THE ECONOMY

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ALDABRAMAN

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Does anyone feel the economy is improving? I think it is still declining and will continue to decline for a while. Just curious as to other opinions on this issue.
 

SILVERSTAR

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Idont feel any improvements,matter fact everyone i know jus about is going thru hard times,i heard the depression rate is high this time of year also,im sensing alotta that.AND now there animals dying everywhere even happned in ponoma county cali,hundreds of birds die.
 

jwhite

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I don't see much improvement here I lost my construction job 2 years ago and instead of waiting to see if it would come back i decided to go back to school. I have friends that are still in the construction field and most of them were lucky to get 700 hours worth of work last year. I ended up taking a job that pays less than what i was paying for my health care when i was working construction and it took me two months to find that one.

Jon
 

bettinge

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The stock market is up!
I have more friends loosing their jobs!
House prices are still falling in many areas!
My company is up...than down.....than up again!
Feds, states, and local government are racking up big debt for our kids and grand kids to deal with!

Lots of conflicting data, but I do expect things to get worse before they get better! I wish Obama made jobs a prority when he came into office two years ago, as I think we would be in a better spot now.
 

Angi

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No improvement. I have friends that have lost their homes. There are repos everywhere. My brother in law has always made a good living as a GM of a car dealership things have been bad for him, then he got laid off right before C-Mas. My husband is a CFO for an elecrical contractor and he is worried about his job. This is a very stressful time.
 

Tom

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It still looks the same from where I'm sitting, but due to the current administrations policies and all the new "laws" I see it getting much much worse in the not too distant future.
 

zzzdanz

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I think it's going to get worse before it get's any better.I worked construction for 20+ yrs. and have seen it good and bad but nothing like this.Most of the guys I know have called it quits,or are working a few hrs. here and there for 1/4 of the money.

There's some taking advantage of the economy and hiring guys for $12hr who usually make $35+.You'll always have people willing to work for less,and power to them.With the cost of insurance,gas,tools,etc. at $12 hr. (if you can even find that) there ain't enough hrs. in a week to make a profit.

I always get a kick out of the "official" reports of unemployment dropping.It's not dropping,peoples benefits are running out so that's less people collecting and the % of unemployed drops. or people are taking crap jobs just to eat.All the crap low paying jobs in the world won't put any money into the economy.

And home values are down the toilet.They have mine almost 100k less than what I paid for it,but my property tax is going up? I bought this house 6 or 7 yrs. ago and the seller had a new septic installed,bumping the price up almost 40k...Now the town is putting in town sewer which you pay for it now,or throw that cost on your taxes raising them even more for the next 7yrs..I dont need town sewer but I'll be paying for it?.I have a house in Canada also..Tempting to just pack up and walk away and go breed some Canadian torts.
 

Shelly

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Tom said:
It still looks the same from where I'm sitting, but due to the current administrations policies and all the new "laws" I see it getting much much worse in the not too distant future.

01-george-w-bush-thanks-for-blaming-it-on-the-black-guy-e1284821996594.jpg
 

B K

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Shelly said:
Tom said:
It still looks the same from where I'm sitting, but due to the current administrations policies and all the new "laws" I see it getting much much worse in the not too distant future.

01-george-w-bush-thanks-for-blaming-it-on-the-black-guy-e1284821996594.jpg

WOW!
 

ChiKat

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Shelly- that picture made me burst out laughing and I don't know if it's from shock or what :p
 

eliscott

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SILVERSTAR said:
Idont feel any improvements,matter fact everyone i know jus about is going thru hard times,i heard the depression rate is high this time of year also,im sensing alotta that.AND now there animals dying everywhere even happned in ponoma county cali,hundreds of birds die.

huh. I've been following the bird deaths pretty closely, but I haven't heard of any happening in ponoma county, California. Actually...i don't even know where that is! Can you provide a link to a map or an article? Kinda sad when the birds commit suicide over the economy before humans do. You know what they say, the animals always know first. Of course when you actually take a look at the data these events are very common, have been tracked since the 1970s, and are not indicative of the current socioeconomic state of our county.

