The Reptile Community tear's itself apart

Pearly

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Jul 14, 2015
Messages
5,287
Location (City and/or State)
Central Texas, Austin area
Great topic! I have notice that as well. Few years ago I joined aquatic forum to help me learn how to care for my children's new fish (unexpected birthday gift from their friends), and it too wasemotionally charged just like the reptile community. I think that wherever there is emotion attached this maybe expected to take place, and people feel very emotional about their pets and often our opinions are very strong especially when it comes to an animal wellbeing and safety.
 

mike taylor

Well-Known Member
10 Year Member!
Platinum Tortoise Club
Joined
Oct 28, 2012
Messages
13,461
People need to understand just because it works for one on the other side of the country doesn't mean it will work for all . I take information from all over and put my spin on it .
 

Merrick

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Sep 4, 2014
Messages
974
Location (City and/or State)
South Florida
People need to understand just because it works for one on the other side of the country doesn't mean it will work for all . I take information from all over and put my spin on it .
Underground reptiles has that same philosophy they said so in their tegu care video. I also happen to agree
 

naturalman91

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2014
Messages
2,015
Location (City and/or State)
Medford Oregon
People need to understand just because it works for one on the other side of the country doesn't mean it will work for all . I take information from all over and put my spin on it .

i'm constantly telling people this i had someone telling me recently i shouldnt use glass in my enclosures builds unless it was this one very specific brand other wise it would break i just tried telling the person any glass will break if your not careful they're response was "not this stuff i've used it for so long and have never had a problem"
 
M

Maggie Cummings

Guest
I think it's more than just what works on one side of the country. I think it's as individual as what works for me, may not work for you. Then when you add Mike's side of the country comment it gets worse. I live in rain, 7 months out of the year, what works for me here, make not work for Team Gomberg in the same state, but not as much rain. Seriously wouldn't work for Mike, who actually gets sun, like from the sky, a strange happening in Oregon...Plus, I'm damned lazy, so I do things to make it easier on myself.
I always enjoy the keepers who brag "I have been doing things the same way for years", well, that doesn't make it right, especially as fast as tortoise keeping is changing now.
David, wait until that guys glass does break and cuts an animal, he'll change his tune fast enuf
 

naturalman91

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2014
Messages
2,015
Location (City and/or State)
Medford Oregon
I think it's more than just what works on one side of the country. I think it's as individual as what works for me, may not work for you. Then when you add Mike's side of the country comment it gets worse. I live in rain, 7 months out of the year, what works for me here, make not work for Team Gomberg in the same state, but not as much rain. Seriously wouldn't work for Mike, who actually gets sun, like from the sky, a strange happening in Oregon...Plus, I'm damned lazy, so I do things to make it easier on myself.
I always enjoy the keepers who brag "I have been doing things the same way for years", well, that doesn't make it right, especially as fast as tortoise keeping is changing now.
David, wait until that guys glass does break and cuts an animal, he'll change his tune fast enuf

that's exactly what i was thinking to he gave me the impression he wasn't very careful with it.

and Team Gomberg and i are in the same town in oregon lol we're all 3 here! :p
 

Tom

The Dog Trainer
10 Year Member!
Platinum Tortoise Club
Joined
Jan 9, 2010
Messages
63,264
Location (City and/or State)
Southern California
Right on. Pulling something like that out of your mailbox as opposed to pulling it up on a computer screen is so much more satisfying to me. Weird, I suppose, to most.....

That is because we are old...
 

Tom

The Dog Trainer
10 Year Member!
Platinum Tortoise Club
Joined
Jan 9, 2010
Messages
63,264
Location (City and/or State)
Southern California
I just read about some test or something, I can't find it now, and of course I can't remember details, but I know somebody else here saw it, about too much heat causing pyramiding.???

They raised some baby sulcatas in 30% humidity. The ones with more heat grew faster and there fore demonstrated more pyramiding. The cooler group grew slower and demonstrated the expected slower pyramiding.

If we accept my assertion that "Pyramiding is caused by growth in conditions that are too dry", then faster growth will result is faster pyramiding while slower growth will result in slower pyramiding. The study proves my point, but some want to take it to mean that colder temps and slow growth are somehow good. It doesn't mean that at all. It just means that you have slower growing pyramided tortoises at lower temps compared to someone with better temps who has faster growing pyramided tortoises. My assertion is that we should strive for smooth tortoises regardless of the speed with which they grow. Dryness is the problem, not temperature.
 

naturalman91

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2014
Messages
2,015
Location (City and/or State)
Medford Oregon
They raised some baby sulcatas in 30% humidity. The ones with more heat grew faster and there fore demonstrated more pyramiding. The cooler group grew slower and demonstrated the expected slower pyramiding.

