Tortoise Choice

[chosen2030]

I live in Arizona and would like to get a smaller tortoise that could live outside most of the year, friendly, and is active most of the year (doesn't or minimally hibernates/estivates/brumates). Any suggestions? I have been considering Russian, Hermann's, Greek or Chaco/Argentine.

 

[Itort]

I believe all four of these hibernate/estivate/brumate. Any tort that doesn't would be tropical and that would entall some indoor time or a heated hide.

 

[EriNichole]

From what I have read (don't bash me if I am mistaken, someone please feel free to correct me) but the leopard tortoises don't hibernate. Though get somewhat big (up to 2ft I think)according to all of the differernt webste I've perused. You may want to consider one of those if the hibernation thing is a big issue for you...
That's what I've got my heart set on. Just read the post "DELIMA!....) yup that's all Me! I get to pick em out tomroow, YAYE!

 

[Crazy1]

I live in Arizona and would like to get a smaller tortoise that could live outside most of the year, friendly, and is active most of the year (doesn't or minimally hibernates/estivates/brumates). Any suggestions? I have been considering Russian, Hermann's, Greek or Chaco/Argentine.

chosen2030, first welcome to the forum. Have you considered your natural Arizona Desert tortoise? They may get a little bigger than a Russian and will hibernate but they are native to your area and therefore would do well.
Most of the Torts you mentioned above do hibernate. Is there a particular reason you don't want them hibernating? And what do you mean by active most of the year?

PYGY, there are some torts that don't hibernate including a Greek subspecies I believe.

 

[Yvonne G]

I live in Arizona and would like to get a smaller tortoise that could live outside most of the year, friendly, and is active most of the year (doesn't or minimally hibernates/estivates/brumates). Any suggestions? I have been considering Russian, Hermann's, Greek or Chaco/Argentine.

If your weather gets down below 40 degrees in the winter time, there isn't a tortoise alive that would stay active. They need the sun to keep them active. However, if you provide heat for them, rather than letting nature take its course, you can keep any tortoise active during the winter. I think you would have a hard time finding any Chaco tortoises. They are very scarce in captivity and I never see them for sale. Russians are very personable and a great first tortoise. However, they do hibernate, so you would have to provide them with an artificial sun to fool them into thinking it really isn't winter, afterall!

Yvonne

 

[chosen2030]

From what I have read (don't bash me if I am mistaken, someone please feel free to correct me) but the leopard tortoises don't hibernate. Though get somewhat big (up to 2ft I think)according to all of the differernt webste I've perused. You may want to consider one of those if the hibernation thing is a big issue for you...
That's what I've got my heart set on. Just read the post "DELIMA!....) yup that's all Me! I get to pick em out tomroow, YAYE!

Leopards and Sulcatas don't hibernate, but get much too big (in case it does get cold and they have to come in side) and live way too long (don't want to worry about who will care for them when I die).

 

[chosen2030]

I live in Arizona and would like to get a smaller tortoise that could live outside most of the year, friendly, and is active most of the year (doesn't or minimally hibernates/estivates/brumates). Any suggestions? I have been considering Russian, Hermann's, Greek or Chaco/Argentine.

chosen2030, first welcome to the forum. Have you considered your natural Arizona Desert tortoise? They may get a little bigger than a Russian and will hibernate but they are native to your area and therefore would do well.
Most of the Torts you mentioned above do hibernate. Is there a particular reason you don't want them hibernating? And what do you mean by active most of the year?

What I mean is that the joy of any hobbyist/pet owner is being able to interact or observe their animals. Looking at the top of a shell in its den isn't very interesting.

PYGY, there are some torts that don't hibernate including a Greek subspecies I believe.

Can you find out what subspecies that might be please?

 

[chosen2030]

I live in Arizona and would like to get a smaller tortoise that could live outside most of the year, friendly, and is active most of the year (doesn't or minimally hibernates/estivates/brumates). Any suggestions? I have been considering Russian, Hermann's, Greek or Chaco/Argentine.

If your weather gets down below 40 degrees in the winter time, there isn't a tortoise alive that would stay active. They need the sun to keep them active. However, if you provide heat for them, rather than letting nature take its course, you can keep any tortoise active during the winter. I think you would have a hard time finding any Chaco tortoises. They are very scarce in captivity and I never see them for sale. Russians are very personable and a great first tortoise. However, they do hibernate, so you would have to provide them with an artificial sun to fool them into thinking it really isn't winter, afterall!