And as your sig says, "ITS NOT THE SMARTEST OR STRONGEST SPECIES THAT SURVIVES BUT THE SPECIES MOST ADAPTABLE TO CHANGE-CHARLES DARWIN." I guess you could frame this in the context of an evolutionary jump in humanity from government reliance to self reliance as our highly organized and over-engineered social systems break down when subjected to greed-influenced internal deregulation, and extreme self-interest without social conscience. Where we are now, only the clever and articulate will succeed and the old guard, especially those in the development/construction industry (including finance and banking) and traditional manufacturing, will fall as our economy shifts. If you guys haven't gotten a job yet, I wouldn't blame it on the economy. I would blame it on a lack of ingenuity and adaptability. It happened to the dinosaurs.
 

zzzdanz

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If you guys haven't gotten a job yet, I wouldn't blame it on the economy. I would blame it on a lack of ingenuity and adaptability. It happened to the dinosaurs.


What are ya trying to say?
 

dmmj

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shelli hates everything but the left so his response was not surprising. I guess if you got a job you may think things are different if you are still looking things have not improved. I wonder how peple like aldabman and tortoise supply tyler are feeling the effect, tortoises and turtles are kinda a luxury item when times are good. It would be nice if the current administration would suffer with us through the hard times, instead of mutli million dollar luxury vacations every other month. I can say one thing my cousin repos cars, and for him at least business is booming.

And for the record I don't blame the "black" guy I blame his policies.
 

ALDABRAMAN

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dmmj said:
shelli hates everything but the left so his response was not surprising. I guess if you got a job you may think things are different if you are still looking things have not improved. I wonder how peple like aldabman and tortoise supply tyler are feeling the effect, tortoises and turtles are kinda a luxury item when times are good. It would be nice if the current administration would suffer with us through the hard times, instead of mutli million dollar luxury vacations every other month. I can say one thing my cousin repos cars, and for him at least business is booming.

And for the record I don't blame the "black" guy I blame his policies.



As far as our hatchlings, not at all. We have a strong cliant base, usually we can not fill all the orders each year.
 

eliscott

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dmmj said:
And for the record I don't blame the "black" guy I blame his policies.

Which policies? The TARP, enacted by Bush at the end of his presidency (no jobs provisions)? Healthcare reform, which is basically Bob Dole's plan from the 90's? I think if you look at the history of legislation, you'll see a recent (20-30 year) bias towards right-leaning policies; many of which spurred the current economic crisis by not having enough consumer protections against predatory lending.

Consumer protections are generally a liberal policy.

How about the Obama stimulus? Unlike Bush's stimulus, Obama's stimulus included quite a few public works projects that actually created infrastructure jobs subcontracted out to private companies and put people to work. It also included a whole slew of new SBA loans, opening up more businesses to loan qualification. It worked so well that many corporations are now swimming in profits and the stock market is cranking up daily. Of course, those corporations are hanging onto their profits, not hiring people, and not giving their workers raises. That's the current problem.

So yes, blame Obama's policies for greedy corporate heads. That's what they want you to do. They want you to write off their greed as a wise business decision in uncertain times, while the wealth gap increases between rich and poor. People work for less because they are desperate, and companies are happy to pay them less. The gap widens.

In the mean time, unemployment continues to drop, the stock market continues to rise, hiring increases incrementally each month and most economic indicators look positive. Those are the real result of Obama's policies. Unfortunately the results are slow to come because every single time there is an attempt to make progress, conservatives push back as hard as they can, just because.

But go for it, blame his policies.

zzzdanz said:
If you guys haven't gotten a job yet, I wouldn't blame it on the economy. I would blame it on a lack of ingenuity and adaptability. It happened to the dinosaurs.


What are ya trying to say?

What I'm trying to say is that a market economy - the shining star of our republic, according to most conservatives - doesn't care about who it crushes and it's up to the individual to do what they need to do to stay relevant in a changing economy.

So, before you blame anyone's policy, ask yourself what you've done to stay relevant.
 

zzzdanz

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Obama's stimulus included quite a few public works projects that actually created infrastructure jobs subcontracted out to private companies and put people to work. ......

Yup, all the big highway jobs in Ma. are subcontracted out..To a Ct. company while all the union guys in Ma. sit on the bench....but atleast that stimulus put people to work right?
 

B K

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(So, before you blame anyone's policy, ask yourself what you've done to stay relevant.)

I Voted
 

jackrat

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I'm working at the moment,but if things don't change in the near future,I will working in a foriegn country.Current policy is not allowing the industry I work in to operate, for an undetermined amount of time.The industry is waiting,losing millions every day,but they won't wait forever.Contracts are being negotiated for long term work in Israel,Brazil,Angola,and other spots worldwide.Other nations' economies will be strengthened while ours will suffer the effects.Our taxes will be paid for us, to the countries we work in.Good for me,not good for the economy.
 

eliscott

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zzzdanz said:
Obama's stimulus included quite a few public works projects that actually created infrastructure jobs subcontracted out to private companies and put people to work. ......

