can go without. Personally, if he did eat on Nov 23rd there's no way in hell I'd risk anesthesia at this point. A parasite load, antibiotics, or too cool temps may cause tortoises to lose it's appetite for a period of time. I'd do carrot soaks daily add Pedialite to the carrot soaks if you want. But plz at least think about what I have said. I am NOT a Vet, altho I do watch one on TV.

When I came home from being gone for 2 weeks, 3 of my box turtles, all in the same tort table, wouldn't eat, or move or couldn't open swollen eyes. My case is different than your's mine are turtles not tortoises but now for 3 weeks I've been doing the carrot soaks w/antibiotic powder in the carrot water daily, every day for 3 weeks, 2 now have open eye and are eating, not a lot, but still...Here's the one who's not eating yet, he still has ok weight but look at him carrot and antibiotic soaks daily, for 3 weeks along with sub Q fluids for 1 week yet he looks like he's just come out of the desert.
View attachment 312401

Hi thank you for your input and I am sorry about your sulcata. He did eat on the 23rd but ultimately vomited it up. I am doing the soaks twice a day with Reptoboost and carrot. His eyes are still bright and alert when he is awake although he is very sleepy. I will definitely take into account what you have said about the feeding tube, I did voice my concern about putting him to sleep when he’s in this fragile state. My biggest concern is that he isn’t walking ( no strength to lift himself) which I think is because he is in pain. Speedy has not lost any weight yet but I have been soaking him a lot. Water weight perhaps? I will see what the vet suggests on Tuesday and will keep in mind what you have said, thank you!

 

[Chefdenoel10]

Tortoises have a really hard time with anesthesia. I lost a 17 yr old Sulcata to a huge bladder stone, but he wouldn't come out of the anesthesia and ultimately it was the anesthesia that killed him. I realize that possibly I am a little gun shy on the anesthesia topic. But me? I'd only do the feeding tube if he were in a life or death situation. Maybe Speedy is at that point. I 'thought' I read that he had last eaten on Nov 23rd but I can't find it. That's not hardly any time at all for a species that can go without eating for months. I didn't say Speedy should go that long without eating, I said can go without. Personally, if he did eat on Nov 23rd there's no way in hell I'd risk anesthesia at this point. A parasite load, antibiotics, or too cool temps may cause tortoises to lose it's appetite for a period of time. I'd do carrot soaks daily add Pedialite to the carrot soaks if you want. But plz at least think about what I have said. I am NOT a Vet, altho I do watch one on TV.

When I came home from being gone for 2 weeks, 3 of my box turtles, all in the same tort table, wouldn't eat, or move or couldn't open swollen eyes. My case is different than your's mine are turtles not tortoises but now for 3 weeks I've been doing the carrot soaks w/antibiotic powder in the carrot water daily, every day for 3 weeks, 2 now have open eye and are eating, not a lot, but still...Here's the one who's not eating yet, he still has ok weight but look at him carrot and antibiotic soaks daily, for 3 weeks along with sub Q fluids for 1 week yet he looks like he's just come out of the desert.
View attachment 312401

what else can you try?

 

[zovick]

Also in relation to the feeding tube, I agree but isn’t putting him under anaesthesia going to be a big risk while he’s in this state?

Well, IMHO, the anesthesia to insert a feeding tube which could ultimately save the animal's life is less of a risk to the tortoise's well-being than not placing one and trying to medicate a sick tortoise by mouth. Plus you can feed and hydrate the tortoise with that feeding tube. The way things are now, you can only hope that the tortoise will drink enough and eat enough to keep itself going and there is no good and accurate way to tell how much medication you can get into the tortoise if medicating orally.

 

[Speedy101]

Well, IMHO, the anesthesia to insert a feeding tube which could ultimately save the animal's life is less of a risk to the tortoise's well-being than not placing one and trying to medicate a sick tortoise by mouth. Plus you can feed and hydrate the tortoise with that feeding tube. The way things are now, you can only hope that the tortoise will drink enough and eat enough to keep itself going and there is no good and accurate way to tell how much medication you can get into the tortoise if medicating orally.

I am not medicating him myself at the moment, the vet is with just the worming medication. He is drinking on his own but not eating.

 

[GMDVM]

I am not medicating him myself at the moment, the vet is with just the worming medication. He is drinking on his own but not eating.