Yvonne

The temperature in AZ rarely if ever get that cold. Here in the valley of the sun, I worry more about it getting too hot (it gets up to 115 Farenheit during the summer, but its a dry heat, very low humidity)

 

[Jentortmom]

Being from AZ myself, I do know the winter temps can get pretty chilly in the evenings. The only way any tort would stay active is if you brought them in during the winter. Russians will be less active here along with most, they will hide from the summer heat and the cool winters. My russians are under for 6-8 months a year. You could adopt a DT from PHS but they will hibernate in the winter.

 

[Crazy1]

Leopards and Sulcatas don't hibernate, but get much too big (in case it does get cold and they have to come in side) and live way too long (don't want to worry about who will care for them when I die).

Chosen2030, any tort you get will have the chance to more than likely out live you. Most live about 75-100 years if properly taken care of. If you are concerned about them living too long or do not have the ability to give them a proper habitat, I suggest another animal as a pet. Each of us chooses our pets for different reasons. Most domesticated pets fit into our lifestyles. It seems torts are a little different we fit into theirs. We set up their habitats to suite them. We actually try and mimic their natural habitats to make them happy, safe and secure. I am not trying to discourage you but, these are long living animals with special needs. I would strongly suggest you search the web and read everything you can about Greeks, Russians and Hermanns. If these are the species you are thinking about getting. Please do your research before you acquire your tort to give it the best care you can. Oh yes and something a lot of people do not think about do you have a Reptile vet near you, one that specializes in Torts and the specific species you may want?.
Here are a few sites to start with;
http://www.chelonia.org/testudo_gallery.htm
http://www.chelonia.org/
http://www.tortoise.org/archives/herman.html
http://www.russiantortoise.org/
http://www.phoenixherp.com/content/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=61&Itemid=93

 

[ZippyButter]

Leopards and Sulcatas don't hibernate, but get much too big (in case it does get cold and they have to come in side) and live way too long (don't want to worry about who will care for them when I die).

Chosen2030, any tort you get will have the chance to more than likely out live you. Most live about 75-100 years if properly taken care of. If you are concerned about them living too long or do not have the ability to give them a proper habitat, I suggest another animal as a pet. Each of us chooses our pets for different reasons. Most domesticated pets fit into our lifestyles. It seems torts are a little different we fit into theirs. We set up their habitats to suite them. We actually try and mimic their natural habitats to make them happy, safe and secure. I am not trying to discourage you but, these are long living animals with special needs. I would strongly suggest you search the web and read everything you can about Greeks, Russians and Hermanns. If these are the species you are thinking about getting. Please do your research before you acquire your tort to give it the best care you can. Oh yes and something a lot of people do not think about do you have a Reptile vet near you, one that specializes in Torts and the specific species you may want?.
Here are a few sites to start with;
http://www.chelonia.org/testudo_gallery.htm
http://www.chelonia.org/
http://www.tortoise.org/archives/herman.html
http://www.russiantortoise.org/
http://www.phoenixherp.com/content/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=61&Itemid=93

I agree with you 100 percent. Also may I add, all of us should include our torts in the will in case they outlive us ( I'm sure mine will).

 

[chosen2030]

Leopards and Sulcatas don't hibernate, but get much too big (in case it does get cold and they have to come in side) and live way too long (don't want to worry about who will care for them when I die).

Chosen2030, any tort you get will have the chance to more than likely out live you. Most live about 75-100 years if properly taken care of. If you are concerned about them living too long or do not have the ability to give them a proper habitat, I suggest another animal as a pet. Each of us chooses our pets for different reasons. Most domesticated pets fit into our lifestyles. It seems torts are a little different we fit into theirs. We set up their habitats to suite them. We actually try and mimic their natural habitats to make them happy, safe and secure. I am not trying to discourage you but, these are long living animals with special needs. I would strongly suggest you search the web and read everything you can about Greeks, Russians and Hermanns. If these are the species you are thinking about getting. Please do your research before you acquire your tort to give it the best care you can. Oh yes and something a lot of people do not think about do you have a Reptile vet near you, one that specializes in Torts and the specific species you may want?.
Here are a few sites to start with;
http://www.chelonia.org/testudo_gallery.htm
http://www.chelonia.org/
http://www.tortoise.org/archives/herman.html
http://www.russiantortoise.org/
http://www.phoenixherp.com/content/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=61&Itemid=93

I've been to everyone of those sites already and have done my research, but I post the question here because I would like feedback from owners.I don't believe I said anything about not being able to provide the proper habitat, but just as you said we pick animals that fit our lifestyles and I was asking which tortoise most closely fits mine. Obviously sacrifices will be made for any tortoise or any pet for that matter. So what I'm hearing is basically they are all the same? None of the breeds I mentioned handle the heat better, hibernate less than the others or interact better with people? I would like info that isn't already common sense or general tortoise advocacy.