Yup, all the big highway jobs in Ma. are subcontracted out..To a Ct. company while all the union guys in Ma. sit on the bench....but atleast that stimulus put people to work right?

Just to bring some facts into the mix, the Obama stimulus has created about 14,300 jobs in MA, and has injected 6.7 billion dollars into the MA economy through contracts, grants, and loans - mostly grants (about 5.6 billion). The way the stimulus works for infrastructure is local authorities are awarded the money, and then those authorities subcontract the work to the contractor of their choice. Obama has no control over what company actually gets funds. If you think there's an injustice there, do something about it. Local government *is* the most accessible. The list below are the authorities that were awarded infrastructure money, and how much money. All of this, by the way, is available and easily accessible at recovery.gov.

MASSACHUSETTS, COMMONWEALTH OF $176,559,467
MASSACHUSETTS WATER POLLUTION ABATEMENT TRUST $119,115,967
MASSACHUSETTS BAY TRANSPORTATION AUTHORITY $62,569,722
ENERGY RESOURCES, MASSACHUSETTS DEPARTMENT OF $21,535,299
MASSACHUSETTS PORT AUTHORITY $15,120,888
PIONEER VALLEY TRANSIT AUTHORITY $12,834,366
MILITARY DIVISION, COMMONWEALTH OF MASSACHUSETTS $9,030,568
WORCESTER REGIONAL TRANSIT AUTHORITY $7,056,279
CHATHAM, TOWN OF $6,103,537
WELLFLEET, TOWN OF $4,800,354
CAMBRIDGE HOUSING AUTHORITY $3,694,287
CAPE COD REGIONAL TRANSIT AUTH $3,425,751
TOWN OF PROVINCETOWN $3,038,674
LOWELL REGIONAL TRANSIT AUTHORITY $2,606,161
MONTACHUSETT REGIONAL TRANSIT AUTHORITY $2,274,267
WINCHENDON, TOWN OF $1,680,552
WESTFIELD, CITY OF $1,507,849
DEPARTMENT OF ELEMENTARY AND SECONDARY EDUCATION $1,494,854
GREATER LAWRENCE FAMILY HEALTH CENTER INC $1,482,000
SOUTHEASTERN REGIONAL TRANSIT AUTHORITY $1,136,881
LYNN ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITY INC $971,425
HEALTHFIRST FAMILY CARE CENTER $959,009
MERRIMACK VALLEY REGIONAL TRANSIT AUTHORITY $859,829
BROCKTON NEIGHBORHOOD HEALTH CENTER, INC. $828,025
BERKSHIRE REGIONAL TRANSIT AUTHORITY $822,298
PIONEER VALLEY CHINESE IMMERSION CHARTER SCHOOL $800,000
BEVERLY MUNICIPAL AIRPORT $796,049
LAWRENCE, CITY OF $788,549
MEDFORD, CITY OF $759,678
BOSTON HEALTH CARE FOR THE HOMELESS PROGRAM, INC., THE $650,396
NEWTON, CITY OF $627,220
FALL RIVER, CITY OF $615,610

I didn't paste the whole list, just the first few entries. As you can see, mostly transit authorities and cities. I won't argue that local governments don't play games with money based on the connectedness of certain companies; they do. But you can't blame that on Obama. That just doesn't make logical sense. As for general allocation, check it out here. There's a mix of public and private organizations recieving money, quite a few private companies getting multi-million dollar allotments.

So in conclusion, the stimulus has created quite a few jobs in the state of MA, Obama doesn't control what municipalities do with the money they're awarded so you can't blame him for one contractor getting all of the infrastructure funds (that's a state's rights issue - another thing conservatives are generally great defenders of, unless liberals do something that reinforces state's rights), and the funding is a mix of both public and private funding.

(sarcasm follows)But, yeah, he didn't put an emphasis on jobs in this stimulus, clearly. Shoulda just done what Bush did and gave a blank check to big banks and not give a dime to private contractors or public organizations that impact most people directly.(end sarcasm)
 

zzzdanz

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I never blamed Obama for anything...A list of funds recieved shows nothing...
 
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