If we accept my assertion that "Pyramiding is caused by growth in conditions that are too dry", then faster growth will result is faster pyramiding while slower growth will result in slower pyramiding. The study proves my point, but some want to take it to mean that colder temps and slow growth are somehow good. It doesn't mean that at all. It just means that you have slower growing pyramided tortoises at lower temps compared to someone with better temps who has faster growing pyramided tortoises. My assertion is that we should strive for smooth tortoises regardless of the speed with which they grow. Dryness is the problem, not temperature.

i read this to but i cant recall was there any proof to what they were saying? i remember someone on the topic essentially trying to tell us we were all raising our torts wrong and it caused some offense to some
 
M

Maggie Cummings

Guest
Tom told me just what I really was asking about. You know we are always reading something new and different about raising smooth Sulcata. I don't believe anything I read on-line, that's why I posed my question here, to get expert opinions, just like I got.
I worry about the heat, and that's what that article talked about. This morning it was 120 degrees in with my 2 month old foster. I HATE CHE's and I think I'm going to black bulbs for her. Even a timer turning the CHE on and off hasn't worked. There are mornings that I am surprised she's not crisp. And she's just smooth as hell, and I sure don't want to screw that up.
 
M

Maggie Cummings

Guest
that's exactly what i was thinking to he gave me the impression he wasn't very careful with it.

and Team Gomberg and i are in the same town in oregon lol we're all 3 here! :p

@Team Gomberg I am dying to meet Heather. Looks like a road trip for burgers or something for the 3 of us. I think we should all meet at lunch. I love driving and you guys are maybe an hour and some for me. It's only 200 miles. Think about it. I LOVE the idea, you home during the week at all?
 
M

Maggie Cummings

Guest
I am dying to meet Heather. Looks like a road trip for burgers or something for the 3 of us. I think we should all meet at lunch. I love driving and you guys are maybe an hour and some for me. It's only 200 miles. Think about it. I LOVE the idea, you home during the week at all?

OMG! Even I can't do 200 miles in one hour hahaha I hit the wrong key... about 2 hours
 

naturalman91

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2014
Messages
2,015
Location (City and/or State)
Medford Oregon
I am dying to meet Heather. Looks like a road trip for burgers or something for the 3 of us. I think we should all meet at lunch. I love driving and you guys are maybe an hour and some for me. It's only 200 miles. Think about it. I LOVE the idea, you home during the week at all?

yeah most of the time im home during the week i'm out of town right now tho in Louisiana for my brother's wedding. Then going to Arkansas to see some more family and friends i grew up with. but i like that idea your in Corvallis right?

Tom told me just what I really was asking about. You know we are always reading something new and different about raising smooth Sulcata. I don't believe anything I read on-line, that's why I posed my question here, to get expert opinions, just like I got.
I worry about the heat, and that's what that article talked about. This morning it was 120 degrees in with my 2 month old foster. I HATE CHE's and I think I'm going to black bulbs for her. Even a timer turning the CHE on and off hasn't worked. There are mornings that I am surprised she's not crisp. And she's just smooth as hell, and I sure don't want to screw that up.

do you have a Thermostat maggie? my enclosure could easily reach 100+ without one
 
M

Maggie Cummings

Guest
No, I thought using a timer to turn it on and off all night would work. I was wrong
 

naturalman91

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2014
Messages
2,015
Location (City and/or State)
Medford Oregon
No, I thought using a timer to turn it on and off all night would work. I was wrong

would you need a lot of thermostat's if you were to get some? and are you sure you didn't have the switch on the timer flipped to bypass the timer and just give straight power? my timer has a switch like that when flipped it will alway's put out power to it.
 