Great that he is drinking on his own!! Is he keeping the water down? If he is i might dissolve a couple of granules of Mazuri tortoise food in the water.

 

[Speedy101]

Great that he is drinking on his own!! Is he keeping the water down? If he is i might dissolve a couple of granules of Mazuri tortoise food in the water.

He’s been drinking LOADS by himself, he’s a good drinker. He’s been urinating as well so he’s keeping it down, I will try that!

 

[Speedy101]

He seems to be urinating a lot more in the past 2 days. Could this be his kidneys working through medication? Or just extra water he has been drinking.

 

[Roxanneizded]

He seems to be urinating a lot more in the past 2 days. Could this be his kidneys working through medication? Or just extra water he has been drinking.

Hi. Like with most creatures when it comes to water: what goes in, must come out. Told you, you got this. You will succeed. After the crisis, I hope you check for parasites at least once a year. In captivity, tortoises can reinfect themselves easily. In the wild, they can expell parasites and move on tolerating small infestations. Have a good day and know you are doing a great job.

 

[Speedy101]

Hi. Like with most creatures when it comes to water: what goes in, must come out. Told you, you got this. You will succeed. After the crisis, I hope you check for parasites at least once a year. In captivity, tortoises can reinfect themselves easily. In the wild, they can expell parasites and move on tolerating small infestations. Have a good day and know you are doing a great job.

I will get him checked once a year, and thank you, you too!

 

[zovick]

I am not medicating him myself at the moment, the vet is with just the worming medication. He is drinking on his own but not eating.

I realize that, but the animal will go downhill if it doesn't eat soon, PLUS depending upon what is determined Tuesday, you or your vet may need to give the tortoise more medications than just Panacur. If you can afford multiple vet appointments to have him medicate the tortoise as often as needed, that's up to you.

By the way, how did your vet administer the Panacur?

 

[Speedy101]

I realize that, but the animal will go downhill if it doesn't eat soon, PLUS depending upon what is determined Tuesday, you may need to give the tortoise more medications than just Panacur. By the way, how did your vet administer the Panacur?

He adminstered it through a tube into his stomach. What do you suggest I mention to the vet ( e.g feeding tube etc)? Or should I let him come to his own conclusion? Thanks again.

 

[Speedy101]

If I lift Speedys shell for him, with two fingers each side giving him a bit of help, he can walk with all legs moving. He just doesn’t seem to have the strength to lift himself on his own

 

[zovick]

If I lift Speedys shell for him, with two fingers each side giving him a bit of help, he can walk with all legs moving. He just doesn’t seem to have the strength to lift himself on his own

This is why I am thinking a feeding tube would be beneficial. You can get nutrition and medications into the tortoise through the tube without stressing him by forcing his mouth open and sticking a tube down his throat through the mouth or jeopardizing his health by having him accidentally inhale some of the mixture(s) going in through the mouth.

 

[zovick]

If I lift Speedys shell for him, with two fingers each side giving him a bit of help, he can walk with all legs moving. He just doesn’t seem to have the strength to lift himself on his own

You might mention to the vet that a very well-experienced tortoise keeper (62+ years) has mentioned to you that a feeding tube placement might be beneficial and less stressful for all concerned (including the tortoise) and see what his opinion is.

You might also mention that I recommended checking for cryptosporidium and amoebiasis via swabbing the cloaca (if no fecal matter is obtainable) because the symptoms of vomiting and whitish mucousy stool suggest that one or both of those things may be at play.

 

[Roxanneizded]

I realize that, but the animal will go downhill if it doesn't eat soon, PLUS depending upon what is determined Tuesday, you or your vet may need to give the tortoise more medications than just Panacur. If you can afford multiple vet appointments to have him medicate the tortoise as often as needed, that's up to you.

By the way, how did your vet administer the Panacur?

He is not going to go downhill soon. I know the veterinarian will take the appropriate actions on Tuesday. He has to heal his GI tract first. The owner is using a product that has some nutritional value including some kind of simple sugar in it.

 

[Speedy101]

You might mention to the vet that a very well-experienced tortoise keeper (62+ years) has mentioned to you that a feeding tube placement might be beneficial and less stressful for all concerned (including the tortoise).

Okay I will thanks.Like I said last time he managed to scrape a bit of dried poo from Speedys cloaca and could see worm eggs in it. How will a cloacal swab properly identify the parasite if I have no stool sample? Thank you.