 

[chosen2030]

Leopards and Sulcatas don't hibernate, but get much too big (in case it does get cold and they have to come in side) and live way too long (don't want to worry about who will care for them when I die).

Chosen2030, any tort you get will have the chance to more than likely out live you. Most live about 75-100 years if properly taken care of. If you are concerned about them living too long or do not have the ability to give them a proper habitat, I suggest another animal as a pet. Each of us chooses our pets for different reasons. Most domesticated pets fit into our lifestyles. It seems torts are a little different we fit into theirs. We set up their habitats to suite them. We actually try and mimic their natural habitats to make them happy, safe and secure. I am not trying to discourage you but, these are long living animals with special needs. I would strongly suggest you search the web and read everything you can about Greeks, Russians and Hermanns. If these are the species you are thinking about getting. Please do your research before you acquire your tort to give it the best care you can. Oh yes and something a lot of people do not think about do you have a Reptile vet near you, one that specializes in Torts and the specific species you may want?.
Here are a few sites to start with;
http://www.chelonia.org/testudo_gallery.htm
http://www.chelonia.org/
http://www.tortoise.org/archives/herman.html
http://www.russiantortoise.org/
http://www.phoenixherp.com/content/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=61&Itemid=93

I agree with you 100 percent. Also may I add, all of us should include our torts in the will in case they outlive us ( I'm sure mine will).

So they all have the exact same lifespan?

 

[Itort]

Leopards and Sulcatas don't hibernate, but get much too big (in case it does get cold and they have to come in side) and live way too long (don't want to worry about who will care for them when I die).

Chosen2030, any tort you get will have the chance to more than likely out live you. Most live about 75-100 years if properly taken care of. If you are concerned about them living too long or do not have the ability to give them a proper habitat, I suggest another animal as a pet. Each of us chooses our pets for different reasons. Most domesticated pets fit into our lifestyles. It seems torts are a little different we fit into theirs. We set up their habitats to suite them. We actually try and mimic their natural habitats to make them happy, safe and secure. I am not trying to discourage you but, these are long living animals with special needs. I would strongly suggest you search the web and read everything you can about Greeks, Russians and Hermanns. If these are the species you are thinking about getting. Please do your research before you acquire your tort to give it the best care you can. Oh yes and something a lot of people do not think about do you have a Reptile vet near you, one that specializes in Torts and the specific species you may want?.
Here are a few sites to start with;
http://www.chelonia.org/testudo_gallery.htm
http://www.chelonia.org/
http://www.tortoise.org/archives/herman.html
http://www.russiantortoise.org/
http://www.phoenixherp.com/content/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=61&Itemid=93

I've been to everyone of those sites already and have done my research, but I post the question here because I would like feedback from owners.I don't believe I said anything about not being able to provide the proper habitat, but just as you said we pick animals that fit our lifestyles and I was asking which tortoise most closely fits mine. Obviously sacrifices will be made for any tortoise or any pet for that matter. So what I'm hearing is basically they are all the same? None of the breeds I mentioned handle the heat better, hibernate less than the others or interact better with people? I would like info that isn't already common sense or general tortoise advocacy.

Chosen2030, we answer questions assuming a person is completely new to this crazy avocation and try to establish a starting point. It is good you have done your homework but you asked about a temperate climate tort that doesn't hibernate and is small. You are forunitate to live in climate where it is possible to keep a tort out for a large portion of the year. I do suggest you look into adopting a DT (wish I could). The portion of the year it is hibernating can be used for improving it's habitat (i.e. planting food sources and giving them arunning start). As far as life span, yes they all will live 75 to 100 years with proper care which is one of their attractions and liabilities.

 

[Jacqui]

So what I'm hearing is basically they are all the same? None of the breeds I mentioned handle the heat better, hibernate less than the others or interact better with people? I would like info that isn't already common sense or general tortoise advocacy.

Yeah, basically all torts are about the same. Some may handle hot temps or cold temps better then other's but overall, it's not by much. They get too hot, they will try to burrow under to escape that extreme. They get too cold, they try to hibernate. It's simple survival techniques. You can do things to cause them to not get so hot or start thinking it's winter time, as Yvonne mentioned at the start.

Folks mentioned the DTs because they are wonderful animals, you live in the right location, and so many desperately need homes. It is always so much easier to go with a native to your area. Please do check them out closely before you rule them out.

Of the ones your mentioned like Yvonne said, the Chaco will be the hardest to locate. The Russian, Hermann's, Greek are all going to be much easier to find for sale, with the Russian most likely the easiest. Personalities are pretty close and can be very individual.

Russians tend to be the one overall most suggested as a first time tortoise by most folks. They are easy to find, pretty cheap, normally little pigs so getting them to eat is easy, captive breeds are available (if that is a must for you), they stay fairly small, and have one of the most wonderful personalities.