M

Maggie Cummings

Guest
If I'm chuckling at you forgive me. So I went and counted. I have 11 habitats in the house, all with an MVB and a black light bulb for night time heat. That's some 22 lights, most on timers. Then I have the tort shed, it's got 4 lights on timers, and a pig blanket on a rheostat. Most of the MVB are on timers, so yeah, I know about the switch. giggle. This ain't my first rodeo. I 'think' I just need the one thermostat you told me about for the baby's CHE. I don't like or approve of CHE. I've had 2 animals fried by one. Just f'ing crisp. And my sis has used black light bulbs for 40 years. So do I. Yes, I realize that doesn't make it right, but my sis and I have never seen or heard of any damage from them. We've been told tortoises can't see that spectrum of light. Tom disapproves of them. He says they CAN see the light and (I think) he said it disturbs their sleep. When I check on them during the night some are asleep under the bulbs using the heat, the Russian stays away from it, then I remembered they don't care for it warm at night. So she's more comfortable now that I turn it off at night. Anyway the last 2 nights I've used a black light bulb (BLB from now on), on the baby and her bin stayed right between 80 and 85. Now that's exactly what I want. So, frankly, I think the blb will work better for me.
I am trying like hell to do follow Tom's closed chamber dictate. I've mostly raised Gopherus agassizii, never used a closed chamber and I've head started several hundred babies or close to it over the years (or so it seems). But this time I'm fostering that smooth Sulcata, well, 2 actually, so for the first time in my tortoise keeping I am really trying to stay as close to Tom's chambers as I can. Fact, I made a 2 chamber habitat with a hot bright side and a hot humid side, tube was between them. Both have lids. Thought I was making a nice fancy place for her to live. But she spent most of her time in the darn 70 degree tube. Now she's contained on the really humid side and she's eating better and being more active.
One time I had about 20 (give or take)desert babies and they were a lot less trouble than this one little Sulcata. The 2 year old Sulcata, Daisy Mae, now lives in Bob's shed, I mean the tort shed, because she's a horrible brat, I can see Bob's mischievous energy floating around her. Because she couldn't stand being contained in a stock tank, she would push a heavy rock over to the side, climb on the rock, fight her way up the side and over onto the floor. Never saw anything like it, so she's living in the 20'X12' tort shed, and seems happy as can be. She's growing like a weed. Lots of personality, but very shy. So I'm working on it.
Oh, jeez, I've been just going on haven't I? Sorry adios....
 

Yvonne G

Old Timer
TFO Admin
10 Year Member!
Platinum Tortoise Club
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
93,388
Location (City and/or State)
Clovis, CA
If I'm chuckling at you forgive me. So I went and counted. I have 11 habitats in the house, all with an MVB and a black light bulb for night time heat. That's some 22 lights, most on timers. Then I have the tort shed, it's got 4 lights on timers, and a pig blanket on a rheostat. Most of the MVB are on timers, so yeah, I know about the switch. giggle. This ain't my first rodeo. I 'think' I just need the one thermostat you told me about for the baby's CHE. I don't like or approve of CHE. I've had 2 animals fried by one. Just f'ing crisp. And my sis has used black light bulbs for 40 years. So do I. Yes, I realize that doesn't make it right, but my sis and I have never seen or heard of any damage from them. We've been told tortoises can't see that spectrum of light. Tom disapproves of them. He says they CAN see the light and (I think) he said it disturbs their sleep. When I check on them during the night some are asleep under the bulbs using the heat, the Russian stays away from it, then I remembered they don't care for it warm at night. So she's more comfortable now that I turn it off at night. Anyway the last 2 nights I've used a black light bulb (BLB from now on), on the baby and her bin stayed right between 80 and 85. Now that's exactly what I want. So, frankly, I think the blb will work better for me.
I am trying like hell to do follow Tom's closed chamber dictate. I've mostly raised Gopherus agassizii, never used a closed chamber and I've head started several hundred babies or close to it over the years (or so it seems). But this time I'm fostering that smooth Sulcata, well, 2 actually, so for the first time in my tortoise keeping I am really trying to stay as close to Tom's chambers as I can. Fact, I made a 2 chamber habitat with a hot bright side and a hot humid side, tube was between them. Both have lids. Thought I was making a nice fancy place for her to live. But she spent most of her time in the darn 70 degree tube. Now she's contained on the really humid side and she's eating better and being more active.
One time I had about 20 (give or take)desert babies and they were a lot less trouble than this one little Sulcata. The 2 year old Sulcata, Daisy Mae, now lives in Bob's shed, I mean the tort shed, because she's a horrible brat, I can see Bob's mischievous energy floating around her. Because she couldn't stand being contained in a stock tank, she would push a heavy rock over to the side, climb on the rock, fight her way up the side and over onto the floor. Never saw anything like it, so she's living in the 20'X12' tort shed, and seems happy as can be. She's growing like a weed. Lots of personality, but very shy. So I'm working on it.
Oh, jeez, I've been just going on haven't I? Sorry adios....

I take my dog, Misty, out two or three times during the night to pee. It is NEVER totally dark outside at night (I live in the country with no lights). Even when the moon is just a sliver, there is some light at night. A black light is just like moon light. All of my tortoises are sleeping at night. None of them comes out and says, "Hm-m-m ... that lighting makes my substrate look like something I want to eat!" No, they sleep at night, they don't come out and eat or wander.
 

Yvonne G

Old Timer
TFO Admin
10 Year Member!
Platinum Tortoise Club
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
93,388
Location (City and/or State)
Clovis, CA
O-o-ops! Sorry - I didn't realize the subject category. Sorry for taking it off topic.
 
M

Maggie Cummings

Guest
She drinks too much water. She'd have to hold it all night if she were mine, I sleep really soundly. You didn't take it off topic. I think David and I did, it just morphed into this temp thing and thermostat. And it looks like I thought I was on the chat, I apologize also....
 

New Posts

Top