Folks with the Greeks and Hermanns will tell you their torts are great starting torts too, and they are right. Can be a bit harder to find is maybe where they have their biggest drawbacks, but even that is not much of one.

I suggest when thinking of animals basically so close to the same qualities to (especially since you live in AZ where there are quite a few tort folks) go to a local tort club meeting or find folks who have these species. Check them out in person. Books and posts are great, but actually seeing and being around them is the best way to do the finial judging. Usually at that point one type will just feel a little more special to you.

 

[Crazy1]

Chosen2030, I am sorry if I gave you the impression you could not provide what you’re chosen tort needs, that was not my intention. I am tickled pink that you are doing the research prior to getting your tort. Of those they are pretty close, and have pretty much the same basic needs as far as temps, humidity, hibernation etc. Of those, Russians seem to be the most people friendly right off the bat. I own Greeks and they seem to take a while to warm up to people. I also foster California DT as you can see in my signature. They are of course a little bigger, wt at adult is about tops 15 lbs. They are not a huge tort and so, so many need homes. But I do understand wanting a smaller tort. If you plan to house your tort inside during the winter months you can keep them from hibernating by providing them with heat and light and simulating summer basically. There are a lot of owners that do this as they prefer not to hibernate their torts. There are (like most things pertaining to tort) lots of conflicting info and feelings about this. I personally feel it is a personal choice for the owner, as long as it is not hurting the tort.
Jacqui had a wonderful suggestion, to go and view the torts and talk with breeders first. I know there are some wonderful folk who live in AZ.(were not exactly sure) that do breed torts and turtles. I know when I was trying to decide what type of tort I was going to get I stumbled on the two Original Greeks I have and it was Love at first site. Please if you have more specific questions don't hesitate to ask (I want to make sure my comments did not put you off nor make you feel unwelcome).

 

[chosen2030]

I personally like to interact with my pets as much as they would tolerate. From what I have read, Russians and Hermann's seem to be most tolerant of human contact even accepting hand feeding at times. True? As to the AZ DT, how do they handle interaction? I don't want to cause animals any undue stress.

 

[Crazy1]

I personally like to interact with my pets as much as they would tolerate. From what I have read, Russians and Hermann's seem to be most tolerant of human contact even accepting hand feeding at times. True? As to the AZ DT, how do they handle interaction? I don't want to cause animals any undue stress.

All my torts tolerate human contact fine. Some just take a little longer than others. Some actually seem to like me more than others. I am not sure of the AZ DT but I figure they are similar to the CA DT. Mine are like little ducklings (or puppies) when I go outside and talk with them they come running looking to see if I have something good for them. They like getting their heads rubbed and the back of their shells scratched. If I get into their pen they often follow me like three little ducks in a row one right after the other. If I sit on the side of the pen and just talk with them they will often just come over and sit and look at me as if they understand what I am saying. I received these torts about 3 weeks before hibernation last winter. Since the day I received them they were people friendly. These are older torts about 8 and 13 lbs. males that were previously owned.
My Greeks are the same way, they come when I talk with them. I am able to hand feed them but this took time and gaining their trust. I hand feed all my Greeks and DT.
The Russians I have fostered I did not have long but they seemed to be very personable.
Hopefully Russian and Hermann owners will respond.

 

[Jacqui]

I have only had the one DT and now the 10 Russians.

Elmer, the DT, was an old timer having outlived two sets of human caretakers. He was a sweet old man who loved to be hand fed and enjoyed being used when I did public educational displays/talks.

Of the Russians, they all come running when they see a human. They think of us as the "gods of food" I think. I think the longest it took for any of them to become that way, was maybe two weeks. This was an older WC female. Now she is usually the first to come running.

Just about any tort becomes friendly with time. The four species we are talking about seem to all be close to each other in normal temperament. Any of them will make a fine tortoise for you.

Me, if I had my choice, I would go with the DT. Then again is it entirely because of how much Elmer meant to me or is part of it, the fact I most likely can never have such a pleasure again? Another big part may be because I know how many are searching for homes. Bad thing is, the DT is a bit larger then you seem to want.

 

[chosen2030]

I am starting to consider a Desert Tortoise now that I have gotten such good feedback about them from you kind folks. The thing is, although my yard is plenty large, my house is not. I can not dedicate an entire room to a tortoise table/enclosure during the winter on its full size. What supplies/preparations are necessary so a DT can safely hibernate or escape the heat outside? How old would a DT before its safe to be housed outside? Finally, although not recently, we have occasionally had to deal with pests in our yard (fire ants, ticks) and want to know what is the best was to deal with them without making the vegetation inedible for the tortoise, or how long before its safe?